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Posts on 'moralabsolutes' (within 6 hours)

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  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 5:11:54 PM PST · 14 of 14
    wagglebee to hennie pennie; SErtelt

    Here is yesterday’s story from LifeNews:

    London, England (LifeNews.com) — After he was the victim of an automobile accident, doctors said 23-year-old Rom Houben was in a comatose state and unable to communicate with those around him. Now, 23 years later, the 46-year-old says he felt trapped as he was conscious the entire time and attempted to communicate.

    Houben became paralyzed after the crash but, thanks to advances in medical technology, he is now able to tell the world his thoughts via computer.

    “I screamed, but there was nothing to hear,” he told the London Daily Mail newspaper.

    “I dreamed myself away,” he said of how he coped with the situation. “All that time I just literally dreamed of a better life. Frustration is too small a word to describe what I felt.”

    Although tests at the time showed that he was essentially “extinct,” newer tests conducted just three years ago showed Houben’s brain was functioning normally — and his renewed ability to communicate is something he describes as a “second birth.”

    “I shall never forget the day when they discovered what was truly wrong with me - it was my second birth,” he told the paper. “I want to read, talk with my friends via the computer and enjoy my life now that people know I am not dead.”

    British neurological expert Dr. Steven Laureys has described Houben’s case in a new paper and said, “Medical advances caught up with him.”

    The paper indicates doctors used the internationally accepted Glasgow Coma Scale to assess his eye, verbal and motor responses, but the results were incorrect.

    Laureys says physicians need to not be so quick to label patients as in a vegetative state, because such a diagnosis can be incorrect.

    “’Anyone who bears the stamp of “unconscious” just one time hardly ever gets rid of it again,” he said.

    American bioethicist Wesley J. Smith commented today on the case and said it has significant implications for the euthanasia and assisted suicide debate.

    “We hear constantly that people diagnosed as being persistently unconscious should be dehydrated to death because they are not ‘persons,’ or are actually ‘dead’ — and so should be available for organ harvesting,” he said.

    “We hear that even if the family resists, futile care theory should permit bioethics committees to impose unilateral withdrawal. And we hear this even as repeated studies demonstrate that 40 or more percent of patients diagnosed as PVS really aren’t,” he continued.

    Smith says “there are abundant reasons to treat people with profound cognitive disabilities as fully human beings.”

    “First and foremost, because they are us. Second, because we don’t know enough about how the brain works to know that there won’t be some regeneration to permit eventual restoration of some function. But also, because there is always hope,” he said.

    “Houben is here today only because he wasn’t dehydrated to death,” Smith concludes.

    “There is no doubt he went through a horrendous experience, but thanks to treating him as a fully equal human being by caring for him all those years and giving him tests late into his disability–explicitly refused to Terri Schiavo–he is here today to tell tale and live the rest of his life,” he said.

    “And for goodness sake, whatever you believe about these issues, don’t talk in the presence of PVS or other apparently unconscious patients as if they aren’t there. Rather, always treat such people as if they can hear you, because sometimes they can,” Smith said.

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 5:08:21 PM PST · 13 of 14
    hennie pennie to wagglebee
    Would you mind doing me a small favor? I am unable to open up any of the threads about the gentleman misdiagnosed as being in a coma for 23 years, when in fact, from my understanding of the headlines, he was actually totally conscious and fully aware of his surroundings.

    Would you be so kind as to provide a couple paragraph synopsis about his case - like.... HOW did he finally get correctly diagnosed?

    And... is it possible that there will there be a BIG law suit for malpractice? Or have the genius neurologists got themselves 'covered' against any liability in this 2-plus decades long debacle?

    Thanks.

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 5:00:49 PM PST · 12 of 14
    wagglebee to Halls
    Terri was murdered to advance an agenda.

    The left took multiple daily polls in the months leading up to, during and after her murder.

    These polls allowed the culture of death to gauge exactly what was and what wasn't acceptable to the majority of the public.

    This has since been developed into a template for future murders and they are now setting up Zerocare which will enable them to commit future murders in the name of "fiscal responsibility".

    It has all been done before:

    This person suffering from hereditary defects
    costs the people 60,000 Reichmarks during his lifetime.
    People, that is your money. Read ‘New People’.
  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:57:59 PM PST · 95 of 95
    Behemoth the Cat to metmom
    "What's your degree in, BTW? What area of scientific study have you engaged in?"

    "Coming out"? Perhaps it's a good idea. So let's identify all the ACLU activists and Lutheran preachers here. :)

  • Eluana Englaro's Father Now Making Waves as a Euthanasia Activist

    11/24/2009 4:51:20 PM PST · 5 of 5
    BykrBayb to wagglebee
    "That is immaterial," he said. "It doesn't change the issue. Even if she had an absolute type of coma that was totally irreversible, that there was medically no way, no hope, nevertheless, that gives the right to no one the right to terminate the life of that person."

    In the world I grew up in, everybody knew this. Murder was never viewed as a rational option. Recently it's become popular to vote for or against a patient's right to life based on the perceived quality of the patient's life. How did we get inundated with so many sociopaths?

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:47:45 PM PST · 94 of 95
    Behemoth the Cat to demshateGod
    If we were to do what you say, we’d have to ignore or rewrite huge portion of scripture.

    Well, if you don't reinterpret certain things in the Scripture, then you have to ignore or deny the observed reality.

    For example, if you "allow the Bible to mean what it says" then the earth is flat, has edges, and the firmament (including the Sun) revolves around it. Unavoidably, because this is supported by numerous Biblical passages. It's not an academic splitting hair, presented by some atheist "evo", but a very real problem, which the Christianity (represented back then by the Catholic church) had to face several hundred years ago.

    'Creation science' attempts to solve this dilemma by scientific revisionism. This approach may work with people lacking education, but at certain level you simply cannot deny that scientific findings are interconnected. Knowledge from one discipline is applied in another. All is backed by mathematics, and most of it is translated into technology. Despite gaps, things we know are consistent. Revolutionary changes proposed by 'creation science' would make these things suddenly stop matching each other. I am sorry, but when given a choice between reconciling one material evidence with another, and reconciling observed phenomena SEPARATELY with literalist interpretation of the Bible, I have to choose the former. Perhaps a preacher can make another choice, but a scientist can't, otherwise we would be dealing with a dream-like world resembling Alice in the Wonderland, not a reality, which we can understand and alter, according to our will (and per God's wish, by the way).

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:45:08 PM PST · 11 of 14
    Halls to wagglebee

    This proves Terri was “alive” and was murdered even more then I already believed. Amazing a man like Terri knew everything going on around him but was stuck and couldn’t tell people around him.

    Truly sad.

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:39:51 PM PST · 10 of 14
    Halls to wagglebee

    Already happened to Terri Schiavo. That woman was starved and dehydrated to death and clearly there was life in her.

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:36:13 PM PST · 9 of 14
    wagglebee to SandRat
    O-Bozos Health Czar would have pulled the plug 22 years ago

    Hell, Zero never would have let the czars plug it in to begin with.

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:31:29 PM PST · 8 of 14
    chiefqc to SandRat

    Change you can believe in.

    o-bow man voters, hows that change working out for you now.

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:30:51 PM PST · 7 of 14
    wagglebee to hennie pennie
    You're right! And what about all those cases years ago, we'd hear about people in PVS being taken to the dentist, where they were given strong shots of valium, prior to the exam -- and sometimes, people in "PVS" woke right up and started talking! from an injection of common old ordinary Valium!!

    Prior to Terri's court-ordered murder, we were constantly told that she didn't "want" to live like that; however, a person with no brain function doesn't actually WANT anything.

    During the course of Terri's court-ordered murder she was given massive quantities of morphine so she wouldn't "feel" pain; however, a person with no brain function doesn't actually FEEL anything.

    As Terri's court-ordered murder drew to a close we were told she was experiencing "euphoria"; however, it is IMPOSSIBLE for a person with no brain function to be EUPHORIC.

  • Teen Sex Magazine to Stay on Shelves at Iowa Library [Parents Rebuffed]

    11/24/2009 4:22:44 PM PST · 118 of 118
    Albion Wilde to trumandogz
    As for the Jewish wife, I knew within 15 minutes of meeting her that we would be married. And yes, some of my old school New Orleans relatives objected.

    And did you agree to forsake Jesus Christ on behalf of your children before they were born? Could that possibly have been the source of their discomfort? Or were all your children baptized, confirmed, and taking communion along with you?

  • Eluana Englaro's Father Now Making Waves as a Euthanasia Activist

    11/24/2009 4:22:19 PM PST · 4 of 5
    wagglebee to All
    Pinged from Terri Dailies

  • During Baltimore assembly, bishops to consider revised directives on withdrawal of food, water

    11/24/2009 4:21:45 PM PST · 51 of 51
    wagglebee to Ohioan from Florida; Goodgirlinred; Miss Behave; cyn; AlwaysFree; amdgmary; angelwings49; ...
    This is Mikey Schiavo all over again.

    Thread by me.

    Eluana Englaro's Father Now Making Waves as a Euthanasia Activist

    ROME, November 24, 2009 (LifeSiteNews.com) - The father of Eluana Englaro (known in the press as "Italy's Terri Shiavo"), Beppino Englaro, is making a name for himself as a euthanasia activist, and is continuing to claim justification for his successful decade-long court battle to have his daughter's food and hydration removed last year. 

    At the same time, according to a report commissioned by the prosecutor of Udine, the town in which she died, Eluana was in an "irreversible coma" at the time of her death.

    Eluana Englaro was an Italian woman from Lecco in northern Italy, who was diagnosed as being in a "persistent vegetative state" after a car accident in 1992. The Udine report by neurologists Fabrizio Tagliavini and Raffaele de Caro said she had suffered "irreversible neuropathological damage."

    The 330 page study said, "The situation of the brain was consistent with persistent vegetative state."

    Italian law allows a patient to refuse medical treatment, but, as yet, the delivery of food and water by feeding tube is not defined as such. The prosecutor of Udine is considering whether Englaro and the physicians who allowed her death can be charged with homicide under the current law. 

    All of Italy was in an uproar late last year when the Court of Cassation in Rome agreed to allow the removal of Eluana's food and hydration tube, the only form of "life support" she was receiving. Eluana died three days after the tube was removed.

    "They wanted to make me a scapegoat, and I was charged with homicide, aggravated further because I was the father of Eluana," said Beppino Englaro. "But I did nothing but act with due respect for legality and transparency."

    "What the case has proved is that we live under the rule of law, and that ordinary citizens can trust the judiciary to defend their rights and freedoms. In front of anybody."

    Since his daughter's death, Beppino Englaro has become an activist for the legalization of euthanasia in Italy, promoting his book "Life Without Limits," that calls for a change in the law. In his book, Englaro has presented his daughter's death as a symbol of the struggle for the "right to self-determination."

    "I can only continue to fight for a law that respects the person ... the right to decide for their own body," Englaro wrote.

    Englaro, now the head of an association dedicated to the cause of legalized euthanasia in his daughter's name, spoke in Cagliari on Saturday at a seminar on living wills and the "Freedom to Choose" organized by the local chapter of the Union of Atheists and Agnostics and Rationalists.

    "The problem is respect for and protection of rights," he said.

    "Nobody, not even those who represent us in Parliament, can substitute our will. These are decisions to be made, not for me but with me. Any other way of legislation is unconstitutional," he said.

    However, anti-euthanasia activists have recently highlighted the much-publicized case of the British man, Rom Houben, who was misdiagnosed for 23 years as being in a coma-like state. That Houben was actually completely conscious but unable to respond challenges "the pro-euthanasia mentality which exists regarding severely incapacitated patients," said Janet Thomas of the campaign group No Less Human.

    Thomas, who had championed Eluana's right to life despite being in a coma, said, "This case highlights the huge dangers in assessing profoundly disabled people as having lives not worth living."

    But others have said that the condition of the patient, whether conscious or not, is in fact immaterial in the debate. Monsignore Ignacio Barreiro, the head of the Rome office of Human Life International, and a key figure in the fight to save Eluana, told LifeSiteNews.com that the condition of the person can never "warrant the termination of a human life."

    "Whatever condition that Eluana Englaro might have suffered, that never grants the right to terminate her life. It's as simple as that."

    Msgr. Barreiro said that he had opposed the argument that because Terri Schiavo had some limited consciousness she should not be dehydrated to death.

    "That is immaterial," he said. "It doesn't change the issue. Even if she had an absolute type of coma that was totally irreversible, that there was medically no way, no hope, nevertheless, that gives the right to no one the right to terminate the life of that person."

    "We will not be silent.
    We are your bad conscience.
    The White Rose will give you no rest."

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:19:40 PM PST · 6 of 14
    wagglebee to All
    Pinged from Terri Dailies

  • During Baltimore assembly, bishops to consider revised directives on withdrawal of food, water

    11/24/2009 4:18:37 PM PST · 50 of 51
    wagglebee to Ohioan from Florida; Goodgirlinred; Miss Behave; cyn; AlwaysFree; amdgmary; angelwings49; ...
    This is an incredible commentary!

    Thread by me.

    Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    November 24, 2009 (LifeSiteNews.com) - Many people will have read the story of Rom Houben, the Belgium man who was diagnosed as being in a permanent vegetative state (PVS) for 23 years, but who in fact had a condition known as Locked-in Syndrome. A person in locked-in syndrome is fully aware of all of their surroundings and they hear and remember the conversations that take place around them, but due to their cognitive disability they are unable to respond.

    The case of Rom Houben is significant given that many bioethicists are attempting to redefine the status of people in PVS as being similar to "brain death," meaning that it is being argued that these people have lost self-awareness and therefore should be treated as non-persons or dead people. Non-persons do not have the right to live and in fact many bio-ethicists suggest that these people should be treated as organ donors.

    Dr. Steven Laureys, the prominent neurologist from Belgium diagnosed Houben as being in a locked-in syndrome rather than PVS based on a brain scan that indicated that Houben's brain was functioning at near to normal response.

    Dr. Laureys has released a new study concerning PVS stating: "Anyone who bears the stamp of 'unconscious' just one time hardly ever gets rid of it again." He also stated that: "There may be many similar cases of false comas around the world," and "patients classed in a vegetative state are often misdiagnosed."

    The concern about misdiagnosing PVS is not new. Professor Keith Andrews in the UK stated several years ago in his study that 43% of people diagnosed as PVS are misdiagnosed. This is a significant concern in the UK ever since the 1993 court decision that determined that Tony Bland could be dehydrated to death, even though he was not otherwise dying. Since that decision, many people in the UK, who were not otherwise dying, have died by dehydration because it had been determined that they were in PVS.

    For instance, Terri Schiavo was dehydrated to death in 2005 based on her diagnosis of PVS and the insistence by her husband that she did not want to live in this manner.

    In March 2004, I had the opportunity to be at a presentation in Rome by Dr. Laureys concerning people in a vegetative state. At that presentation Dr. Laureys showed us brain scans of people in PVS and compared them to people who were healthy. By analyzing the brain scans he was able to show us the injured parts of the brain of the PVS patients. He then compared the brain scans of people in PVS to healthy people who were sleeping. There were incredible similarities between the scans of the healthy people who were sleeping to the people who were PVS. He concluded that other than the identifiable injured areas of the brain, medical experts know less about PVS than they would like to admit.

    At the same Congress I heard a presentation by an Italian physician who operated an "Awakening Centre." Awakening centers are places that focus on recovery for people who are in a coma state. This physician explained how the use of stimulation techniques have resulted in incredible successes at regaining consciousness for their patients. At a similar Congress in Rome in 2007 I listened to a Polish physician explain about his incredible success at awakening his patients who are in a coma state. How many awakening centers exist in the world? How many in North America?

    As executive director of the Euthanasia Prevention Coalition I have received many phone calls from friends or family members of people who are in coma. My experience is that medical professionals are too quick to give up on people who are in a coma or cognitively disabled. Family members are often pressured into withdrawing medical treatment or pressured into removing food and fluids from the person in coma, even before they were given a reasonable opportunity for recovery.

    Medical professionals need to be far more careful before diagnosing a patient as PVS. If society rejects Hippocratic medicine and accepts euthanasia, the time would come where people in PVS would be treated as non-persons, euthanized out of a concept of false compassion or used as an organ donor based on utilitarian ethics. Since approximately 40% of PVS cases are misdiagnosed, and since the PVS diagnosis is often treated like a death sentence, therefore society needs to reject the current paradigm by once again treating people in coma states as human beings deserving of care.

    We must reject the dehumanizing of the PVS patient and develop new techniques to offer them new opportunities for recovery.

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:18:08 PM PST · 93 of 95
    count-your-change to metmom
    Quite so. Remember those so-called “14 points” or whatever it was on the other thread? Evolution defined as variation, variation is proof of evolution. Ahemmm.
  • Baltimore to be center of abortion debate

    11/24/2009 4:16:11 PM PST · 24 of 24
    wagglebee to GonzoII
    Pinged from Terri Dailies

  • During Baltimore assembly, bishops to consider revised directives on withdrawal of food, water

    11/24/2009 4:15:25 PM PST · 49 of 51
    wagglebee to GonzoII; Ohioan from Florida; Goodgirlinred; Miss Behave; cyn; AlwaysFree; amdgmary; ...
    Baltimore is taking the first step in forcing abortion.

    Thread by GonzoII.

    Baltimore to be center of abortion debate

    Both sides of the abortion debate will be focusing on Baltimore today, when the City Council is expected to approve a first-in-the-nation law imposing new regulations on faith-based organizations that try to steer women away from the procedure.

    The measure, introduced by council President Stephanie C. Rawlings-Blake at the behest of Planned Parenthood of Maryland, would require that crisis pregnancy centers that do not provide abortions or birth control post signs saying so.

    Proponents frame the effort as a matter of public health. They accuse the centers of giving false or misleading information about the effects of abortion and birth control. Pregnant women, they say, should be told when they are not being given access to all of the options legally available to them.

    But officials at such centers say they make their mission clear. They say the information they give is accurate, and making them advertise the services that they don't provide would be an unprecedented form of harassment.

    "It really impugns our integrity," said Carol A. Clews, executive director of the Greater Baltimore Center for Pregnancy Concerns, which has two locations in the city and a third in Dundalk. "We are very forthright about what we do here and what we don't do. To put us in a position where we would have to put up a sign is offensive." . . .

  • Eluana Englaro's Father Now Making Waves as a Euthanasia Activist

    11/24/2009 4:11:34 PM PST · 3 of 5
    wagglebee to 185JHP; 230FMJ; 69ConvertibleFirebird; Albion Wilde; Aleighanne; Alexander Rubin; ...
    Moral Absolutes Ping!

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  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:11:34 PM PST · 92 of 95
    ElectricStrawberry to metmom

    Is that nonsense all you got?

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:11:28 PM PST · 5 of 14
    hennie pennie to wagglebee
    You're right! And what about all those cases years ago, we'd hear about people in PVS being taken to the dentist, where they were given strong shots of valium, prior to the exam -- and sometimes, people in "PVS" woke right up and started talking! from an injection of common old ordinary Valium!!
  • Eluana Englaro's Father Now Making Waves as a Euthanasia Activist

    11/24/2009 4:11:11 PM PST · 2 of 5
    wagglebee to cgk; Coleus; cpforlife.org; narses; Salvation; 8mmMauser

    Pro-Life Ping

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:10:48 PM PST · 4 of 14
    SandRat to wagglebee

    O-Bozos Health Czar would have pulled the plug 22 years ago

  • Eluana Englaro's Father Now Making Waves as a Euthanasia Activist

    11/24/2009 4:10:39 PM PST · 1 of 5
    wagglebee
    "They wanted to make me a scapegoat, and I was charged with homicide, aggravated further because I was the father of Eluana," said Beppino Englaro. "But I did nothing but act with due respect for legality and transparency."

    No, you MURDERED your daughter and now you are becoming an "activist" in an attempt to legitimize your crime.

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:10:01 PM PST · 91 of 95
    ElectricStrawberry to RoadGumby

    Then stick to the echo chamber and tell your buddy to stop perverting science to match his theology and stop posting this nonsense under a science keyword in the news category.

    Stop pretending that GGG is on a Holy crusade. His self-appointed job is to peddle lies, nothing more.

    ...and your rant aside, my “science” is not only helping this country, it is also helping India...directly. Unless saving lives is a worthless endeavor that only us heathens care about .

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:09:09 PM PST · 90 of 95
    metmom to count-your-change

    Then it gets into defining *science* and with the track record that evos have with definitions like *species* and *evolution*, pinning them down on that will be like nailing jello to a wall.

  • Baltimore to be center of abortion debate

    11/24/2009 4:06:36 PM PST · 23 of 24
    wagglebee to GonzoII; 185JHP; 230FMJ; 69ConvertibleFirebird; Albion Wilde; Aleighanne; Alexander Rubin; ...
    Moral Absolutes Ping!

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  • The Best Videos in the world of our Unborn Neighbors

    11/24/2009 4:05:05 PM PST · 5 of 5
    wagglebee to GonzoII; 185JHP; 230FMJ; 69ConvertibleFirebird; Albion Wilde; Aleighanne; Alexander Rubin; ...
    Moral Absolutes Ping!

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  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 4:03:28 PM PST · 89 of 95
    count-your-change to metmom
    One of those silly and meaningless throw-aways. Water is wet, up is like down but opposite. science is hard, what does that mean?
    What science? what part? Hard in what way? Total graffiti.
  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:01:53 PM PST · 3 of 14
    wagglebee to 185JHP; 230FMJ; 69ConvertibleFirebird; Albion Wilde; Aleighanne; Alexander Rubin; ...
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  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 4:00:18 PM PST · 2 of 14
    wagglebee to cgk; Coleus; cpforlife.org; narses; Salvation; 8mmMauser

    Pro-Life Ping

  • Commentary: The Significance of that Case of the Man Trapped in a "Coma" for 23 Years

    11/24/2009 3:59:51 PM PST · 1 of 14
    wagglebee
    Medical professionals need to be far more careful before diagnosing a patient as PVS. If society rejects Hippocratic medicine and accepts euthanasia, the time would come where people in PVS would be treated as non-persons, euthanized out of a concept of false compassion or used as an organ donor based on utilitarian ethics.

    This is EXACTLY what is happening.

  • American Music Awards: Adam Lambert outrages viewers with X-rated AMA performance

    11/24/2009 3:41:53 PM PST · 79 of 79
    Caipirabob to fieldmarshaldj
    Gay.

    We'll need a new word to encompass this.

    How about "Gay-tard"...

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 3:37:20 PM PST · 88 of 95
    metmom to Oztrich Boy; RoadGumby; tpanther; GodGunsGuts; Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus; YHAOS; ...
    Science is hard. Go with what makes you feel good.

    Oh, it's not that hard at all. There's nothing fancy or complicated about using the scientific method.

    That's just a myth perpetrated for the purposes of slamming non-scientists as unintelligent or lazy, as you just did.

    What's your degree in, BTW? What area of scientific study have you engaged in?

  • Good Morning America Cancels Adam Lambert Concert

    11/24/2009 3:31:33 PM PST · 47 of 47
    b9 to lovecraft
    I think the only thing I even watch on ABC nowadays is Jeopardy. Um...isn't Jeopardy on NBC?
  • The Best Videos in the world of our Unborn Neighbors

    11/24/2009 3:16:56 PM PST · 4 of 5
    cpforlife.org to Coleus; nickcarraway; narses; Mr. Silverback; Canticle_of_Deborah; TenthAmendmentChampion; ...

    20 weeks from conception

    Please Freepmail me if you want on or off my Pro-Life Ping List.
  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 2:44:40 PM PST · 87 of 95
    Oztrich Boy to ElectricStrawberry

    Science is hard. Go with what makes you feel good.

  • Baltimore to be center of abortion debate

    11/24/2009 2:24:59 PM PST · 22 of 24
    Blue Collar Christian to GonzoII

    You know, Gonzo Twice, it just warms my heart to see how concerned Planned Parenthood is for the welfare of pregnant women. You can hardly even tell that sales might be suffering because of the “subversive campaign” of the non-abortion help centers. It’s only fair that we level the killing field. (Did I type that with my “outside keyboard”?)

  • Good Morning America Cancels Adam Lambert Concert

    11/24/2009 2:06:34 PM PST · 46 of 47
    massgopguy to dfwgator

    What about “Hold Me Closer Tony Danza” by Elton John?

  • Good Morning America Cancels Adam Lambert Concert

    11/24/2009 2:06:25 PM PST · 45 of 47
    massgopguy to dfwgator

    What about “Hold Me Closer Tony Danza” by Elton John?

  • Baltimore to be center of abortion debate

    11/24/2009 2:05:57 PM PST · 21 of 24
    Mrs. Don-o to sickoflibs
    Agreed, there's a lot of bad stuff going on. To the extent that I have the breath and spit in me, I'm agin' all of it.

    But there's no point to this particular proposed law except the harrassment of pregnancy support centers, and a camel's-nose to completely regulate them out of existence.

    Twenty-nine of every 30 people engaged in pregnancy center work are volunteers, sometimes offering medical services (for which they are licensed already by the state), including ultrasound and STD testing, but always involved with pregnancy testing, lay and peer counseling, parenting classes, referrals to health resources, and programs for healing after abortion.

    This is a typical website for a pregnancy aid center which, as you can see, makes perfectly clear what kind of information and counseling they're offering. No need to say "no pharmacy on-site", "no veterinary services," "no frozen foods and dairy section" because they tell you up-front what kind of center they are and what their services are.

    Thw largest network of pregnancy centers, called Heartbeat, already posts this comprehensive Commitment of Care and Competence in every center. You'll notice they advertise that they "We do not offer, recommend or refer for abortions or abortifacients/"

    Then what's the big deal about the proposed Baltimore law?

    The big deal is that legislation developed by the enemies of Pregnancy Centers (e.g. the abortion industry and their allies) is predicated on a completely spurious claim of "need" (when in fact there is no evidence of any deception, harm, tort or fraud involved in the centers) and proceeds from an intention to entangle them in endless political and legal hassles.

    The pending legislation in Baltimore is an opening-wedge strategy, an offensive pretext and a dangerous precedent. The opening salvo in a an incremental strategy (of which we are well aware) aimed at hounding life-saving ministries out of existence.

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 2:01:41 PM PST · 86 of 95
    metmom to RoadGumby; ElectricStrawberry; GodGunsGuts; Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus; YHAOS; ...
    Electric, This post was started by GGG. Why is it necessary for you to enter in? You obviously have no desire in you for anything besides trying to ridicule someone.

    It's obvious. It's merely a new tactic by the evos.

    It obviously eats at them that they can't control FR. They have no say in the placement of the threads and that just irks them beyond measure.

    So, instead of just letting them go, they swarm the threads in mockery and derision in the attempt to either destroy any chance the thread has of discussing the shortcomings of the ToE, or to drive people away, or to provoke someone into saying something that will get creationists banned.

    When was the last time you saw an evo join up on a thread that GGG posted that he did not ping them to, and actually discuss or refute the content of the article?

    The first words off any evos keyboard are snarky, dismissive, ridicule.

    They simply cannot tolerate the thought that someone thinks differently than they do and if they can't control the forum, like they do with the public schools, they will harass and mock people in an attempt to drive them off, or so destroy the thread that no one wants to join.

    Interesting behavior from those who pride themselves on rationality and objectiveness.

    For all their claims to objectiveness, they are singularly incapable of apparently even trying to see the debate from any other point of view or being willing to let others believe as they want.

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 1:54:15 PM PST · 85 of 95
    demshateGod to GodGunsGuts

    How do you argue with these guys all the time? Not to mention they bring out the same tired remarks every time but their tactics are so annoying. I can’t even stand it. You have more patience than me that’s for sure.

    So you admit so you admit, so what you’re saying is, so what you’re saying is...........

    “If it wasn’t for Darwin we wouldn’t have tang, Penicillin, calculus, microwaves, or Beethoven’s 7th symphony. You flatearthers”

    Ugh!

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 1:52:33 PM PST · 84 of 95
    demshateGod to GodGunsGuts

    How do you argue with these guys all the time? Not to mention they bring out the same tired remarks every time but their tactics are so annoying. I can’t even stand it. You have more patience than me that’s for sure.

    So you admit so you admit, so what you’re saying is, so what you’re saying is...........

    Ugh!

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 1:51:34 PM PST · 83 of 95
    xcamel to MNDude

    If grimygophergonads had a brain, he/she/it would be focusing his/her/its energy on that tact...

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 1:48:33 PM PST · 82 of 95
    demshateGod to Behemoth the Cat

    It’s not just a matter of trying to fit God in with the natural world. It’s allowing the Bible to mean what it says. God told us how he did it. He gave us a time line of creation which includes Adam and told us there’s a definite line from Adam to Christ. If we throw out Adam, what do we do with Christ? Why should we believe he existed? God said Christ was the second Adam. If Adam was a metaphor, then Christ is just as much. I’m not going to trust my eternity to a metaphor.

    So what do we do with all the “proof” that God was lying to us? Funny thing is, the “science” isn’t as infallible as we were told by the government worker who taught it to us.

    Creation itself bares witness that what God says happened, really did happen.

    Oh Good, we’re now enlightened and have no reason to doubt the Bible. But wait! There are others who are being turned away from Christ by fables and sheilded from the truth through a tax funded, compulsory prohibition. Well, we tried to fight that but failed because Marxism is so ingrained in the public institutions that they’re lost.

    Well, there are still free conduits of information available where the truth can be distributed and we must.

    If we were to do what you say, we’d have to ignore or rewrite huge portion of scripture. Do you see how we’d then have a man-centered religion? Instead of God telling us what He said, it’d but up to man to be constantly redefining what He said based on constant enlightenment.

    To answer your question more directly. God could have made the earth with age and he could have made tiny fossils for some reason. That wouldn’t change that the Bible clearly teaches the earth is no more than 10,000 years old and death didn’t exist until Adam, a real person, sinned.

    It also wouldn’t mean we should trust in radiocarbon dating or geologic columns.

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 1:42:41 PM PST · 81 of 95
    metmom to TooFarGone; GodGunsGuts
    Let’s hear it for rational discourse governed by consistent processes of inquiry based on observable phenomena and repeatable experiments. Ahh the free market place of theories where ideas stand or fall on their accumulated merits and facts not on the emotional attachment to unprovable beliefs.

    The free market of ideas allowed the Constitution which says ....When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

    Looks like Christianity proved itself for rational discourse and accumulated merits in providing the basis for this document.

  • Baltimore to be center of abortion debate

    11/24/2009 1:23:52 PM PST · 20 of 24
    sickoflibs to Mrs. Don-o; sometime lurker; GonzoII
    I live in Maryland and Baltimore is doing much worse stuff than this.

    They were investigating whether to prosecute the ACORN expos-ea film-makers. Maryland tried to prosecute Linda Tripp. The mayor is on criminal trial for criminal activities but still holds office.

    If the law required the centers to post a health warning on carrying out pregnancies to birth I'd be concerned. But they have no intention of providing an abortion so the pregnant woman has a right to know that, freedom of association.

  • The Darwin Anniversary

    11/24/2009 1:23:28 PM PST · 80 of 95
    demshateGod to Ira_Louvin

    Do you all go to school to learn that tactic? Strawman after strawman after strawman after strawman. “So then you admit there’s no empirical evidence?” “So then you’re saying the pope is a pedophile?” “When did you stop beating your wife?” “Oh I see, well then, I’m done with you.”

    It’s so annoying and childish. It’s the way a 13 year old girl would argue and think she’s so smart because her parent wont bite.