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To: xzins; RnMomof7; OrthodoxPresbyterian
I don't read the_doc's opinions too much when he uses abusive language and says it's necessary to be abusive.

I regard you as a wolf in Protestant's clothing.

I am at least being straightforward. The RCs need to start facing the fact of how much trouble they are in. (What in the world do you think all of the SCANDALS of sodomy and pederasty in the RCC are all about? [And what about all of the Protestants who have been murdered by the RCC over the centuries?])

This is not the time to mince words. I was not being abusive. I was being clear.

Your smarmy post would tell the RCs to ignore my "opinions." But my "opinion" is merely a correct reading of the Scriptures. Transubstantiation is a fraud. It gives lost people something to believe, something that won't save them.

The doctrine of God's angry reprobation of fallen sinners is TRUE, xzins. It traces back to the Fall, before any of us were even BORN.

20 posted on 10/03/2002 8:02:14 AM PDT by the_doc
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To: the_doc
What in the world do you think all of the SCANDALS of sodomy and pederasty in the RCC are all about?

What do you think that they are about?

21 posted on 10/03/2002 8:06:03 AM PDT by St.Chuck
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To: the_doc; winstonchurchill; P-Marlowe; allend; fortheDeclaration
This is not the time to mince words. I was not being abusive. I was being clear.

Doc, that's exactly what you, an abuser, would say. Allow me to disenable you from the wisdom of your own conceit.

You can regard me to be an aardvark and it wouldn't be so. You, on the other hand, with your abusive language demonstrably illustrate your hatred of fellow Christians. For you are reserved the words of John, By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, NOR the one who does NOT LOVE HIS BROTHER (1Jn3:10)

Smarmy....LOL....get a thesaurus

22 posted on 10/03/2002 8:14:50 AM PDT by xzins
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To: the_doc; Catholicguy; xzins
[And what about all of the Protestants who have been murdered by the RCC over the centuries?])

And Protestants never murdered Catholics? get real Doc! Zeal can be a virtue. In your case, your bigotry and pride turn it into a vice! That's why many of us only lurk in your posts and avoid posting.

23 posted on 10/03/2002 8:20:18 AM PDT by ThomasMore
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To: the_doc
I am at least being straightforward. The RCs need to start facing the fact of how much trouble they are in. (What in the world do you think all of the SCANDALS of sodomy and pederasty in the RCC are all about?

What is the address of your perfect Church, without any sin? I wish to join, to enable me to cast stones.

[And what about all of the Protestants who have been murdered by the RCC over the centuries?])

And what about all the Protestants who killed other Protestants and Catholics through the centuries? It is hard to take seriously one who thinks history is so clearly one-sided.

SD

24 posted on 10/03/2002 8:33:47 AM PDT by SoothingDave
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To: the_doc
But my "opinion" is merely a correct reading of the Scriptures.

Who says? You? LOL.

38 posted on 10/03/2002 9:56:55 AM PDT by Rambler
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To: the_doc
We follow Sola Scriptura. We don’t follow Calvin. We don’t follow Augustine.

First prove they are the word of God!

960 posted on 10/07/2002 11:20:48 AM PDT by ThomasMore
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To: the_doc
"The first thing you need to realize (or remember, if you already realize this) is that I am an absolute predestinarian. (All of the Protestant Reformers, certainly including Luther and Calvin, were predestinarians. Calvin was the strongest spokesman for the predestinarian position, and he drew more doctrinal fire over this doctrine than did Luther. However, Luther is the one who first commented that the controversy over man's free will was the pivotal doctrine of the entire Reformation.).....

You will never understand where I am coming from in these posts unless and until you understand the fact of my predestinarian perspective.

...which is wrong and incompatible with Christianity!

Augustine clearly saw these ominous truths in the Bible. He could even be called a proto-Calvinist. It is definitely worth reading Augustine's writings on this topic of "double predestination."

You say Augustine was a proto-Calvinist in his take on predestination. You and other Calvinists are wishful thinkers and misinterpreters.  You deny the human will a freedom God created it with.

What is the import of the fact that in so many passages God requires all His commandments to be kept and fulfilled? How does He make this requisition, if there is no free will? What means "the happy man," of whom the Psalmist says that "his will has been the law of the Lord "? Does he not clearly enough show that a man by his own will takes his stand in the law of God? Then again, there are so many commandments which in some way are expressly adapted to the human will; for instance, there is, "Be not overcome of evil," and others of similar import, such as, "Be not like a horse or a mule, which have no understanding;" and, "Reject not the counsels of thy mother;" and, "Be not wise in thine own conceit;" and, "Despise not the chastening of the Lord;" and, "Forget not my law;" and, "Forbear not to do good to the poor;" and, "Devise not evil against thy friend;" and, "Give no heed to a worthless woman; and, "He is not inclined to understand how to do good;" and, "They refused to attend to my counsel;" with numberless other passages of the inspired Scriptures of the Old Testament. And what do they all show us but the free choice of the human will? So, again, in the evangelical and apostolic books of the New Testament what other lesson is taught us? As when it is said, "Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth; " and, "Fear not them which kill the body;" and, "If any man will come after me, let him deny himself;" and again, "Peace on earth to men of good will." So also that the Apostle Paul says: "Let him do what he willeth; he sinneth not if he marry. Nevertheless, he that standeth stedfast in his heart, having no necessity, but hath power over his own will, and hath so decreed in his heart that he will keep his virgin, doeth well." And so again," If I do this willingly, I have a reward;" while in another passage he says, "Be ye sober and righteous, and sin not;" and again, "As ye have a readiness to will, so also let there be a prompt performance;" then he remarks to Timothy about the younger widows, "When they have begun to wax wanton against Christ, they choose to marry." So in another passage, "All that will to live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution;" while to Timothy himself he says, "Neglect not the gift that is in thee." Then to Philemon he addresses this explanation:

"That thy benefit should not be as it were of necessity, but of thine own will." Servants also he advises to obey their masters "with a good will." In strict accordance with this, James says: "Do not err, my beloved brethren . . . and have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ with respect to persons;" and," Do not speak evil one of another." So also John in his Epistle writes," Do not love the world," and other things of the same import. Now wherever it is said, "Do not do this," and "Do not do that," and wherever there is any requirement in the divine admonitions for the work of the will to do anything, or to refrain from doing anything, there is at once a sufficient proof of free will. No man, therefore, when he sins, can in his heart blame God for it, but every man must impute the fault to himself. Nor does it detract at all from a man's own will when he performs any act in accordance with God. Indeed, a work is then to be pronounced a good one when a person does it willingly; then, too, may the reward of a good work be hoped for from Him concerning whom it is written, "He shall reward every man according to his works."


967 posted on 10/07/2002 11:40:03 AM PDT by ThomasMore
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