An opposing view: Descendant of black Confederate soldier speaks at museum

Thomasville Times-Enterprise ^ | 24 Feb 2004 | Mark Lastinger

[#3Fan]

Goofy said it himself, that the North wouldn't do a prisoner exchange so the union POWs were killed through starvation by the south. That's murder through terrorism and we can't give in to terrorism. If the south couldn't take care of the POWs they had a moral obligation to release them.

[Gianni]

Lincoln followed the Constitution recognizing things could be done while there was rebellion.

Now we're getting somewhere. Where in the Constitution are these things listed?

Wait... are you using your imagination again?

[Gianni]

Self employed.

Ran this through the Democrat Translator, came out: UN-employed.

[#3Fan]

Article II, Sections 1 and 2.

[#3Fan]

Ran this through the Democrat Translator, came out: UN-employed.

Liar.

[Gianni]

And as a a matter of courtesy, stand watie has asked you to refrain from capitalizing his name. He is half Native American, I am far less (Creek), but even my limited knowledge & participation in native customs/ceremonies, such requests have a spiritual meaning and reverence that I wish would be respected. -- 4CJ

It's been mentioned several times now. Continuance makes me think that perhaps he's just mad that the rest of us don't have to live in the world's asshole: Chicago, Ill.

--John

(cc: stand watie, 4CJ, nolu chan, GOPcap)

[#3Fan]

It's been mentioned several times now. Continuance makes me think that perhaps he's just mad that the rest of us don't have to live in the world's asshole: Chicago, Ill.

I live farther south than parts of Virginia and I haven't been to Chicago in 4 years. I live closer to Arkansas than Chicago. Great city, regardless, my favorite. I like Charlotte and London too.

And by the way, you guys hate northern cities, you hate northerners, you hate the union soldiers, you hate our former president, you hate union generals. Contrast that with the things I've said, where the only people I've ever said anything against is the slaveholder-secessionists, the ones that were thugs. I don't even have that much against Davis, he had the righteousness to accept God's judgment at least and didn't whine when he was captured (at that moment, anyway). You gave me that speech where you said you were a decent person and a nice guy, but all you do is spew hatred in an unfair way and you lie.

[#3Fan]

Oops, 6 years. I haven't been to Chicago in six years.

[GOPcapitalist]

Continuance makes me think that perhaps he's just mad that the rest of us don't have to live in the world's asshole: Chicago, Ill.

And to think - he wouldn't have to live their either if he would simply move out of his mother's basement like he should have done when he turned 18 two decades ago. It must be by choice.

[#3Fan]

And to think - he wouldn't have to live their either if he would simply move out of his mother's basement like he should have done when he turned 18 two decades ago. It must be by choice.

Liar. I moved out as a teenager. You guys don't care what kind of lies you tell at all.

[GOPcapitalist]

How odd. Our resident Ignatius seems unable to comprehend the fact that he is being taunted. Then again, people who shut themselves off in their mothers basement like him tend not to have much ability to comprehend the outside world and its nuances. I figure its only a matter of time before he starts ranting about the horrible bus trip to Baton Rouge en route to see Jessica Lynch.

[rustbucket]

If the south couldn't take care of the POWs they had a moral obligation to release them.

The South made such an offer but the North was slow in taking them up on it, resulting in additional POW deaths. From Judge Robert Ould, Confederate Agent of Exchange (Source: Point Lookout Prison Camp for Confederates, by Edwin W. Beitzell, copyright 1983):

When it was ascertained that exchanges could not be made either on the basis of the cartel or officer for officer and man for man, I was instructed by the Confederate authorities to offer to the United States Government their sick and wounded, without requiring any equivalents. Accordingly, in the summer of 1864, I did offer to deliver from ten to fifteen thousand of the sick and wounded at the mouth of the Savannah River without requiring any equivalents, assuring at the same time the agent of the United States, General Mulford, that if the number for which he might send transportation could not readily be made up from sick and wounded, I would supply the difference with well men. Although this offer was made in the summer of 1864, transportation was not sent to the Savannah River until about the middle or last of November, and then I delivered as many prisoners as could be transported, - some thirteen thousand in number, amongst, whom were more than five thousand well men.

[#3Fan]

You're a liar.

[#3Fan]

The South made such an offer but the North was slow in taking them up on it, resulting in additional POW deaths.

Disagreements make no difference. Starving thousands of soldiers that are POWs is murder. The south was using them as hostages to make demands and allowed them to die when those demands were not met. That's terrorism.

[rustbucket]

Disagreements make no difference. Starving thousands of soldiers that are POWs is murder. The south was using them as hostages to make demands and allowed them to die when those demands were not met. That's terrorism.

I don't buy your assertion. You might take a look at Immortal Captives, The Story of Six Hundred Confederate Officers and the United States Prisoner of War Policy by Mauriel Phillips Joslyn. It details the treatment and death by intentional starvation of some Confederate officers by the US Army.

Also, on January 24, 1864, long before the bulk of men died at Andersonville, Judge Robert Ould, Confederate Agent of Prisoner Exchange, sent the following letter:

Major General E. A. Hitchcock [US], Agent of Exchange:

Sir -- In view of the present difficulties attending the exchange and release of prisoners, I propose that all such on each side shall be attended by a proper number of their own surgeons, who under rules to be established, shall be permitted to take charge of their health and comfort. I also propose that these surgeons shall act as commissaries, with power to receive and distribute such contributions of money, food, clothing and medicines as may be forwarded for the relief of prisoners. I further propose that these surgeons be selected by their own Governments, and that they shall have full liberty at any and all times, through the agents of exchange, to make reports not only of their own acts but also of any matters relating to the Welfare of prisoners.

Respectfully, your obedient servant,
Ro. Ould, Agent of Exchange

The US Secretary of War turned this offer down.

[#3Fan]

I don't buy your assertion. You might take a look at Immortal Captives, The Story of Six Hundred Confederate Officers and the United States Prisoner of War Policy by Mauriel Phillips Joslyn. It details the treatment and death by intentional starvation of some Confederate officers by the US Army.

I'm not going to read a book by some lying neoconfederate wacko if that's what the author of that book is. If Confederate POWs were massacred, you should be able to link me to historical proof.

Also, on January 24, 1864, long before the bulk of men died at Andersonville, Judge Robert Ould, Confederate Agent of Prisoner Exchange, sent the following letter: The US Secretary of War turned this offer down.

Why was it turned down? It makes no difference on the Confederate side regardless. Failure to release those they couldn't feed was murder and holding them hostage to demands was terrorism.

[rustbucket]

You might be interested in the opinion of Walt Whitman in a December 1864 letter to the New York Times:

In my opinion, the Secretary has taken and obstinately held a position of cold-blooded policy, (that is, he thinks it policy) in this matter, more cruel than anything done by the secessionists. ... In my opinion, the anguish and death of these ten to fifteen thousand American young men, with all the added and incalculable sorrow, long drawn out, amid families at home, rests mainly on the heads of members of our own Government..."

By the way, the Immortal Captives book is extremely well documented. I bought my copy at Andersonville Prison in the Park Service store.

[rustbucket]

An on-line copy of Judge Ould's offer to the Feds can be found in the Official Records at the bottom of the following page.

http://www.ehistory.com/uscw/library/or/119/0871.cfm

The Federal reply to Ould's offer is on the next page. No reason why Ould's offer was refused was given, but I suspect that something this important would have been discussed at cabinet level.

Ould published some of his offers concerning prisoners in the Confederate papers of the time. I've found them. Some of them were also reported in Northern papers, if I remember correctly.

[lentulusgracchus]

You guys said people would be shot for their vote.

Cite me and quote me.

[lentulusgracchus]

To: GOPcapitalist

You're a liar.

There are a lot of people on these boards who have taken liberties with the truth, and some outright liars.

You just picked on the wrong guy to call a liar, slimer.

Prove it or shut up.