Posted on 12/08/2002 4:40:39 PM PST by B4Ranch
The majority of the replies to the original Can You Change America were repeated complaints about what our elected officials did, did not do, should do, or could do to clear up the nations illegal alien problem. This was well known history by amongst all of us. The solutions that were shared with us frequently rely on these same elected officials to aid us in the remedy.
1. An immediate moratorium on immigration waivers and new applications in the pipeline until major changes are made and the system re-vamped. (Intelligent)
2. Dismantle the welfare state, place restrictions on requirements to the Emergency Room srevices at our hospitals. (Necessary)
3. Cut off welfae payments to immigrants who haven't worked a ceartin amount of quaters and paid into the tax system. (Clever variation)
4. Pass law that landlords must check for documents before renting or selling , most now check credit, employment, etc. (Thoughtful)
5. Implement substantial fines (and revocation of tax incentives, if applicable) for employers who don't take reasonable steps to ensure they are hiring citizens. (Current unenforced law)
6. Place a bounty on each illegal (identified, turned in, and captured, not a " wanted dead or alive") (I like it)
7. Implement substantial fines (and revocation of tax incentives, if applicable) for employers who don't take reasonable steps to ensure they are hiring citizens. (I love it)
8. March on Washington. (Can be expensive for anyone who doesn't live in the area.)
9. Run for a state senate seat or state assembly seat. Can be done rather easily. yes, winning will take a lot of work but not a whole lot of money
10. Change the constitution so that kids born to illegal are not automatically citizens. (Good Luck)
11. In the federal election to be held on the first Tuesday of February, 2005, no person shall be allowed to vote unless they have proved their U.S. citizenship by providing an American passport, birth certificate, or naturalization papers to the registrar. (Good idea)
I guess my question is; What makes you continue to think that our leadership is going to aid in the dismantling of programs that they put in place. None of these programs came solely from the Democrats, nor were they solely supported by Democrats? More and more Republicans are walking to the left of center when it comes to these "undocumented migrants".
President Bush is refusing to discuss his policies with the voters on this subject. I think that he is holding off on implementing amnesty until the war with Iraq is finished or at least solidly underway. He could be afraid that we, the people will revolt by withdrawing our support for the war if he slams the door in our face refusing to acknowledge our opinions on illegal immigrants, immigration numbers, open borders, welfare policies, etc. The Enhanced Border Security Act of 2001 was a farce.
We have an environment where "personal responsibility" are dirty words.We can preserve our country. Fight political correctness mind control. Do not celebrate diversity when it means turning a blind eye to immorality, laziness, etc.
So, once again I will promote going against standard procedure and suggest that we the people show our independence by:
Forming local groups of 20 or more and going to every city and county council meeting protesting that our local law enforcement is not enforcing our local businessmen to obey INS hiring laws.
Asking for meetings with the local Chief of Police and the local Sheriff. Request information on local illegal alien crime statistics. Ask for law enforcement costs of illegal aliens. Ask for reports of INS non-cooperation and, of course, cooperation. Attempt to obtain historic records going back two decades. Don't accept six month waiting periods. Thirty days is sufficient for anything to be done in small cities.
Do not use any "immigration" name of this group. Example, call yourselves, " The Taxpayers of 'LOCAL NAME". It's difficult to call "Taxpayers of Jackson County" a racist title because every employed person in the County is a taxpayer. This will allow all political party members to feel welcome to join your group. Explain that the purpose of the group is to free the city and county of illegal alien law breakers and that you are attempting to get the local officials to enforce all of the laws , not selectively enforce those that will allow them to be re-elected.
Don't allow elected or appointed officials to direct the meeting into discussing one ethnic group. We are not attempting to deport just illegal Somalians or Hatians. Yes, the illegal Mexicans get most of the media coverage but you should not allow yourself to succumb to racist ideals. because you are attempting to erradicate all illegal alien lawbreakers from your communities. Stress this point at every meeting. Don't call Muslims, ragheads, Mexicans, wetbacks or any other derogatory name. This can only lead to failure on your part.
Ask to view the Oath of Office of each elected official in the city and county. Then design an award to be given to those who are upholding their Oaths of Office. Invite the press, make as large an affair out of it as possible.
Design a website. List local businesses that are hiring illegal aliens. Display a prominent post that you pass along all information in letters that give evidence of someone living or working in your community who is an illegal alien from any country in the world. Specifically suggest that people do not give their names unless they are willing to testify under oath before city and county boards.
Get on the local radio talk show as often as possible. If the owners, managers agree with us, then ask for a break in advertizing your website.
Hold marches in front of local companies that hire illegal aliens.
Stress the costs to your community of illegal aliens to every elected or appointed official and at every public meeting you speak at, every radio show that you can get a voice on.
Explain that we cannot absorb and adjust to this invasion. We cannot continue to take millions of un-educated and un-healthy migrants at the rate we now are. We must be able to screen these people and absorb them at a rate that does not create chaos.
Find someone who is unemployed and compare that person to an illegal alien in your community who is making a decent wage. Ask him/her if she would do that job for a lower wage. Perhaps just one dollar per hour less. Get on the radio with that person. Let them tell their story. we have 6% of our population currently unemployed! Are you one of these people?
We must advocate adherence to the limitations placed upon government by the Constitution, and we must do so by holding politicians accountable, both in terms of elections and in public relations, when they demonstrate their contempt for the Constitution.
It's what political movement is all about, and we have the best incentives, motives, and ideas behind us.
Do you have questions about the Immigration and Nationality Act? Look at the INS web page for answers.
Very couragous individuals. I hope they have the support of some of their local officials (like Sheriff, County Commissioners and at least one Judge). That made a HUGE difference at Jarbidge, NV.
We didn't have it at Klamath and so it as a lot more dicey. But enough people flocked to that cause and raised enough clamor that the Federal government backed off and finally did the right thing. Perhaps the same will occur there ... but only if enough of us become involved and raise the clamor IMHO.
This concerns a lawsuit in Colorado. I am not a lawyer, but I worked on this case for a lawyer (my ex boss). It is public record; however, I will not disclose names here.
An American citizen had a motor vehicle accident which resulted in the death of the passenger in another vehicle. The passenger had two children, who filed a lawsuit, on behalf of the estate of the deceased. During litigation, we were presented with economic damages: monies the decedent would have made had she lived and, therefore, from which the children would have otherwise benefitted. The calculation of economic loss, had this woman kept working during her expected lifetime, according to the estate’s attorneys, was in the neighborhood of $250,000. This amount, of course, presumed that she would continue working in the same or similar type of employment within the United States. In addition to the projected economic loss, there was another demand of approximately $250,000 for pain and suffering of the children.
Long story short: this woman was an illegal alien. The Social Security number her employer claimed to be the decedent’s was not, in fact, the decedent’s Social Security number. We found this out by calling the Social Security Administration. They would not say whose name was assigned to that number, but said the name we gave her WAS NOT correct. There were other things that would have brought up to the question of her legal status: she held no bank account, filed no tax returns, paid no taxes (according to the employer), was paid in cash, owned no property. The father of the children lives in Mexico, and is a Mexican citizen.....there's more, but I'll just leave it at this.
My boss made demands of the children’s/estate’s attorney for documentation that the decedent was legally allowed to be living and working in the United States; these demands were made before, during, and after trial; during appeal; and again after we won appeal. They refused. No supporting documents were ever provided. On the witness stand, the Judge said the employer did not have to produce ANY documentation that the employee was legally allowed to work in the U.S., had a green card, or anything else to support the employer’s claims that she “saw” the proper employment documentation that would have allowed her to hire the woman.
The economic projections the plaintiffs’ attorney claimed his clients were due were solely based on legal employment within the United States of America, for the duration of the illegal alien’s lifetime. Not taken into account were these facts:
1. She had no documentation to legally work in the U.S.
2. She had no security to continue working, illegally or otherwise, in the U.S., as she could have, conceivably, been deported at any time throughout her “working years.”
So, what good does it do to pass laws requiring employers to see documents proving eligibility for work if those same employers are later aided/rewarded by judges who allow employers to lie under oath by not forcing them to produce any documentation that they were legally allowed to hire an employee?
The judge, in effect, said “as long as it pertains to the question of ‘legal employment status,’ the employer can simply claim he/she “saw” the necessary ‘proof of employment documentation’ on the witness stand; it will be accepted as fact without any proof.”
Obviously, all our laws, as pertains to employment requirements requiring documentation proving eligibility to work is for naught if we have judges who continue to allow fraud to occur in a courtroom.
Those folks -- starting with this organizer -- are going to get thrown in stir.
Once incarcerated in *their* penal nuthouses do you realize what'll happen to 'em?
I needn't tell you what the predominant ethnic background of an overwhelming majority of inmates presently are in those jails, either.
What's almost as bad is how the decent, honest & concerned citizen (down there, anyway) cannot rely on instruments [like], "Jury Nulification" anymore either, in the event they're forced to stand trial?
Regardless how trumped-up the charges may be; &, they will be.
Remember who'll be sitting on those juries in majority numbers, now.
The *enemy* is firmly entrenched -- within -- & in so many ways I cannot count the ways.
For chrissakes just let ONE of these militia members HAVE TO defend themselves -- & it's gonna happen, alright -- and in the process shoot one of these illegals.
The trial sheisters & Liberal-Socialist America-hating pols will drop outa the saguaros by the score.
All salivating at the prospect of sueing & *then* snuffing *all* of these people into oblivion.
(~& again keep in your mind who it is sitting on most of the juries in that part of the country.)
"The wheels may be off...but they are going to try and do their part to either keep whats left on, or put them back on there on that part of the border."
See?
This is "the" A#1 point where you & I have always met at loggerheads, Jeff Head.
I simply cannot see the sense in people marching -- knowingly -- into a hail of *fire*.
You -- appear -- to find some kind of *honor* in doing so?
You're a genuine anachronism, Jeff Head.
While I've always admired your steadfast beliefs & principles?
I just think there's got to be another, better way.
In the very least, I'd have to say it's about time we realize when the opposition forces begin, "talking" about something -- anything -- socially?
They intend to do whateverinthehell they're talking about, soon.
And ONLY BECAUSE they've already formed an ironclad strategy from A to Z thought-out well in advance of their ever saying a word as well as all of 'em -- ie their media, pols, sycophants, quislings & plants -- being on the same page.
Once these guys start to move, they've consistantly left our side, "reacting" continually on the defensive.
Then, we're hopelessly tied-up, mucked-down fielding their well prepared PR implemented accusations, smears, & assualts while their main thrust blows right by.
Their MO is gettin' really old.
Now if we have to fight -- & that'd always be the last resort -- I happen to believe the way that's done is the exact way ol' Gen GPatton once said, "Make the other poor SOB die for HIS country!" [read: cause]
Means once something starts, it's all the way or nothing a'tall.
The Liberal-Socialists additionally appear to have our (~& all others of our cut) number because they're extremely skilled in never pushing too far; not, until for the cause, it's too late.
"Very couragous individuals."
Yup; & a dying breed of American, to be sure.
Over just the past ten years the Liberal-Socialists have methodically picked-off those with this kind of spirit one by one; &, have done so in a variety of different ways: physcially *&* psycologically.
(Frankly, I'm stunned you've lasted this long, to be perfectly honest.)
"I hope they have the support of some of their local officials (like Sheriff, County Commissioners and at least one Judge). That made a HUGE difference at Jarbidge, NV."
Jarbridge was NOT the same kind of thing as this illegal immigrant issue!
Jarbridge couldn't possibly be spun into a, "racial" or "racist" matter by the Liberal-Socialists.
Jarbridge was one of the citizen v.s. the feds, as I recall. Right?
Just you watch what happens in this instance; just watch.
When the fecal-matter hits the impeler -- & it's gonna as sure as God made li'l green apples -- just watch these pols -- from bottom to top -- perform a state-of-the-art CYA.
These people are heading directly under the proverbial bus.
"We didn't have it at Klamath and so it as a lot more dicey. But enough people flocked to that cause and raised enough clamor that the Federal government backed off and finally did the right thing. Perhaps the same will occur there..."
I always maintained the correct *approach* at Klamath could've drawn the feds to the bargaining table where upon a dialog could be opened & everyone's needs be met.
~& no that's not some half-assed "conflict resolution" bullshit, either.
It's common country horse sense.
...but only if enough of us become involved and raise the clamor IMHO."
That'll remain to be seen; as, I *think* this POTUS has other ideas concerning the situation?
And I dare-say you've the same notion I have what the man's *fix* might just be, too.
...& we won't be happy about it, either.
We've been seeing this time and time again: Florida Supremes, NJ Supremes (re Toricelli replacement), judges extending voting poll hours (to the benefit of Rats), etc., etc., etc. It's pathetic. But everyone votes these judges back in .... what can you do when they're are not held accountable? They think they're gods.
I'm not sure, but I don't think a member of the Bar is allowed to promote "Jury Nulification". If an attorney ever did that he would have a difficult time trying and winning the most simple case in that judges courtroom.
Jeff, I think the Feds are promoting NWO and are in full support of the illegal immigration invasion. Where do you get the hope that they will "do the right thing"?
So who's talking about getting that (~or any other) kind of counsel from a sheister anyway, B4?
If our side cannot figure out what in the hell's going down *&* what needs to be done to straighten out the mess?
Then we're in even deeper kimcheee, than even I thought.
You sound as though you missed the point; or, I didn't make myself clear, again.
Be that as it may make no mistake the Liberal-Socialists & their activist *judges* have figured it all out, pretty well.
...even if our side continues to *struggle*.
Did you watch the Factor last night? Incredible story about detectives hired to go into Los Alamos, discovery theft (in huge amounts). They were fired by University of "C," which runs Los Alamos. These two men found out about too much theft and were reporting incidences to the FBI. All this money came from, you guessed it, the Federal Government, which, of course, coms from US.
Sounds like you're talking about Larry Dever, Sheriff of Cochise County, Arizona. Look him up.
I believe the same thing can happen here if enough people raise enough cain and if the issue becomes heated and politcally liable enough.
Unfortunatly, what Landru said is correct, they will try and make this a race issue and that's a heavy burden to overcome in the current environment and on their playing table. That's why it can't be allowed to play out exclusively on their playing field. Klamath diddn't, it as grassroots and the internet that made a HUGE difference. I do not believe we can understimate or neglect that.
In addition, the poers that be are also underestimating, IMHO, the general feeling of most of the population on this issue. They are fed up.
Finally, I also believe that there is a God in Heaven and He can work miracles ... in fact, He will work His will. It is Him ultimately that I place my trust. We have to work hard and work smart in accordance with that IMHO.
Our founders worked against even more overwhelming odds (IMHO) in their day and won out. Klamath was a small but important example IMHO of the same principles. Those same principles can (and I believe they are) being applied here. That is the basis for my hope ... not that there are many in the government who would do so for the right reasons. But that through these methods they might be brought to it. If not ... then God be with us all.
I might add, that there are some good people in government and we need to support and grow them in every way we can.
Gotta go.
NAFTA wasn't understood by the majority of our elected officials, it was read by even fewer but they signed it believing that the leaders were correct in advocating the globalistic goals. Now, the idea that something is amiss and I was involved in it is too much for them to admit. The political backlash of this convoluted reasoning would expose the corruption and Heaven fobid they might be held accountable. Yes, we are being sabotaged from within by politicians who continue to espouse that this action will our serve the national interests.
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