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To: kabar

I put a guy like Roland Martin and his “Confederate soldiers were terrorists” rant in the unnecessarily divisive category. That is just a broad generalization that is an expression of a crude prejudice. But there is unavoidably a division between the philosophy of Lincoln and the philosophy of Jeff Davis and a whole lot of conservatives favor Lincoln. And favoring Lincoln does not mean we consider Southerners or Confederate soldiers to be cruel neanderthals. This isn’t the Daily Kos.


137 posted on 05/04/2010 9:27:59 PM PDT by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: Colonel Kangaroo

I believe in the actions of Jeff Davis and understand why our government can kiss ass. He understood the Pilgrims were right.


144 posted on 05/04/2010 9:42:01 PM PDT by eyedigress ((Old storm chaser from the west)?)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
But there is unavoidably a division between the philosophy of Lincoln and the philosophy of Jeff Davis and a whole lot of conservatives favor Lincoln. And favoring Lincoln does not mean we consider Southerners or Confederate soldiers to be cruel neanderthals. This isn’t the Daily Kos.

I know you weren't addressing me but I would like to respond. I don't disagree and I would most likely find more in common politically with Lincoln than I would would Davis. But on this particular issue involving the expanding role of the federal govt, I disagree with Lincoln. All of these great men in our nation's history were human and subject to making poor decisions right alongside the good ones.

As for the neanderthal comment....sadly, some here at FR do feel that way and I've even seen some characterize the Confederate troops as "traitors."

I know that most of my family ancestors were not slave owners and were hard-working and just trying to survive and feed their families and create a better life than where they left from. I trust that their support for the war, whichever side, was not as trivial as many make it appear today.

146 posted on 05/04/2010 9:43:09 PM PDT by TNdandelion
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
We had a Civil War where brother fought against brother. When the war ended at Appomattox Court House, it was done with respect on both sides. Chamberlain's remarks and actions speak of that respect including for the Confederate flag. If a Union General who had fought in that terrible war could express such respect, why can't we?

Dressed in an immaculate uniform, Lee waited for Grant to arrive. Grant, whose headache had ended when he received Lee's note, arrived in a mud-spattered uniform—a government-issue flannel shirt with trousers tucked into muddy boots, no sidearms, and with only his tarnished shoulder straps showing his rank. It was the first time the two men had seen each other face-to-face in almost two decades. Suddenly overcome with sadness, Grant found it hard to get to the point of the meeting and instead the two generals briefly discussed a previous encounter during the Mexican-American War. Lee brought the attention back to the issue at hand, and Grant offered the same terms he had before:

In accordance with the substance of my letter to you of the 8th inst., I propose to receive the surrender of the Army of N. Va. on the following terms, to wit: Rolls of all the officers and men to be made in duplicate. One copy to be given to an officer designated by me, the other to be retained by such officer or officers as you may designate. The officers to give their individual paroles not to take up arms against the Government of the United States until properly exchanged, and each company or regimental commander sign a like parole for the men of their commands. The arms, artillery and public property to be parked and stacked, and turned over to the officer appointed by me to receive them. This will not embrace the side-arms of the officers, nor their private horses or baggage. This done, each officer and man will be allowed to return to their homes, not to be disturbed by United States authority so long as they observe their paroles and the laws in force where they may reside.

The terms were as generous as Lee could hope for; his men would not be imprisoned or prosecuted for treason. In addition to his terms, Grant also allowed the defeated men to take home their horses and mules to carry out the spring planting and provided Lee with a supply of food rations for his starving army; Lee said it would have a very happy effect among the men and do much toward reconciling the country. The terms of the surrender were recorded in a document completed around 4 p.m., April 9. As Lee left the house and rode away, Grant's men began cheering in celebration, but Grant ordered an immediate stop. "I at once sent word, however, to have it stopped," he said. "The Confederates were now our countrymen, and we did not want to exult over their downfall."

On April 10, Lee gave his farewell address to his army. The same day a six-man commission gathered to discuss a formal ceremony of surrender, even though no Confederate officer wished to go through with such an event. Brig. Gen. Joshua L. Chamberlain was the Union officer selected to lead the ceremony, and later he reflected on what he witnessed on April 12, 1865, and wrote a moving tribute:

"The momentous meaning of this occasion impressed me deeply. I resolved to mark it by some token of recognition, which could be no other than a salute of arms. Well aware of the responsibility assumed, and of the criticisms that would follow, as the sequel proved, nothing of that kind could move me in the least. The act could be defended, if needful, by the suggestion that such a salute was not to the cause for which the flag of the Confederacy stood, but to its going down before the flag of the Union. My main reason, however, was one for which I sought no authority nor asked forgiveness. Before us in proud humiliation stood the embodiment of manhood: men whom neither toils and sufferings, nor the fact of death, nor disaster, nor hopelessness could bend from their resolve; standing before us now, thin, worn, and famished, but erect, and with eyes looking level into ours, waking memories that bound us together as no other bond;—was not such manhood to be welcomed back into a Union so tested and assured? Instructions had been given; and when the head of each division column comes opposite our group, our bugle sounds the signal and instantly our whole line from right to left, regiment by regiment in succession, gives the soldier's salutation, from the "order arms" to the old "carry"—the marching salute. Gordon at the head of the column, riding with heavy spirit and downcast face, catches the sound of shifting arms, looks up, and, taking the meaning, wheels superbly, making with himself and his horse one uplifted figure, with profound salutation as he drops the point of his sword to the boot toe; then facing to his own command, gives word for his successive brigades to pass us with the same position of the manual,—honor answering honor. On our part not a sound of trumpet more, nor roll of drum; not a cheer, nor word nor whisper of vain-glorying, nor motion of man standing again at the order, but an awed stillness rather, and breath-holding, as if it were the passing of the dead!

– Joshua L. Chamberlain, Passing of the Armies, pp. 260-61

152 posted on 05/04/2010 9:50:55 PM PDT by kabar
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