Posted on 01/28/2015 7:00:21 AM PST by Stingray
Never said it was. Thanks.
“This hasn’t happened yet.”
It most certainly did, in the destruction of Jerusalem. Did you not read Luke 23:26-30? It the parallel passage to Revelation 6:15-17! And look at whom Jesus is addressing on His way to the cross!
Jesus turned and said to them, “Daughters of Jerusalem, do not weep for me; weep for yourselves and for your children. Luke 23:28 (NIV2011)
“This denial of the significance of modern events, especially the founding of Israel in 1948, opens doors wide for atheists and anti-Semites to harass us and is leading to open persecution of Christians.”
Nonsense! The church is a laughingstock precisely because it keeps trotting out the same old futurist date-setters and frauds! The truth is there is no basis for anti-Semitism in preterism, because the wrath of God fell solely upon that generation that crucified its king and persecuted His messengers!
Israel is a nation but is not a temple-bound religion or theocracy: that was all done away with in 70 AD!
“Yeah, yeah, and we are all living in the new earth and the new heaven. Satan is bound in hell and all unbelievers with him. NOT. Oh, there is NO historical evidence that Nero ever banished anyone to Patmos. Preterists don’t know history or scripture.”
First of all, you have no clue as to what that phrase “heaven and earth” represents, so of course you have no idea that His kingdom has already come! Christ said the kingdom of heaven was “at hand” when He walked the earth. It was ushered in in 70 AD. Your refusal to understand this does not constitute failure on my part to explain it.
Secondly, there is, in fact, a Syrian version of Revelation that does state unequivocally that John was exiled to Patmos by Nero:
THE SYRIAC VERSION OF THE APOCALYPSE
(Philoxenian Version)
Murdock Syriac (5th Century)
“The Revelation, which was made by God to John the Evangelist, in the island of Patmos, to which he was banished by Nero the Emperor.”
Etheridge Syriac (5th Century)
THE REVELATION WHICH WAS MADE UNTO JUHANON THE EVANGELIST, FROM ALOHA, IN PATHAMON THE ISLAND, WHITHER HE HAD BEEN CAST BY NERO CAESAR.
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/1897_gwynn_syriac-apocalypse.html
The 5th Century Syriac version of the apocalypse tells us precisely who put John on Patmos!
Your ignorance about a “lack of evidence” is not proof that such evidence does not exist: only that you’ve never bothered to look for it.
“You’re apparently trying to spread confusion...”
What you call “confusion”, I call “clarity.” But I can see how easily confused some would be by the truth when they’ve been led to believe lies all their lives.
“We read the word here.”
Based on what I’ve seen, I highly doubt that. It seems as though many get their eschatology from popular culture, not from Christ and the apostles.
It’s really rather apparent.
“Take the your destruction of the word somewhere that it is welcome.”
I understand how terribly frightening all of this must be to you, but there’s no reason to silence those with whom you disagree.
Or are you espousing your own “Christian Sharia” now?
.... Notice how it just goes to no audio when the so called horse shows up, it means that it was added in later. ...and or its a reflection from the camera is the object moves at the same speed the camera does..... Focus your attention to the far right of the screen where the black boarder is while looking at the horseman peripherally, the horseman & camera man move in unison even going up in unison.
Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.
“This hasn’t happened yet.”
It most certainly did, in the destruction of Jerusalem. Did you not read Luke 23:26-30? It the parallel passage to Revelation 6:15-17! And look at whom Jesus is addressing on His way to the cross!
The quote from John in Revelation uses the same phrases that Jesus did. That’s not a parallel; that’s an apostle remembering what his Lord said.
Jesus did speak a lot on the destruction of Herod’s temple. I don’t know how that precludes anything else after that happening to the Jews or the Gentile “graft on the tree” - Christians - and why the Bible would suddenly go silent about that.
The few sects that tried to impose a date on God the Father (Matthew 24:36) were laughingstocks.
Most of today’s churches are laughingstocks not because of futurism, but because they don’t believe the Bible is relevant to today; that they can interpret/twist/torture the meaning of passages to make their congregations comfortable with their current Godless lifestyles.
The idea that there is prophecy yet unfulfilled and the full wrath of God has not yet been unfurled is far from comforting.
And now we see the anti-Semitism I mentioned.
The ongoing survival of Israel is a God-given miracle. And FYI, they are making progress to bring back the Temple and the Sanhedrin. Like the horrors of the Holocaust were used by God to form modern Israel, He will use the unthinkable devastation of a nuclear exchange to bring back the Jewish theocracy. Man’s evil is inevitable in our world; God always uses it to bring good into the world.
You’re good!
You claim it was Nero who banished John to Patmos? Nero had both Peter and Paul executed yet Preterists would have us believe that he only exiled John to Patmos. Preposterous.
In A.D. 60, Laodicea had been almost entirely destroyed by an earthquake. Yet Preterists would have us believe that, as stated in Revelation 3:17, they had in a short 8 years considered themselves "rich and in need of nothing".
One could go on and on with the discrepancies Preterists have with both scripture and history. Preterism is a false teaching and considered "another gospel" and should be considered accursed as Paul said.
.
Nothing frightening about any of it.
Preterism Satan’s confusion from top to bottom, and we are guaranteed total victory over it, at the last trump.
There is no “eschatology” for preterists; they will rise at the Great White Throne to be cast into the “second death” of outer darkness.
.
“In A.D. 60, Laodicea had been almost entirely destroyed by an earthquake. Yet Preterists would have us believe that, as stated in Revelation 3:17, they had in a short 8 years considered themselves “rich and in need of nothing”.”
I think you had better research your facts a little more closely. Laodicea rebuilt itself - without any help from Rome - precisely becuae it was “rich and had need of nothing”, owing to its trade in fine, black wool.
“One of the famous cities of Asia, Laodicea, was that same year overthrown by an earthquake, and, without any relief from us, recovered itself by its own resources.”
http://classics.mit.edu/Tacitus/annals.10.xiv.html
This is why John could write:
You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked. Revelation 3:17 (NIV2011)
“And now we see the anti-Semitism I mentioned.”
Just like a liberal: always quick to place the race card when you can’t argue with facts.
Seriously, between you’re “he’s an anti-Semite” screeds and editor’s “preterists need to be silenced and are going to hell” rants, I don’t know whether I’m talking to Christians or the Taliban!
“Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.”
I’m not the one telling others they’re going to hell here. I’m not the one telling others they need to be silenced! I’m not the one calling others “anti-Semite.”
I’m discussing the issues: others are the ones making it “personal.” Maybe you could read the entire thread before jumping in to take a side, please?
“If they were written to the Thessalonians and have already happened, there should be some historical record of them happening. Please cite a historical record of that prophecy happening in the past:
a) Jesus descending from heaven with a shout
b) with the voice of the archangel
c) with the trump of God
d) the dead in Christ rising first (into the clouds)
e) living Christians caught up together with them in the clouds
f) all of these people meeting Jesus Christ in the air
g) all of them remaining with the Lord Jesus Christ for ever after that.”
And if these had actually been physical events, and not spiritual, there would be a historical record of them.
However, had you read the link I posted from David Curtis, you would’ve seen how all this played out, ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE! I’d strongly suggest going back to read that link I posted to you so that you can understand this!
“...they are making progress to bring back the Temple and the Sanhedrin.”
Then they are doing so against the expressed will of God through the last sacrifice, Jesus Christ. Not my words. Read the book of Hebrews, for one.
I did. I’m sorry, I don’t have time to respond to it, there are just too many points that he has wrong.
I always quickly check out the Matthew Henry Bible Commentary for each verse and see what it says. If I need more interpretation I continue searching elsewhere.
So I would have to do this for each of those quotes he has, and write up something that addresses each point he makes.
His excursis exhibits very weak/poor exegesis in a number of cases.
If I get time I will try to get back to that for you; if you’d like to start to analyze the differences between his excursis and the MHBC for the same verses, you can do that on biblegateway.com; just click on the STUDY THIS blue box next to Scripture text. There are a number of other resources there as well.
“...there are just too many points that he has wrong.”
From your point-of-view. Your way is not the way the apostles saw or taught, though.
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