Evolution Disclaimer Supported

The Advocate (Baton Rouge) ^ | 12/11/02 | WILL SENTELL

[MattAMiller]

Evolution requires new genes, new functions, new abilities, increased complexity.

The examples cited in that webpage show in increase in the chromosone count. Are you suggesting that this is all junk DNA?

[Aric2000]

OK,

Let's try this again, I am obviously not making myself clear.

Chrstianity is based on the bible, the bible is a book, the book is around 1700 years old, some of the stories within that book are much older.

In the dark ages, which I blame squarely on the shoulders of the church were a time of extreme nothing. The church had power and therefore what it said went.

The church believed that the earth was the center of the universe, anyone that disagreed with them was excommunicated. If the church said that something was the way it was, then that is the way it was, end of story. Threat of eternal damnation will pretty much kill anything that would disagree.

The church wanted MORE power, so they destroyed anything and anyone that disagreed or was a threat, the crusades etc.

I do NOT say that christianisty is like that now, except for one respect.

You have fanatics that believe in the book of Genesis literally. Therefore the Theory of evolution is a threat to them. This is the SAME intellectual vacancy that existed in the dark ages. This is where it makes me a bit angry.

Other things about it make me angry as well, such as the obsession with, since I am a christian, I am right, and since you are not, you are wrong and are going to hell, but I digress.

The arguments that creationists, those that take Genesis literally, are vague, outright lies, or they twist evolutions studies into something that they are not. This also angers me.

Nothing like the Mr. Blueman with his refuted facts spouting them off over and over again. Again, he seems to think that the more he says them the more likely that they will become true.

This is the problem, those that disagree with evolution must distort it, lie about it, and make false claims against it. Create FALSE studies, that are refuted by scientists, and they are so loud and so obnoxious, that those that are less learned then most, shut their minds to the REAL facts of evolution and are suckered into doing MORONIC things like put disclaimers on science books.

Yes, the bible is unchanging, that is it's MAIN problem, it does NOT answer all the mysteries, and it cannot, because that knowledge was not available when the books were written, nor could they be answered, when the books were finally put together into the "bible".

The questions WILL be answered, and if those christians that believe the it literally get a chance, they will do their best to make sure that those questions are NOT answered.

Faith is a wonderful thing, please, keep your faith, but do not hold back civilization and science because it might disagree or possibly disprove some of the stories in your great book.

My basic premise? The church did this in the dark ages, let's learn from it and NOT do it again.

[f.Christian]

You're a bloated fish in a mud puddle!

[gore3000]

Nothing like the Mr. Blueman with his refuted facts spouting them off over and over again.

I keep asking you to refute them and you keep failing to do so and just continue your insults. Perhaps what I am saying is true and that is why you cannot refute it?????

[gore3000]

The examples cited in that webpage show in increase in the chromosone count.

TalkOrigins is not a legitimate source for scientific facts. That nonsense has been refuted:

In Dobzhansky’s work, numerous varieties resulted from radiation bombardment: fruit flies with extra wings, fruit flies with no wings, fruit flies with huge wings, fruit flies with tiny wings... In the end, however, they were all ... fruit flies! Dobzhansky meddled with the genetic code of an organism and effected changes on the organism’s offspring. Nearly all of the changes were detrimental to survival, and none of them resulted in an advantage over other fruit flies.

From: Refutation of True Origins article .

It also should be noted that there were numerous mutations resulting from the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. None have been reported to have been favorable.

[js1138]

It also should be noted that there were numerous mutations resulting from the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. None have been reported to have been favorable.

If you had been paying attention, you might have noticed there are other kinds and sources of genetic variation. Besides, how would you know if a variation is favorable? Is sickle-cell trait favorable? "Favorability" depends on environment, which changes over time.

[Aric2000]

I see, since Christians are so conceited in their beliefs, this makes me stupid?

Interesting concept, but pretty typical.

If I am not a Christian, I must be stupid and of course I will be going to hell, because of course Christianity is right and the thousands of other religions are ALL wrong.

Believe what you like, but I don't even believe in a hell, let alone going to one. And going to heaven, playing a harp and worshiping some almight deity for all eternity does not sound like a lot of fun to me, as a matter of fact, it sounds downright boring. You enjoy it, I think that I'll be doing other things, thank you.

You do not know much about the crusades do you? Some of them were a defense of the "holy Lands", but most were to destroy cultures that disagreed with the tenets of the church and would not allow the church to tell them what to do.

See the Langueduc in France for just such an example. A wonderful culture, very learned, very advanced, every man woman and child killed because the church was afraid their knowledge and of course their ignoring of the churh would hurt the church.

Turkey was a fun place, not because it is Muslim, but because the people that I was freinds with did not try and force their beliefs on me.

The architecture was magnificent and the history was powerful, it practically eminated from the ground, I lived there for 18 months and enjoyed every minute of it, but I imagine since the Turks don't fit in with you worldview and you of course would never change you thoughts to possibly see their culture for what it is, instead looking at it through your Christian colored glasses, then you would not and COULD not enjoy it.

The culture was actually fairly advanced, whether you like to admit it or not, they would not have pounced on and destroyed or taken most of the territories they took during the middle ages if they hadn't been.

[Condorman]

Perhaps because some 200,000 people in Hiroshima and Nagasaki have shown that relativity is a fact of life (or death).

Once again, you demonstrate your limited grasp of science. I'd be willing to bet that you haven't the faintest idea what Einstein's Field Equation really means, and probably couldn't even write it down on paper.

[Aric2000]

Poor Sally, I really upset you didn't I.

Typical though, very typical of intolerance of some Fanatical Christians.

Some of my best Friends are Christians, it's just the fanatics like you that are the difficult ones, kind of like militant Muslims, if you catch my drift.

In all honesty, I have no idea what the Turks did or did not invent, and I could care less, I enjoyed the time I spent there greatly. Something that being as intolerant as you are, you would not understand.

[whattajoke]

"All the Christians in the world could vanish a minute from now and you'd still be stupid..."

Let me get this straight... you are calling Aric2K (and by inference, myself as well) "stupid" by using an example of the so called Rapture? I wouldn't even know where to begin, but to use your rather strange line of reasoning, How many inventions would a society come up with if we all spent our days waiting to be taken up magically into the heavens? How would our economy react if people stopped spending money because they were going to be raptured any day now?

Does it not frustrate you that Christian kookballs such as yourself have been clamoring for this rapture for hundreds, if not thousands of years? Dates are set and missed. Clues are found and forgotten. It's one of the most ridiculous concepts I've been privy to in all my life. It's insulting on so many levels that people actually believe this childish drivel... and that the "Left Behind" series actually sells more than 4 copies.

Take a step back from your bible (y'know, the one which didn't even contain the impossibly cryptic Revelations in it until fairly recently)and think about what you believe in. You believe in an unseen diety who judges man to the point of saving a very few (evangelical christians who actually believe this crap make up about .05% of the world population) while destroying the lives of billions of good people. (while breaking every known natural, physical, biological, practical, and rational law known to man.)

As Aric said, keep your faith; I don't wish to take that away from you. BUT, keep it in your own warped house and don't bring it to mine.

(what the hell this has to do with an evolution disclaimer in Louisiana is beyond me, however...)

Cheers.

[Aric2000]

I never said that it was the biggest drag now, but it was then. Until the crusades where the war machine created all kinds of things.

I really couldn't care less what you think, I find your naivete and extremism sick in the extreme, but if it makes you happy, who am I to say that it's bad for you?

Like he said above, as long as you keep it in your own warped house and away from mine, we will get along just fine.

[Tribune7]

You're weak on your history.

Chrstianity is based on the bible,

It's based on the belief that Jesus is the Messiah. The Bible is the recording of the His teachings and life.

the bible is a book, the book is around 1700 years old, some of the stories within that book are much older.

The New Testament has been pretty much established as beginning in the mid-First Century -- with the range of the books being between 1,950 and 1900 years old.

The Old Testament, which is most of the Bible, is much older.

In the dark ages, which I blame squarely on the shoulders of the church were a time of extreme nothing.

Do you known when the "dark ages" were? How long they lasted and what caused them?

The church had power and therefore what it said went.

Actually, it's authority was very iffy in the dark ages. It was a time of struggle, many of the powers involved -- notably in England -- were anti-Christian

The church believed that the earth was the center of the universe, anyone that disagreed with them was excommunicated. If the church said that something was the way it was, then that is the way it was, end of story. Threat of eternal damnation will pretty much kill anything that would disagree.

Copernicus was likley a priest and certainly a church administrator. He was well respected and a consultant to Pope Leo X. His heliocentric theory was encouraged by Cardinal Schonberg, then Archbishop of Capua. In fact, it appears that he only published at the insistance of church leaders. He was in good standing with the Catholic church when he died.

The most stident opposition came from Protestents -- note the era in which Copernicus live. The "Church" was not speaking as one voice.

Galileo Galilei is generally the one cited as evidence of the Church's anti-science tilt. But while Galileo was told to shut up -- perhaps like Dembski and Behe today -- he was not beaten, blinded tortured or burned at the stake -- as is often alleged -- and his imprisonment consisted of 22 days in a luxury apartment. He was generally also well-respected by church authorities. Many agreed with his views. He was blessed by the Pope at his death and buried in a church.

[f.Christian]

Good News For The Day

‘The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it’ (1 John 1:2)

"Those who had spent several years of their lives in company with Jesus, were, to say the least, profoundly... affected---by the experience. They spoke of "that which they had seen with their eyes, and touched with their hands" (V.1), and they were convinced that they had encountered God. "We proclaim to you the eternal life which was with the Father, and has appeared to us" (v. 2).

"The first Christians knew from the depths of their being that they had seen a new level of personal greatness, and wholeness, in Jesus. They were exhilarated by it. Their hearts were aglow with a bewildering joy at the magnitude of their good fortune."

"Something profoundly enlivening did happen to the disciples of Jesus. Far from diminishing them, it grew them into powerful personalities, who were giants among others of their time. The world took notice of them. Many times over, since, their testimony has been confirmed by others who have met Christ. Always, he lifts and enhances human life in all its parts. Have you found this too? May it be so."

Last evening I attended my eigth grade nephews concert under the stars---moon Christmas concert at the mall and when they did silent night these young ladies danced the hula to this song...Hawaii is a very special place---MIRACLE!

AMAZING!

[f.Christian]

scag...tree---dead but standing!

scag science---evolution!

scag
noun 1. heroin. --phrase 2. scagged out, wasted from taking drugs. [origin unknown]