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To: Condorman
[---Evidence against abiogensis, evidence against abiogenisis, misapplied math masquerading as evidence against. Blah, blah, blah. Snip.---]

Yup, I have given plenty of scientific evidence against abiogenesis which you cannot refute. You cannot even imagine a way in which life could have come about according to what we know to be a fact. Also, you keep talking about misapplied math, yet you cannot refute it either. Here, look at it again. Let's see if you can give a refutation instead of spouting total blather:

Nice rhetoric, but totally disproved by modern science. There is a tremendous amount of proof against abiogenesis. First of all is Pasteur's proof that life does not come from inert matter (and this was of course at one time the prediction of materialists). Then came the discovery of DNA and the chemical basis of organisms. This poses a totally insurmountable problem to abiogenesis. The smallest living cells has a DNA string of some one million base pairs long and some 600 genes, even cutting this number by a quarter as the smallest possible living cell would give us a string of some 250,000 base pairs of DNA. It is important to note here that DNA can be arranged in any of the four basic codes equally well, there is no chemical or other necessity to the sequence. The chances of such an arrangement arising are therefore 4^250,000. Now the number of atoms in the universe is said to be about 4^250. I would therefore call 4^250,000 an almost infinitely impossible chance (note that the supposition advanced that perhaps it was RNA that produced the first life has this same problem). The problem though is even worse than that. Not only do you need two (2) strings of DNA perfectly matched to have life, but you also need a cell so that the DNA code can get the material to sustain that life. It is therefore a chicken and egg problem, you cannot have life without DNA (or RNA if one wants to be generous) but one also has to have the cell itself to provide the nutrients for the sustenance of the first life. Add to this problem that for the first life to have been the progenitor of all life on earth, it necessarily needs to have been pretty much the same as all life now on earth is, otherwise it could not have been the source of the life we know. Given all these considerations, yes, abiogenesis is impossible.

588 posted on 09/04/2002 8:41:44 PM PDT by gore3000
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To: gore3000; Condorman; Phaedrus; VadeRetro
I am very curious about something that maybe y'all could explain to me from your various perspectives.

It seems that most all scientific theory includes specific predictions which can either be proven as true, or disproven as false, through experiment or observation.

The falsification method I understand was championed by Karl Popper. Basically, as I understand it, it is quicker and less expensive to go the falsification route than to compile positive evidence.

I realize that Popper theory is extremely unpopular among evolutionists, but I don't see why. After all, in most theories (e.g. "water freezes at 44 F") - simply running the test to prove the theory is false ought to be enough.

So what is the problem with applying falsification methods to evolution theory?

589 posted on 09/04/2002 9:38:02 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: gore3000
I see you have ignored my question. Here it is again:

Ignoring the fact that your arguments have no bearing on the validity of the theory of evolution, do you have evidence FOR a designer?

605 posted on 09/05/2002 11:24:11 AM PDT by Condorman
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