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A Christian without the Church is purely idealistic, Pope says
cna ^ | May 15, 2014 | Elise Harris

Posted on 05/15/2014 2:15:20 PM PDT by NYer

Pope Francis speaks to pilgrims during his Wednesday General Audience on April 23, 2014 Credit: Kyle Burkhart/CNA
Pope Francis speaks to pilgrims during his Wednesday General Audience on April 23, 2014 Credit: Kyle Burkhart/CNA

Vatican City, May 15, 2014 / 07:43 am (CNA/EWTN News).- Pope Francis reflected in his daily Mass on how the apostles evangelized by first telling the history of God’s people, explaining that it’s impossible to understand a Christian without this association.
    
“You cannot understand a Christian outside of the people of God. The Christian is not a monad,” but “belongs to a people: the Church,” the Pope observed in his May 15 homily.

“A Christian without a church is something purely idealistic, it is not real.”

Beginning by looking to the first reading, taken from the Acts of the Apostles, the Roman Pontiff addressed those gathered in the Vatican’s Saint Martha guesthouse by recalling how when Paul preached in Antioch, he did so by first recounting the whole of Israel’s salvation history.

“Jesus does not make sense without this history” because he “is the end of this story, (the end) toward which this story goes, toward which it walks,” he noted, so “you cannot understand a Christian outside of the people of God.”

“You cannot understand a Christian alone, just like you cannot understand Jesus Christ alone” the Pope went on to say, explaining that “Jesus Christ did not fall from the sky like a superhero who comes to save us.”

“No. Jesus Christ has a history. And we can say, and it is true, that God has a history because He wanted to walk with us. And you cannot understand Jesus Christ without His history.”

Pope Francis then described how a Christian without a history, a nation or the Church “is incomprehensible,” saying that it’s “a thing of the laboratory, an artificial thing, a thing that cannot give life.”

Drawing attention to the importance of remembering this “dimension of history,” the Bishop of Rome observed that a Christian is “a living memory of his people’s journey, he is the living memory of his Church.”

“Then, where is this people going? Toward the ultimate promise. It is a people walking toward fullness; a chosen people which has a promise for the future and walks toward this promise, toward the fulfillment of this promise.”

In order to do this Christians within the Church must be men and women “with hope: hope in the promise,” the Pope went on, noting that “It is not expectation: no, no! That’s something else: It is hope.”

“Right, on we go! (Toward) that which does not disappoint.”

Explaining how a Christian is also someone who remembers, the pontiff encouraged all present to “seek the grace of memory, always” so that by doing so and also looking forward with hope they might be a Christian who “follows the path of God and renews the covenant with God.”

This type of Christian constantly tells the Lord “Yes, I want the commandments, I want your will, I will follow you” he continued, adding that “He is a man of the covenant, and we celebrate the covenant, every day” in the Mass, therefore a Christian is “a woman, a man of the Eucharist.”

Concluding his reflections, Pope Francis encouraged all present to “think about our Christian identity,” stating that “Our Christian identity is belonging to a people: the Church.”

“Without this, we are not Christians” he observed, noting how “we entered the Church through baptism: there we are Christians.”

“For this reason, we should be in the habit of asking for the grace of memory, the memory of the journey that the people of God has made,” the pontiff said, and “also of personal memory: What God did for me, in my life, how has he made me walk…”

Praying, the Roman Pontiff asked “for the grace of hope, which is not optimism: no, no! It's something else,” and asked “for the grace to renew the covenant with the Lord who has called us every day.”

“May the Lord give us these three graces, which are necessary for the Christian identity.”


TOPICS: Catholic; History; Religion & Culture; Worship
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To: vladimir998

“Has Jesus come? If He hasn’t - and He hasn’t - then we’re talking about two different times so your prooftext doesn’t work. Thanks for trying.”

No post mentioned “times”. That’s your addition, (to save face).

He let us know it was a possibility and therefore not “A figment of your imagination”.

And, logically, that possible state of faithlessness would probably exist for some time BEFORE his coming. So your argument in moot.


61 posted on 05/15/2014 5:50:46 PM PDT by PetroniusMaximus
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To: NYer

So true, for the Church is the Body of Christ.


62 posted on 05/15/2014 5:54:03 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Mrs. Don-o; fwdude

Aha!

"Mary" is a dude in FW who posts comments on FR.

Deep Mystery ... solved.

Sorry Mrs. Don-o, I couldn't resist

63 posted on 05/15/2014 5:58:22 PM PDT by BlueDragon (I can too,...resist everything except temptation)
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To: RoosterRedux

prayer


64 posted on 05/15/2014 5:58:22 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: MayflowerMadam

Thank you kindly, MayflowerMadam!

I owe my mom every single thing that I am. This wonderful lady gave me life, taught me values and morality, taught me about Jesus Christ when I was a young boy.

And despite the fact that as I grew up I became a bit of a jerk and strayed from those teachings for a time, I came back to them when I wised up.

If I hadn’t had the blessing of my mom to teach me those things...if I had a mom who didn’t believe or didn’t care enough to teach me, I wouldn’t be here anymore, because it was Jesus who led me back from the Hell I created for myself in this world.

God Bless your mom too MayflowerMadam, because moms are the best people on this earth, and they are blessing to us all!


65 posted on 05/15/2014 6:00:37 PM PDT by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: Bigg Red

Thank you, Bigg Red.

The time, effort and caring my mom put into raising me, and I know this was no easy task at all because I know myself, I have now been given the opportunity and honor to return to her as she ages.

Despite her physical ailments, she is still very young in heart, soul and mind.

Unfortunately, due to some unidentified ailment, she lost control of the right half of her body around 15 years ago, so she is severely mobility impaired along with other effects that accompany such a condition.

Despite all this, she is still a very happy lady, and that makes me happy.


66 posted on 05/15/2014 6:07:38 PM PDT by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: chris37

Does a minister come to visit your mother?

A priest would at the drop of a hat. (Phone call)


67 posted on 05/15/2014 6:10:24 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: RoosterRedux

“Many are called; few are chosen.”


68 posted on 05/15/2014 6:11:34 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: SaxxonWoods; NYer
"So now a man says his church must stand between a soul and God in order for that soul to reach salvation?"

This makes no sense. Why do you think Jesus built a Church? Surely to be a means of salvation, not an obstacle.

The Church is the Body of Christ, says St. Paul --- and under another image the Bride of Christ. Notice that both terms, "Body" and "Bride," entail that Jesus and Church are one flesh.

What God has joined together, let no man put asunder. You cannot truly encounter Christ and at the same time split Him off from His Body, His Bride.

69 posted on 05/15/2014 6:13:21 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o
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To: chris37

>>>Yeah, that and the church needs your money.
I suppose little, old ladies who are homebound don’t know Jesus right...<<<

And where do you think the church gets the money to bring services to the home bound so that they don’t lose their faith?

But than actively promoting the mission of Jesus is probably not the goal of those who act like hirelings.

The real question is why those who don’t go to church and support God’s work of salvation can expect to enter the gates of heaven. Hell is not populated only with rapists, apostates, and murderers. The lukewarm make there home in that furnace just as easily.


70 posted on 05/15/2014 7:21:08 PM PDT by Bayard
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To: Gamecock; Alex Murphy; metmom

Rather, the usual FRotestant gotcha-nonsense of “the pope made a comment and well that proves it, because Catholics worship the pope, or Mary, or something...”


71 posted on 05/15/2014 7:38:54 PM PDT by Wyrd bið ful aræd (Pope Calvin the 1st, defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades)
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To: Karl Spooner

Bless you too Sir, we are in interesting times, and we must stand fast.

That woman in Sudan is facing death for Jesus a she won’t recant. I pray she sticks to her guns and may we have courage to face evil too and not buckle under.


72 posted on 05/15/2014 7:54:10 PM PDT by Bulwyf
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To: NYer

The Elohim of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and His only begotten Son, The Messiah Yeshua/Joshua, have drawn me away from the greco roman latinized churchianity that defines godliness in the world today..

HalleluYah!

Come out of her my people...


73 posted on 05/15/2014 8:10:41 PM PDT by delchiante
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To: YHAOS; betty boop; marron; xzins; TXnMA
Thank you for your question, dear YHAOS!

When is a Christian a Christian?

From the moment he is born again by God:

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. - John 1:12-13

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. - Gal 2:20

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. - Col 3:3

But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. - Romans 8:9

God's Name is I AM.

74 posted on 05/15/2014 8:10:53 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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Comment #75 Removed by Moderator

To: NYer
Thanks, NYer, for the thread. >{? Quite interesting since Christ founded his church on the Apostles, the first Bishops. So they were Catholic, correct?

Then we get this dissertation from Paul in Acts:

Acts 11:19-26

Those who had been scattered by the persecution
that arose because of Stephen
went as far as Phoenicia, Cyprus, and Antioch,
preaching the word to no one but Jews.
There were some Cypriots and Cyrenians among them, however,
who came to Antioch and began to speak to the Greeks as well,
proclaiming the Lord Jesus.
The hand of the Lord was with them
and a great number who believed turned to the Lord.
The news about them reached the ears of the Church in Jerusalem,
and they sent Barnabas to go to Antioch.
When he arrived and saw the grace of God,
he rejoiced and encouraged them all
to remain faithful to the Lord in firmness of heart,
for he was a good man, filled with the Holy Spirit and faith.
And a large number of people was added to the Lord.
Then he went to Tarsus to look for Saul,
and when he had found him he brought him to Antioch.
For a whole year they met with the Church
and taught a large number of people,
and it was in Antioch that the disciples
were first called Christians.


76 posted on 05/15/2014 8:23:47 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: Salvation

I should have said dissertation ABOUT Paul. Oops.


77 posted on 05/15/2014 8:28:49 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: hosepipe
Clergy are religious lawyers..

Whether or not the Clergy are described as a form of “lawyer,” one of the chief issues with Protestantism is that the Protestant movement and the Protestant bibles (especially the KJV) lessen the role of the Priest by eliminating him as a necessary conduit between a Christian and Christ.

That is a driving issue IMO.

78 posted on 05/15/2014 8:32:21 PM PDT by YHAOS
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To: Salvation

No, one does not, though I am sure that if she wanted one to come, she would make that call.

The source of her faith is not men of the cloth.

While she has spent a great many of her years attending church, I believe that in the end she found that Jesus is within us, and not necessarily within churches.

I’m not saying that He’s not in churches, but I am saying that one does not need to go to a church in order to find Jesus, or to speak with Jesus, or to know Jesus, or to love Jesus.

If there were no churches left on this earth, or any other people at all except my mom, she would still love Jesus, and so would I.

Jesus is about what is in you, and not about where you are or whom you are with.


79 posted on 05/15/2014 8:32:34 PM PDT by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: Bayard

LOL!

Here’s a tissue.


80 posted on 05/15/2014 8:35:14 PM PDT by chris37 (Heartless.)
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