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To: EnderWiggins; All

I don't have to. The "Full Faith and Credit" clause of the US Constitution, US State Department regulations, and the Federal Rules of Evidence have already done that.

WOW.

The FFC, USCON, the State Dept and the FRE cover the "chain of evidence" of a COLB given BY partisan hacks TO partisan hack to verify the Eligibility of the POTUS??!

Do any of those references say anything about "reliable evidence"?

PLEASE school me, Wiggy ...


877 posted on 02/25/2010 12:24:17 PM PST by BP2 (I think, therefore I'm a conservative)
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To: BP2
"The FFC, USCON, the State Dept and the FRE cover the "chain of evidence" of a COLB given BY partisan hacks TO partisan hack to verify the Eligibility of the POTUS??!"

Of course. You didn't know that?

"Do any of those references say anything about "reliable evidence"?"

Sure they do.

Let's start with the US State Department Regulations, shall we? Specifically 7 FAM 1119 PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP BY BIRTH IN THE UNITED STATES

In this regulation, we discover that:

a. To establish a claim to U.S. citizenship by birth in the United States:

A person born in the United States in a place where official records of birth were kept at the time of his birth shall submit with the application for a passport a birth certificate under the seal of the official custodian of records. [22 CFR 51.43.]

b. The birth certificate must:

(1) Show the applicant’s full name, and date and place of birth;
(2) Have a filing date within 1 year of the birth; and
(3) Bear the signature of the official custodian of birth records and the raised, impressed, or multicolored seal of the issuing office.


BP's First Epiphany: Barack Obama's COLB perfectly meets the State Department's requirements for proof of citizenship by birth. In actuality, since it also shows who his parents were, it is more than what is required as proof. There is no prohibition against the document being submitted by "partisan flack." It is proof regardless of who submits it.

Next, lets talk about the US Constitution and the "Full Faith and Credit" clause. It's Article IV, Section 1 and it reads:

"Full Faith and Credit shall be given in each State to the public Acts, Records, and judicial Proceedings of every other State. And the Congress may by general Laws prescribe the Manner in which such Acts, Records and Proceedings shall be proved, and the Effect thereof."

BP's Second Epiphany: No state or court can reject the COLB as proof of Obama's citizenship, since Hawaii's "full faith and credit" is guaranteed by the Constitution. The State of Hawaii says, right there on the certificate, that it that "This copy serves as prima face evidence of the fact of birth in any court proceeding." Not "This copy except when provided by partisan hacks..." The copy itself, no matter who hands it to the court.

Finally, let's see what the Federal Rules of Evidence have to say about it. The FRE have a whole rule (Rule 902) that covers what documents are self authenticating (even when provided by partisan flacks) Here is the rule along with its very first section:

Rule 902. Self-authentication

Extrinsic evidence of authenticity as a condition precedent to admissibility is not required with respect to the following:

(1) Domestic public documents under seal. A document bearing a seal purporting to be that of the United States, or of any State, district, Commonwealth, territory, or insular possession thereof, or the Panama Canal Zone, or the Trust Territory of the Pacific Islands, or of a political subdivision, department, officer, or agency thereof, and a signature purporting to be an attestation or execution.


BP's Third Epiphany: Not only is the COLB reliable, it is so reliable that it requires absolutely no "extrinsic evidence of authenticity" whatsoever. The document itself, even if it were to have fallen from a clear blue sky or have been hand delivered by a partisan flack is completely self authenticating.

So... where does this leave you? After all, you don't care about any of these things, because you personally don't trust Obama's partisan flacks. Unfortunately, the courts do care. Law enforcement agencies care. The US Constitution cares. The COLB is in and of itself absolute legal proof that Obama was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961... and unless you have something to contradict it, it is considered absolutely, completely, unassailable reliable.

So... what have you got to contradict it?
905 posted on 02/25/2010 1:21:00 PM PST by EnderWiggins
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