Three Things You're Probably Getting Wrong about Praying to the Saints

Shameless popery ^ | April 20, 2015

[smvoice]

It's gonna go something like this: the wafer becomes the literal body of Christ.. and Christ came from Mary. ...ergo...

I can see that happening in the near future. I really can..

[Elsie]

Consider the impact of this kind of contempt: does it really advance the kind of mutual respect we want to have?

[af_vet_1981]

That is an ignorant question coming from all except those who don't know or believe the scriptures...It has been scripturally answered on these forums for years... You keep asking the same question apparently hoping you will get a different answer that will agree with your unbiblical theory...

False

[Eucharista]

"The actions of Catholics..."

Again, it is an irrational and vacuous position. Refuting the Catholic teaching because of the actions of a few Catholics acting outside of her teaching makes as much sense as judging a medicine by its affects on those who don't take it.

[Iscool]

They in no way had authority to rule on whether what Paul taught about the Messiah was true or not. It was all true because Paul had that authority, not the Bereans.

Unlike Catholics they knew they could check the scripture to see if Paul was telling the truth???

Authority??? What authority??? That's a false concept of Catholicism...We don't need authority to read and understand the scriptures...

That's another area where you guys fail...They've convinced you (and you try to convince others) that their phoney interpretation of scripture (in spite of what scripture clearly say) is the result of some perceived authority...

Eph 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Do you understand that verse...How has your religion perverted that verse to make you think you can't understand what Paul wrote???

[Elsie]

Read #560...

[Resettozero]

makes as much sense as judging a medicine by its affects on those who don't take it.

Like those in trial studies who are given placebos?

("effects" is correct.)

[editor-surveyor]

.
If you’re praying to “the saints” you’re getting everything wrong.

First, it isn’t even remotely likely that any of them really are saints, and second, you have no permission from Yehova to pray to any dead human.

Like the idea of a permanent vacation to a very warm beach? Then pray on!
.

[af_vet_1981]

I’m sorry, did I say the Bereans had any authority? No I did not. I said that they searched the scriptures daily to see if the things that were said authoritatively were in fact scriptural. Which is exactly what we are called to do. That way we don’t end up believing nonsense spewed from fallible men who are somehow believed to possess truth from outside God’s Word.

You seem to be writing that the Bereans were capable of judging whether the things that were said authoritatively were in fact scriptural. The things that were said authoritatively were in fact scriptural, because the Apostle Paul was a chosen vessel of the LORD Jesus Christ and it was the Apostle Paul saying them. Searching the scriptures only helped the Bereans to believe him; it did not grant them any help in separating truth from error. There was no error. Concerning the Bereans, it was all about the evangelism of them by an apostle.

[daniel1212]

the views presented about Marian devotion in this forum have resulted in a distorted picture of the Church, much like the elephant as perceived by the six blind men...

An analogy: I once read with great interest a short book called "The Trail of Blood"

Your analogy is faulty if the issue is what RCs teach, which is what the poster responded to ("Nobody thinks that the saints...."), and what he cited does not present a false description about Marian devotion, nor a distorted picture of the Church since she allows such to abound, and which even comes from popes, as overall they are not seen to contradict official statements.

when comparing doctrines, the first thing you want to determine is whether the proposition or text you are discussing is actually a doctrine.

But when responding to statements, the first thing you want to determine is what the text you are discussing is actually referring to, which in thus case was in regard to the "Nobody thinks" how saints in heaven act, not what is officially taught. Which itself is subject to interpretation by RCs.

my advice would be to stick with authoritative summaries of doctrine, e.g. the Catechism. Or to ask a knowledgeable Catholic, "What do you mean by this?" with the expectation of a good-faith explanation.

CCC statements was not the issue, but what knowledgeable Catholics say about Mary. Changing the subject will not change that.

[ealgeone]

When does your religious community believe Revelation was written ?

Scholarship work suggests between 91-96 AD.

[Resettozero]

The things that were said authoritatively were in fact scriptural, because the Apostle Paul was a chosen vessel of the LORD Jesus Christ and it was the Apostle Paul saying them.

Then why don't Roman Catholics LISTEN and HEED Paul?

(Well, the Holy Spirit promptings through Paul.)

Why does the RCC downplay Paul's writings, even explain some of them away, while lifting up Peter and James?

[Eucharista]

"Even Esau...""Love" and "hate" are very poor translations of the underlying Hebrew words. "Love" is not an infatuation as we know it, but has more to do with recognizing the status of ones particular covenantal relationship with God and acting in loyal accord with the requirements of that relationship. Esau disdained his relationship and sold it for a bowl of soup. Similarly, "Hate" is the opposite--stating the lack of such a covenantal relationship. Jacob and his family maintained a covenantal relationship with Israel's God, Yahweh. Esau and his family do not have this relationship.

[Eucharista]

""This is my body..."

The body of Christ is not a work.

[editor-surveyor]

LOL!

Joseph should have written to Miss Manners.

The question is how did James, Jude, Simon and Andy get here?

Was she steppin’ out?

We know by the Bible that they were Mary’s kids, but where does it say they were Joseph’s?
.

[Resettozero]

"Love" and "hate" are very poor translations of the underlying Hebrew words. "Love" is not an infatuation as we know it, but has more to do with recognizing the status of ones particular covenantal relationship with God and acting in loyal accord with the requirements of that relationship. Esau disdained his relationship and sold it for a bowl of soup. Similarly, "Hate" is the opposite--stating the lack of such a covenantal relationship. Jacob and his family maintained a covenantal relationship with Israel's God, Yahweh. Esau and his family do not have this relationship.

True, but that is not the only way love and hate are referenced in the Hebrew. You paint a colorless outline of a very rich subject.

[smvoice]

That’s always been my question: why downplay Paul’s writings and his Christ-given role as Apostle to the Gentiles? Especially after studying Gal.2:2,9? It would seem the RCC would have a better shot claiming Paul as their first pope rather than Peter, who, along with the 11, agreed to confine their work to Israel while Paul went to the Gentiles.

[editor-surveyor]

.
The testimony of Polycarp is that Revelation was given to John in 91 AD.
.

[Resettozero]

We know by the Bible that they were Mary’s kids, but where does it say they were Joseph’s?

That's the SECOND question I have ready for Mary when I see her.

(She's not answering my calls at present.)

[Resettozero]

It would seem the RCC would have a better shot claiming Paul as their first pope rather than Peter, who, along with the 11, agreed to confine their work to Israel while Paul went to the Gentiles.

We are completely in agreement on this, Chief Free Small Voice.

R2z