France, Germany Try to Buy Time to Defeat Bush in 2004

None | 2-15-2003 | nwrep

[nwrep]

France, Germany Try to Buy Time to Defeat Bush in 2004

This is purely a theory of mine. Both France and Germany realize that the only reason there are inspectors today in Iraq in the first place is Bush's aggressive stance against Iraq outlined in his speech in September 2002. Iraq would not be an issue but for Bush. They also realize that the opposition party in the US (the Democrats) does not share Bush's enthusiasm for war. The Democratic leaders are only reluctantly on board.

With this scenario in mind, the best way to pave for a Bush defeat in 2004 would be to have Saddam remain in power, handing a potent election year issue to the Democrats, who could point to it as a failure of Bush's foreign policy. Bush would have no argument against it. This, in my mind is why France and Germany are buying time. They realize that 2003 is an important political year for Bush, and any war will have to be fought this year. If the clock is run out and 2004 dawns, there would be no war, Saddam would remain, and Bush would lose. This is what France and Germany want.

Do not be fooled by their stance. It may be anti-American, but more importantly, it is anti-Bush. When viewed in that context, it is particularly sinister.

[Miss Marple]

I agree that this is a portion of this. I notice that Chirac and Schroeder's buddy, Clinton, has been making a lot of noise lately as well. He might even be orchestrating some of this.

[LarryM]

If Bush doesn't get this done, he is finished. The signs are not encouraging right now.

[nwrep]

[dalebert]

YOu can bet Dems have been cutting deals.

[KantianBurke]

good theory although I would disagree about Europe holding off Bush till the elections in 04. Even they recognize that Bush will take out Saddaam by March or April at the latest. What may be a more plausible explanation for their delays is a sickening hope that if more time passes and Iraq becomes more bloody for US forces then Bush would lose popularity and eventually the election.

[americanbychoice]

This whole charade is more complex than that.
Just read the proposed EU constitution, it will become clear to you what is really going on. By the way, the constitution is being written by a "Frog" Giscard D'estaign.
I'll give you the following scenario: What do the bankrupt socialist countries need?
1. Create a constitution that takes away State rights and self determination. This would even isolate Great Britain.
2. All laws, Taxes, Medical care,Schools, military, etc. will be imposed without any countermeasures, by Brussels.
3. Collect taxes, as needed from their new "slaves" in the EU to further the common socialist good.
4. The "morally superior, aristocratic rulers" would now be able to direct the distribution of the funds the way they see it.
5. It will enable them to continue paying their lazy workers, who have been hindering their economic well being for years while shifting those obligations to the new EU countries whose wages will be held at their already low level in order to benefit " the social system". Sounds fair, doesn't it? It is possible for that to work since the Rulers are not able to compete on the world market anymore due to the high cost of doing business. Shift the productivity to the low wage earners and benefit from it.
6. Make Lebensraum without firing a shot. ( If Hitler had just thought of that?)
7. Become a World Power again and revel in the excesses at other's expense.
My Friend, this is what's happening in Europe right now.
There is, however a ray of hope. Will the other countries see through this Charade and opt not to accept it (Great Britain, Spain, Italy and the new Eastern European Countries)Their best hope would be to leave the EU and opt for a seperate Alliance opposite that proposed by the new Superpowers, possibly in collaboration with the U.S.?

[dalebert]

I think you are right on the mark with this.

[Dane]

If Bush doesn't get this done, he is finished. The signs are not encouraging right now.

Deja vu all over again, "if he doesn't do something about Afaghanistan he is finished, blah, blah, blah, ad nauseum".

[Blue Scourge]

Hmm, interesting theory, and completely plausable. All the more reason to stop by Paris on the way to Baghdad, and take out the real threat to the world.

[Miss Marple]

Yes, they are starting to show up once more, insinuating that Bush is a coward, that this is all for show, that we will cut a deal, etc.

Having been proven wrong about Afghanistan means nothing. They simply press on with the same old mantra, just like the left.

[xzins]

If Bush pushes this off until next year, then he can go into the election season with war to prosecute and all the support that will entail.

That's not a good reason to prosecute a war. It should be based on proper tactics, strategy, and cause.

[Jim Busse]

The French, Germans and Belgians are certainly interested in a more dominant role world wide, and what we've seen lately through the UN is just an opening salvo; a repayment to GW for his stances on the Kyoto Protocol and the ICC (International Criminal Court) which, BTW, is housed in Belgium. I believe further evidence of this is this week's news item that the ICC may indict Israel's Sharon after he leaves office (Israel being one of our staunch allies). I think that's a warning of things to come: Should we invade Iraq without UN support (which I expect and support) I wouldn't be surprised if Americans (especially those in Germany...i.e. our military personnel) are accused or war crimes. I really think this is the next level we can expect from these "allies".

[Just mythoughts]

To add to your theory:

Clinton's are socialist, as leaders of the worlds "superpower" their constant theme while in power was EQUALIZE all nations. Power is gained by using "fear" and the biggest "fear" today is threats of Weapons of Mass Destruction. It seems that President is very well aware of that threat and is ready to start removing the dictators that have them. The Clintons are trying to stop him at his every move.

The Clinton's seemed to take personally Bush winning the election. (I have no doubt that if only legal votes were counted Bush would have won the popular vote as well.) As it has been said there is nothing worse than a "woman scorned", so the co-partner knowing she had no chance of being elected president in "00" sought to gain credibility and status of her own by becoming a Senator. The plan was to maintain dem control there and support algore administration.

The Clinton's were angered at algore for not getting elected, thus toss him aside for "04". The Clintons lust for power, and their "HATE" for the conservatives (they had no greater enemy in the world during their reign) seem to have no greater goal than removal of President Bush.

Europe loved the Clintons and made fun of the "Right" for making such a big deal about Bill's sex life, and that is where the Clintons went for comfort. Clintons own gangsters were sent worldwide to get their own personal "socialist" elected. Therefore these governments now owe the Clintons.

There were so many actions the Clintons took to set about EQUALIZING the nations, and when things got tough in 1995, they had to take campaign contributions from the "RED" Chinese, and got away with it. So what did China get in return? Bill and Boris were fast friends and who knows how much money Boris and his gangs got with algore's help. N. Korea was given help to build its weapons under the guise of stopping them, so they owe the Clintons.

I could go on country after country that today now owes the Clintons and I see day after day the Clintons calling in that debt. The Clintons are still the leaders of world socialism, and their goal is to out President Bush no matter what it takes or what happens to this country.

The battle has been engaged and the mediator seems to be the UN, else why do the liberals demand that President keep going there for support. Clintons goal is to maintain status quo of nations, thereby using them to undermine President Bush, keeping terrorist active, creating fear, while they do whatever they can to undermine our economy, and as Clintons won in 1992 on the "worst economy of last 50 years", know that it is the economy and a bad war, will return power back to them.

In a nutshell what is going on in the whole of the world today is a war between the "left" and the "right".

[americanbychoice]

We have to hold steadfast, otherwise the socialists/communists are going to take over. Already they have russia and china in their corner. Now they are trying to BUY Arab States, Australia etc. The more those European countries try to delay, the worse off we become. It is do or die for the U.S. now

[Scott from the Left Coast]

This is the defining moment for the President. He truly stands at a crossroads, with his future and America's to be decided at this moment.

Having made the definitive statements that he has over the past 6 months, his credibility will be lost if he backs down (it will be a tacit admission that he needs the U.N. backing for justification).

His Presidency is likely lost if he backs down to France, Germany and Russia. The continuing crisis and indecision will weigh heavily on the economy, making a strong enough recovery to boost the President nearly impossible to achieve.

But more than anything else, a President must stand behind his talk -- if he talks big ("the game is over" "relevant or irrelevant") and yet backs down when opposed by a handful of strategically insignificant powers he will have toasted himself by demonstrating weakness.

He faces a moment of decision now even bigger than the one he faced in 2001 (because the international and internal left forces of appeasement and weakness and rot have rallied to their own cause). Now he must act without consensus and with active internal opposition. He may need to completely fracture the relationships with France, Germany and Russia, perhaps beyond near-term recovery.

His choice now that the U.N. has failed is the same choice he had given them some months ago: relevance or irrelevance.

This is a really big moment for the President. It is the defining moment.

[Miss Marple]

Scott, the defining moment was a long time ago. The decision has already been made. The President is surrounded by people well-versed in foreign policy and military affairs. He would never have sent all the troops to the Persian Gulf if he didn't intend to follow through.

The left, including Chirac and Schroeder (and Clinton as well, I have no doubt) have believed their own stories about him for way too long.

[DoughtyOne]

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Operation Enduring Freedom - Are We Alone? - Who's With Us (29/4) / Against Us? (14/1)
Research on the Forum / Made Possible by Those Who Posted Full Articles | 02/13/2003 | DoughtyOne

Posted on 02/13/2003 5:31 AM PST by DoughtyOne

This tribute to our allies and list of our detractors was conceived by Goodnesswins.

All too often we hear that the United States is going it alone on Operation Enduring Freedom.
What is the real truth?  It's not too hard to check.  Right here on the forum are plenty of articles
that provide more than enough proof to show who is with us, and who is against us.

Here is a LINK to our allies.  Here is a LINK to our detractors.

 

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TOPICS:

[whadizit]

Nothing that the previous adm. does surprises me. They would do ANYTHING whether it is good for country or not (most of it is NOT) to regain power. If they have to sleep with the enemy, they will and would not hesitate. Clinton, Carville, etc. have been known to pander to anti-US sentiments, even promoting them.

[TheSpottedOwl]

Europe loved the Clintons and made fun of the "Right" for making such a big deal about Bill's sex life, and that is where the Clintons went for comfort. Clintons own gangsters were sent worldwide to get their own personal "socialist" elected. Therefore these governments now owe the Clintons.

Interesting comment, and I would have to agree with you. The Clintons and their minions are like kudzu, however we have the power of boycotts and sanctions. Our government can award contracts to other countries that support us, leaving the axis of weasels out in the cold.