Posted on 07/09/2015 9:33:36 AM PDT by RnMomof7
"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one" (Luke 22:36 AV).
That's Jesus' command, and should not have been omitted from your list; all the major commentators say so. It is worthwhile to examine the context and study this situation out.
If the South Carolina church members had been obeying this command, their meeting would not have been a gun-free zone and doubtless the shooter would not have gotten his way with them. Peter and another, even at the Last Supper/First Communion had their sidearms with them, and Jesus told them all to get one.
Today that would be equivalent to being armed with a personal weapon, even in church, not excluding even in the communion service.
That's what I'm saying. This type of church eventually fails for lack of disciplers nurturing "the weak brother(s)" out of passivity into spiritual effectiveness, at least to the state of being young spiritual adults who have overcome the wicked ones, and are able to rule rheir own spirit, This should be the major goal for every member of the church.
The pastor cannot do it all, nor does Christ expect that he will. That's not the plan.
Everything not God can go bad. And in the “orders” of the Catholic church what happens is periods of laxity finally ended in a reform which upsets a lot of people. Similarly with the lay adjuncts of orders.
When Dominic and Francis got going, even the orders most people think of as paradigmatically austere, were conspicuously wealthy. When Dominic went on a early mission he advised the hoity-toity clergy who wanted to accompany him to send their horses and their servants home. To their credit the bishops and abbots did so.
And in our 800 years, the lay Dominicans have often decayed into a sort of club. Though right now in Vietnam, there are 200k members of the Dominican laity and some of them have kicked up a respectable and effective fuss in the conflicts with the government.
I mention these lay groups, complete with their flaws and liabilities because, well, when the judges are unjust, we can pray that God will raise up some determined widows.
So, I “cope” by expanding my vision and reminding myself that God is at the helm. Maybe this parish or chapter will fade. This grass here may wither, those flowers fade, but the Word of Our God endures forever. And, if we take the evangelical command seriously, that's what matters.
Read +Gregory Palamas, anything by him. And read this:
http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles6/KalomirosRiverFire.php
Wow! Long read, but so much worth it. Marvelous explanations in that presentation. Thanks for posting it here.
I guess I have to challenge you to souvlaki at 15 paces.
I think I asked you before, but please suggest a title of +Palamas. The next book on my list is Cassian, who was much loved of Dominic.
I think the holy man is mistaken about us. But, it's true, I could be the one who is mistaken.
It seems to me that every theology is, so to speak, a step down from the basic idea. So I always read the guys your writer disparages as not ultimate. Even Anselm, who makes it hard, is only one (or more) step below the real truth, which is apophatic — or very nearly.
For me where the rubber met the road was in the encounter with patients, especially children and their families, in the hospital. Certainly theology INFORMED my work with them. But not so that I could parse their sins or mete out graces with a teaspoon. It was more about committing my body and my mind, and of course my words and gestures, to be a vehicle and conduit of THE Love.
I am well aware that my Order produced Aquinas. And I do not apologize. He was very great.
I am also all too aware of the great number of Catholics who are all about the guilt and the penalties, who treat the whole thing as an accounting transaction or a trial. Maybe it's my naivete, but I do not think bthe writers your Reverend gentleman calls slanderers are to blame for those who think God is something one approaches as if one were baking a cake or solving a puzzle.
And, again, almost ALL Catholic theology is driven by an evangelical and apologetic mission. I guess I always think, when I'm teaching: Look, it's KIND of like this. But not really. What it's REALLY like, no words can say.
Last year I realized the difference between a good Catholic teacher and a GREAT Catholic teacher. The good one teaches the right answer. The GREAT one lights a fire for the Truth. I have seen both.
I think you’re right.
But this is aside from the theme of the thread --
I know men at my church who come to church carrying.
And I’d trust them with my life. They’re honorable men with integrity who would lay down their lives to protect others should a shooter come in.
I was thinking of the orders as subject to the same waves of decadence and revival but also as a kind of cross-current. While other parishioners have the dynamic of the parish alone, we also have our sub-group and our sense of “vocation” and “charism” (which, in this case denotes a cluster of characteristics related to an order. For us: prayer, study, community, preaching, for example.)
So while the orders are subject to the same cycles, the rhythm may be different. So sometimes we vitalize a group, and sometimes the group vitalizes us.
The Triads
Thanks.
My Dad was a Methodist minister, and I have seen some of the inner works of the denomination. But I think in your terms one might consider their minister class as a distinct "order" separate from the common communicants, whom Methodists define as "the laity."
I'll have to consider this for a while, although this has no relationship to the polity of the kind of assembly in which I find fellowship. I left that approach almost as soon as I gained some Biblical discernment. But you can see what happens when women are considered for ordination. Eve's error continues.
More later, in another setting --
Souvlakia I know. Within a month, my crew and I will have cut up hundreds of pounds of lamb and pork to make hundreds of souvlas which the same crew will grill at our parish festival in early September, so beware, MD!
As for baklava, imardmd1, after 60+ years I can’t abide the stuff. Better to eat galaktobouriko or kataife or Greek halvah. To be fair, the Syrians/Lebanese and the Armenians both have wonderful forms of baklava, worthy of being a reward to the victor in a souvla duel...but not the Greek stuff!
Read The Triads and then we’ll discuss a duel!
A final note on Aristotle; some Greeks say that Christ’s Incarnation saved us Greeks from pagan Greek philosophy. Others say that the “sporoi tou Theou”, the seeds of God are found there.
I think you can work that out, but for starters here's a thought:
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(1) I'd like to be able to say that I trust other humans 100%, but knowing Jeremiah 17:9, my trust in other humans is not 100%, ever--it is a calculated risk. And that means it is statistical in nature. (In God we trust, everybody else demonstrate some level of reliability.)
(2) So, in any assembly of other humans, we are all sitting ducks, a 'gun-free zone' for some deranged possessor of a firearm, if no one else is allowed to carry a sidearm.
(3) If, on the other hand, if carrying is allowed, and if even one in that assembly is likely to carry, the statistics of an attacker to commit mass murder goes way down.
(4) Yet if such an assembly has only one member carrying a deadly weapon, the possibility of him/her opening up with it irrationally, though minute, is not zero, for only God knows his/her heart, nor the judgment of that member in a very heated moment (remember Peter's lack of spiritual judgment on Olivet).
(5) But if there is another member, also considered reliable, and is carrying, the probability of either of them endangering the assembly goes way, way down, eh? (6) That makes the decision of the group to follow Christ's command on this--and allow the assembly to enjoy the same rights as the general population--an entirely logical, reasonable, and acceptable one.
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That is why I would rather be attending a local church where one could pretty much be assured that others in the congregation would likely also be carrying. I would be greatly encouraged if the preacher (who would likely be at most of the meetings) was known to be setting the example.
Of course, for those attenders who have developed an irrational fear of personal firearms, it might be very wise to ask that licensed and well-concealed carry of deadly weapons (CCDW) would be the preferred mode of presence in the assembly. That also improves the situation, for a person with injurious intent would not know from which point a defending action would come. Or several points, hopefully.
I think it is really stupid of a church to make the rule those licensed to carry firearms are not allowed to bring them whenever they desire, especially when thoughtfully concealed.
See what I mean? I think that is why two is the minimum acceptable number acceptable, but more desired. (At the time of Jesus capture, the display of more than a couple of sidearms among his disciples might not have been very propitious to the occasion. They might have been taken to be a band of thieves and robbers. Jesus needed to get to the cross, not be executed summarily right there at His arrest. And actually, only two of the disciples had "happened" to have their sidearms.)
Thank you for your testimony on this issue.
The Passover meal, Seder, is simply a regular yearly memorial yearly observed (1) on the month and day that the Hebrews avoided the Death Angel and left Egypt under God's protection, and (2) used the same food that the Hebrews ate in their hurry-up departure meal. So the Seder is meant to literally replicate the original meal. The Jews have invented and included other symbolic features, like hiding the leaven, and an extra seat for Elijah (who came long after the Exodus), but these are embroideries of the real truth of delivery from oppression by crying out to God.
. . . what would you use to represent this “what-is-it”?
Manna has nothing to do with this, but was food supplied by God from Heaven, and I don't know why one would even want to try to duplicate or revive something that would turn to wormy garbage if it was kept overnight, and I don't know what the purpose would be. I wouldn't waste time on that, nor of inventing shoes and shirts that wouldn't wear out in forty years. I'd get kind of tired of all this, and want some new clothes, and onions, and garlic as well. Apparently manna was pretty bland and without nuch texture.
Spanakopita to you, friend . . .
Having sampled this, I think I might want to read it through. Thanks for posting.
You are welcome. Eat some spanakopita while you are reading. It’s good for you!
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