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To: Non-Sequitur
Check your timelines. Storm clouds seem to have been all on the part of the rebels.

Bull.

Lincoln, not yet in office, induced the governor of Illinois to commence the suppression of Missouri's government by arming the Wide-Awakes from Illinois Militia arms lockers.

I've also got five dollars that says Lincoln interfered with the Buchanan Administration's authority over Gen. Winfield Scott, when Scott determined to hold on to the Southern forts in December 1860.

Lincoln's policy was war all the way -- just as his private secretary said it was.

304 posted on 03/14/2010 8:17:50 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
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To: lentulusgracchus
I've also got five dollars that says Lincoln interfered with the Buchanan Administration's authority over Gen. Winfield Scott, when Scott determined to hold on to the Southern forts in December 1860.

That would be the bill with Lincoln's picture on it? Sure you wouldn't rather double that bet? Or how about increase it by a factor of 10? Who's on a $50?

307 posted on 03/14/2010 8:26:09 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: lentulusgracchus; Non-Sequitur
I've also got five dollars that says Lincoln interfered with the Buchanan Administration's authority over Gen. Winfield Scott, when Scott determined to hold on to the Southern forts in December 1860.

You'd win that bet, lg. Pay up, non-seq. From Link:

Letter to E. B. Washburne

(Confidential.)
SPRINGFIELD, ILLINOIS, December 21, 1860.

My dear Sir: Last night I received your letter giving an account of your interview with General Scott, and for which I thank you. Please present my respects to the general, and tell him, confidentially, I shall be obliged to him to be as well prepared as he can to either hold or retake the forts, as the case may require, at and after the inauguration.

Yours as ever,
A. LINCOLN

316 posted on 03/14/2010 8:48:06 AM PDT by rustbucket
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To: lentulusgracchus
Lincoln, not yet in office, induced the governor of Illinois to commence the suppression of Missouri's government by arming the Wide-Awakes from Illinois Militia arms lockers.

I forgot about the armed St. Louis Wide Awakes. Members of that particular branch of this Northern paramilitary organization were mustered into the US army and used to seize the Missouri state militia.

Here are a couple of parts of a very long article entitled "The Wide Awakes" from the November 17, 1860, State Gazette of Austin, Texas. They were a serious potential threat to the South. GOPCapitalist used to call them Lincoln's brownshirts.

Military Preparation. -- It has been suggested by several of our leading citizens of both parties, that there ought to be some military organization in our city, with a view to be prepared to some extent for the crisis that seems to be threatening our country. Such organization of companies, under the name of the minute men or otherwise, has taken place in most of the States of the South and in many places in Texas. Certainly the complete organization, thorough drilling and equipment of 300,000 Wide Awakes throughout the North, for the avowed purpose of forcing the South to submit to the domination of Black Republican rule and Black Republican principles, should warn us by every dictate of prudence, to make some preparation for our common defence.

And

At Brandywine, Pennsylvania, the other day, 50,000 of them drilled in the presence of a Republican mass-meeting of 25,000.

About 4,000 were in procession at Albany a few evenings since.

The 50,000 number seemed high to me. I checked to see if I could verify the numbers and found a September 12, 1860 New York Times article that said of this meeting, "There were nearly 5,000 equipped men, all drilled in military tactics, marching and counter-marching, and manoeuvering around the field ..." See Link. So, 5,000, not 50,000. Still a big number. Bigger numbers supposedly drilled elsewhere. See: 12,000 in NYC. Here is a drawing of the NYC march: Drawing of NYC March.

In the State Gazette article, Seward is quoted as saying that the Wide Awakes "would be found mighty convenient for ... crushing out any attempt to overthrow the Government."

338 posted on 03/14/2010 12:43:20 PM PDT by rustbucket
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