Free Republic

"Bush gives no such reasons to be hated, but they do anyway."

I beg to differ. A spoilt rich kid in business with the bin Ladens, a liar and a footrest for Vincente Fox. He's more open borders than Clinton was.
And what were the reasons to hate Clinton? His infidelity and bad taste in women? Newt Gingrich did something 100 times more morally reprehensible, yet is still revered by the "moral majority." That shows me that republicans do not take morality seriously if they aren't willing to kick this reprehensible cad to the curb.

FOC still proudly independent.

"I don't recall any "Love America" rallies inspired by the Clinton policies?"

That's because only neo-cons use patriotism to promote war and liken love of country with war. At least democrats don't use our troops (human beings) as human shields against criticism of their admin's policies.

"I doubt that anybody who loved America would counter protest a rally if they had one."

I love America and I took to the streets to protest the war against the Serbs. I'd do it again too.

Hi Whiteguy: I agree with you 100%. I used to be a liberal, and still hold some liberal views. Your post is reasonable, but not to partisans. I like that we have some balance, it is what makes this country great. The problem is, now, that we don't have a viable third party. We have globalists. One side wants us to be "part" of the global community, the other wants us to dominate it.

"I would wager that many, if not most of the people who feel the need to "protest" love this land as much as you or I."

The above stament is true, but in your post you stereotyped protesters as commies. They could say the same of you, stating that you want a theocracy and a slave wage population. But that would not be true, no more than your portrayal of those who oppose this war. I protested the Kosovo war, proudly. I endured obnoxious marines yelling slurs at elderly Serbian men who fought in WW2 and a bunch of save Mumia commies asking me why I want to save Mumia. I opposed (but didn't protest) the first and second Iraq wars. I don't feel this nation should involve itself in wars where there's no national interest. That is not a liberal stance, it is a traditional conservative issue. I want the "free trade" agreements both parties support abolished. I want immigration stopped cold. I want liberals who don't tax and spend, and conservatives who don't borrow and spend. I want the national debt paid off. I don't want half the people to be living on $6.00 an hour without medical benefits, because I will have to pay their medical and subsidize their housing. I don't want religion in the schools, because lack of separation of church and state has been a disaster around the world. Likewise, enforced atheism has as well. I want reasonable environmental protections, and open space, and an abundant diversity of wildlife. I want civilized behavior in America, from all people.

Just because I oppose globalism, whatever it's form (both liberals and conservatives are globalists), doesn't mean I am a liberal or a conservative. I am an American, and proud that I have a choice in a "few" of the above mentioned issues. I would like a national referendum, and a viable third party who addresses the issues neither two establishment parties will.

Oh, that'll go over well.

That's right. It's high time we GRACIOUSLY accept helpfrom others instead of always being the helpers. In this case, no chest-thumping or flag waving may save our people, and yes, occasionally we do require assistance.

I assume Freepers will take this opportunity to put down yet another nation. To some, patriotism means hating everyone outside the U.S. and creating bad will, as if we're at a high school football game.

Thanks Valdy, from this "black sheep" Freep.

I hate to say it, but if you support overpopulating this nation, increased pollution, and increased costs in countering it will be the result. I appreciate the efforts of environmentalists because without emissions regs, methinks we'd be in deep doo-doo in Caleeeforneea.

If it's a pro-war rally, I can't be there. Why can't you be pro-troops and at the same time want them home? And why are pro-war rallies called "love America" and "support our troops?" I support our troops and as such want them home with us.

Religion conflicts make strange bedfellows. His own people removed him. If the church is made up of Arab Christians, then that church should have a say, not Muslims or Jews.

"If the cowardly Europeans had shown a United front agains terrorists when this thing started it would be over now."

BULL. What about Israel, friend? Are they "cowardly" in the face of terrorist attacks? Has it worked? Just because a nation isn't belligerent doesn't make it cowardly.
Britain rightly has not just started firing missiles in the air out of anger. It would be cowardly if they knew exactly where the terrorist "camp" was, and didn't attack it. But attacking a perp you can't see is just plain stupid and belligerent.

"They didnt, They showed themselves to be ripe for terrorism and the terrorists have ripened. They have no one to blame but their cowardly leaders. You show a bully you are scared and that bully will have his fun with you."

Bull. Acting unfraid and dropping bombs does not deter terrorism any more than the death penalty deters a true psychopath. In fact, it helps terrorist ranks swell. They haven't hit the US against because they haven't chose to, and in your heart, you know it. People unfraid to die are not repelled by the thought of "western justice." Sorry but true. Attacking and insulting other victim nations will not change this, but it may give you a false sense of security.

I am one who does cite our constant interventionism and meddling for our being targeted for terrorism. But I am getting to the "ignorant" point where I am not thinking about the roots of the conflict anymore. Regardless of whether what they say is true, targeting innocent people like this is counter-productive and an OUTRAGE. I mean, I can respect resistance to occupation and even understand the message when they target oil pipelines contractors are building. I can understand them targeting armed military people, or politicians. But folks staying at a hotel? A bus? A train? Now they are even killing fellow Muslims. They, not traditional military power, will defeat themselves with unconscionable acts like this. Hopefully we will not convince peaceful Muslims that we, rather than they, are their enemy. Clearly they are more than happy to kill Muslims, and Muslims should see that this bombing is proof of that. At some point, people will say enough!

Correction: Carr brothers had a .380. I said .280! In a hurry, gotta go pick up my neice at the train (prayers it doesn't get blown up?).

"Actually, I heard witnesses this morning from London who said that after the guy through the backpack into the train yesterday, everyone shouted to stop him as he ran and several people gave chase but he got away. It was not my impression that everyone just sat around."

Thanks Pete. I doubt Brits attacked the people who allowed themselves to be taken hostage by men weilding box cutters
on 911. Unfortunately, patriotism in this country now means hating everyone else instead of just loving your country..

You are replying to what Savage said. The report said the people saw him, and police then told them to get down, then out. Savage is an idiot.

"Really. All those bystanders and they just let them walk away? I realize the situation must have been chaotic, but found this really disturbing."

It happens all the time in America, like it or not. When the Carr brothers made it clear they were about to shoot five people in the back of the head after they obediently knelt (the guy only had a little .280), not one of the men risked his life, not even as he heard his friends being shot one by one. They obediently knelt and got one in the back of the head.

Lets not pretend that we are braver than anyone else.

"Savage said it best yesterday. If these bombers were in the US, they would have been beaten to death by US civilians. The Brits(Londoners) just stood around(with a stiff upper lip) and did nothing after their bombs fizzled.

If this happened in the suburbs of London, these bombers would have been killed by the Brits. Londoners are a lost liberal cause."

Why is it that even with allies, victims, that conservatives always find a way to put others' down?

Of course we all fancy ourselves as brave, but Americans, even when they knew their man was a terrorist, allowed him to hold them hostage with box cutters. Savage can spare me his false bravado. Besides, I wouldn't tackle anyone if armed police were on the job.

If the true reason for this was Iraq (though I don't believe that), I do blame Bush, the senior first and the junior too. When we originally attacked, there was zero national interest. They had done nothing to us.
I am actually surprised Serbs didn't retaliate, because likewise, they hadn't messed with us when Clinton decided to attack them.

This all must be really exciting to the IRA. I hope they don't try to out do them. I am shocked that they hit the same place twice. I reasoned they were taking a western tour. I was wrong. Still I find it very very odd that they haven't hit soft targets here in the states since 911.
They are certainly capable and unafraid to do it. Brace yourselves, it is only a matter of time.
I am one who believes in non-intervention, but if we pulled out of Iraq now it would convince them they can control our foreign policy via terror. If I were in charge, I'd say for every person they kill, we will stay one week longer.

You are right about that. But I should say that republicans have a strong desire for vengeance, while Christ did not when He was here among us.

While I agree with you, I, a Christian, didn't vote for Bush. I always go independent because no establishment party wants to deal with immigration, unfair trade and the national debt.