The GOP Has a Nuclear Option ...

Political Wire ^ | March 24, 2017 | Taegan Goddard

[kabar]

The Trump bashers are out in force this morning.

If Trump had used reconciliation with respect to reforming Obama care, he might today be in better shape with respect to financing the wall.

Reforming Obamacare, i.e., mend it, don't end it, is the wrong way to go. This huge, complex program must be removed like a cancer or it will grow back again when a Dem wins the WH.

The wall will be built, whether it funded in part now or in September. I have no doubt of it.

Trump tweet this morning: Don't let the fake media tell you that I have changed my position on the WALL. It will get built and help stop drugs, human trafficking etc.

I believe that if he suffers a defeat at the hands of Rinos and Democrats he will at least be credited with the effort but now those who supported him are already scrambling to rationalize yet another climbdown.

No one is going to credit him with the effort. He has not alienated his base. According to one poll, only 2% of his supporters regret their vote for him. The Dems are bent on obstructing everything he does. They are not going to be swayed into supporting anything he does. Their base won't allow it. It is not time to panic. Trump is doing fine and he will persevere.

[nathanbedford]

now those who supported him are already scrambling to rationalize yet another climbdown

[kabar]

Yeah, 100 days in office and he is not fulfilling his campaign promises. The fact is that Trump has an impressive list of accomplishments that he promised to deliver on the campaign trail.

Invoking Ted Cruz as the authority on how to get legislation passed is laughable. He is the odd man out regardless of who controls Congress or the WH. Trump will get healthcare, tax reform, and the wall. Hear me now, believe me later.

[caww]

Trump isn’t the problem....elites and others in Congress are and thats just the fact. The old hats still want to retain power and look like they do

[kabar]

No doubt. Trump has battled the GOPe, Dems, MSM, and the self-proclaimed guardians of conservatism.

[nathanbedford]

Yeah, 100 days in office and he is not fulfilling his campaign promises.

Yes hundred days is an arbitrary time limit within which to judge a president. It is, however, the traditional time since Franklin Roosevelt to make judgments. In this case it is Trump himself who promised immediate action.

Finally, why do you set up a strawman against me, I did not argue in this thread that he should have filled his campaign promises within 100 days, but I do think he should have avoided the fiasco on Ryan/Trump care and now on building the wall within the first hundred days.

Invoking Ted Cruz as the authority on how to get legislation passed is laughable. He is the odd man out regardless of who controls Congress or the WH.

Be that as it may, as between Donald Trump and Ted Cruz it is Ted Cruz who has actually done something to undo Obama care while Trump supported the bill that would have etched its worst provisions in granite. Based on the only example available, the fiasco of Ryan/Trump care, invoking Donald Trump as the man to get legislation passed is on a par with invoking Paul Ryan.

Trump will get healthcare, tax reform, and the wall. Hear me now, believe me later.

I join you in that hope. Meanwhile I report what is before my eyes.

[Cubs Fan]

What we have today is not a filibuster but the unconstitutional requirement for 60 votes to pass legislation. A true filibuster is holding the floor for constant debate while ALL OTHER BUSINESS STOPPED. Historically it was hard to keep up and was a rare thing. The Democrats are abusing the filibuster by requiring 60 votes on all legislation. It is time to eliminate it.

Exactly right. Either go back to the old filibuster rules or get rid of it

[kabar]

Yes hundred days is an arbitrary time limit within which to judge a president. It is, however, the traditional time since Franklin Roosevelt to make judgments. In this case it is Trump himself who promised immediate action.

And he has given us immediate action on so many things whether it is TPP, the Keystone Pipeline, the enforcement of our immigration laws, the elimination of regulations stifling businesses, the appointment of a conservative SCOTUS, the reinstatement of the US as the leader of the free world, etc. The list is long and impressive as Trump undoes the Obama legacy.

Finally, why do you set up a strawman against me, I did not argue in this thread that he should have filled his campaign promises within 100 days, but I do think he should have avoided the fiasco on Ryan/Trump care and now on building the wall within the first hundred days.

Ryan was elected Speaker twice by the House with very few objections. Trump supported the House leadership and most of the members in passing the proposed healthcare bill. Trump did all the right things by being fully engaged in the process. He negotiated with the Freedom Caucus; he invited 120 GOP congressmen to the WH; he held public rallies; and he used his team to lobby strongly for the bill, including Tom Price who was supposed to be the expert on healthcare redform. Trump did his part, but he was let down by the GOP congress, not only Ryan. The GOP had seven years to develop a consensus on an healthcare alternative to Obamacare. I don't blame Trump at all for the initial failure to pass a healthcare bill. I expect that the second bite at the apple will produce a bill and it will be a better one than offered initially.

Trump never promised to build the wall within the first 100 days. He has started the process of getting bids as part of the design phase. If he waits until September to get the funds to start construction, I am OK with that. In the meantime he is cracking down on the illegals and sanctuary cities.

Be that as it may, as between Donald Trump and Ted Cruz it is Ted Cruz who has actually done something to undo Obama care while Trump supported the bill that would have etched its worst provisions in granite.

Are you referring to the Rubio bill? What did Cruz do to undo Obamacare?

[nathanbedford]

The fact remains that apart from a Gorsuch who by your logic should be credited to Mitch McConnell, Trump has no legislative achievement and one legislative fiasco. All the other matters, which are laudable, are done by executive action.

The fact remains that Trump supported the Ryan care bill and he did so because the essence of Ryan care complied with the specifications Trump laid out on the campaign trail. If the bill was no good Trump should not have supported it. The bill by all accounts, including 83% of the population, was no damn good.

You claim that Trump is an appropriate figure to cite about marshaling legislation, I merely point out that at least he had the balls to oppose Obama care in the teeth of fierce Rino opposition. Trump got in bed with the Rinos on Ryan care.

[kabar]

The fact remains that apart from a Gorsuch who by your logic should be credited to Mitch McConnell, Trump has no legislative achievement and one legislative fiasco. All the other matters, which are laudable, are done by executive action.

Since Obama governed thru EO, Trump was able to undo quickly many of the Obama's egregious actions. You are wrong about legislative actions. Unfortunately even FReepers are captives of the MSM narrative. Here is a list of resolutions and bills signed by Trump

The fact remains that Trump supported the Ryan care bill and he did so because the essence of Ryan care complied with the specifications Trump laid out on the campaign trail. If the bill was no good Trump should not have supported it. The bill by all accounts, including 83% of the population, was no damn good.

Baloney. Trump only mentioned a few of the most popular provisions of Obamacare would be included in the new plan, e.g., allowing "children" up to the age of 26 to be on the parents plan, guaranteeing people with preexisting conditions insurance, etc. The actual GOP plan was authored primarily by Dr. Tom Price who had proposed something similar while in Congress. It was one reason why Trump made him his HHS Secretary.

Most people never read the bill. I did. I take those polls with a grain of salt. In any event, there will be another bill offered. No doubt there will be plenty of critics who see the perfect as the enemy of the good. If the GOP wants to remain the party of governance, it must reach a consensus and then move on. Another defeat will ensure that Obamacare remains the law of the land. Then, the objective will be to amend it to make it work better, a victory for the Dems.

[spintreebob]

Insurance cost is one of the absurd costs due to corporatist government created subsidies to monopoly insurance companies.

Medi-share and Direct Provider are competitive alternatives to insurance. But Ryancare chose winners and losers limited to 3 or 4 insurance companies.

Government regulation (Slavitt type regulation) is a major reason for high overhead cost of insurance ... and high overhead cost of providers.

Tort reform is another area to be addressed.

Above all, every provider and every insurance company should publish on websites all pricing information so everyone has access to the information. That means every service and product must effectively be priced in multiples of $1 and $10 and $100 and $1,000 and not have some things at $541 and other things at $543 and others at $547. Fewer price points to make it simpler for the consumer. It means no complex discounts and surcharges and adjustments.

[itsahoot]

the presiding officer of the Senate, which happens to be the Vice President of the United States

I often wondered what would happen if the VP took the job as president of the Senate seriously. He could actually be the tough guy more so than the Majority leader. Would be fun to watch but we would need a Patton or MacArthur as VP.

[Yosemitest]

We didn't put our Representatives in to keep "Tradition".
We want this crap the DemocRATS have slung upon us ... REMOVED IMMEDIATELY !

[Yosemitest]

"... invoking Donald Trump as the man to get legislation passed is on a par with invoking Paul Ryan."

I agree.

[Jim Noble]

“From what I understand,” Brat said, “whoever’s sitting in the chair has authority over the parliamentarian. So they can rewrite the rules.”

Yes.

Hubert Humphrey tried this in 1967, when he had a majority of 68D-32R and he ruled from the chair that a simple majority could change the rules.

The ruling of the chair was appealed to the floor.

Vice President Humphrey, with his huge majority, was overruled 46-54.

[Yosemitest]

Sounds like demonstrated PROOF to me.

[nathanbedford]

Thank you for posting a link containing the list of Trump's alleged legislative "achievements." My problem is that a cursory reading of the list tells me very little without reading each entry.

I do learn that Trump has achieved the re-naming of the outpatient clinic of the Veterans Administration in Pago Pago. Some achievement.

I also learned from the blurb without going deeper that Trump has achieved designating the new veterans center in Butler County Pennsylvania. An equally awesome achievements, or in Trump's words, a real "deal."

I learned that an exception for General Mattis to serve as Secretary of Defense was arranged, although I do not understand why that should be achievement of Donald Trump, I would put that more to the credit of the general himself and the respect to which he is held.

Are these the kinds of "deals" we signed on for? Is this the sort of artful deal we signed on for? Is this the kind of legislative record for which we who were skeptics in the primary season were bullied and censored on this forum? Is this the first hundred days of the man who plays 3-D chess and who is such a genius that his adversaries simply cannot fathom his strategies? Perhaps there is more within that these blurbs but I think it is incumbent on you to enumerate them rather than leaving it to the reader to do that job. Until we get some real meat, the observation stands that Trump has no significant legislative achievement and one fiasco.

You exempt Trump from all responsibility for the fiasco of Trump/Ryancare when the bill incorporates the very elements that made Obama care unworkable and uneconomic. You fail to mention that the bill breaks the essential promise made in the campaign, to lower premiums, deductibles and co-pays. You point out as though it were in exculpation that Trump appointed as HHS secretary, Dr. Price whose proposals were evidently known before his appointment and which paralleled the bill which proved such a fiasco. Are we supposed to presume that Trump was ignorant of those proposals? Are we not rather to believe that he was chosen because Trump approved of the elements which found their way into Ryancare? Are we supposed to take on faith that we will get proper regulations and a proper third bite at the apple which no credible observer considers likely in the real world of Washington DC? You ignore Trump's support of the bill and expect us to forget that fiasco as though it never happened because we might somehow get a better bill, but that Chimera is so unlikely that even the great salesman, Donald Trump, could not sell it . Either he is not such a great salesman or the legislation, as I said, was "no damn good."

Finally, you cite opposition to the bill as making the perfect the enemy of the good as though Trump/Ryancare were good! As I pointed out in a previous reply, that Bill would have chiseled in granite all the worse provisions of Obama care. Thank God there are some real conservatives in the House of Representatives with the moral courage to stand against this sellout. Their courage calls into question the conservative bona fides of those behind this treacherous "reform" attempted even without any pretense of the repeal that was so often and so earnestly promised to us.

As I asked above, is this bill the reason we put this man of ballyhooed superhuman talents in the White House?

[kabar]

Thank you for posting a link containing the list of Trump's alleged legislative "achievements." My problem is that a cursory reading of the list tells me very little without reading each entry.

You are quite welcome. I was responding to your categorical statement, "Trump has no legislative achievement and one legislative fiasco." You can click on each resolution/bill to get more information from this WH site. There are a few nuggets there re regulations, NASA, and Veterans benefits.

I learned that an exception for General Mattis to serve as Secretary of Defense was arranged, although I do not understand why that should be achievement of Donald Trump, I would put that more to the credit of the general himself and the respect to which he is held.

He was selected and appointed by Trump, which provided the impetus to get the wavier. Trump was willing to make the extra effort to get the person he wanted and it faced some opposition from the Dems. You have a hard time giving Trump credit for anything whether it is SCOTUS or Mattis. I might add that the best and most important appointment he has made was Jeff Sessions as AG. It resulted in a contentious fight, but Trump persevered.

Are these the kinds of "deals" we signed on for? Is this the sort of artful deal we signed on for? Is this the kind of legislative record for which we who were skeptics in the primary season were bullied and censored on this forum? Is this the first hundred days of the man who plays 3-D chess and who is such a genius that his adversaries simply cannot fathom his strategies?

Chill out, man. Nobody said draining the swamp was going to be easy or that the Uniparty would not fight back. Trump has seen his appointments slow-walked during the confirmation process thus hampering getting his people in place to further his agenda; the politicized courts are blocking some of his initiatives, which are constitutional and will be upheld by SCOTUS; the MSM has produced an unprecedented hate campaign against Trump with 90% of their stories being unfavorable towards him; Obama and his minions in the "Deep State" bureaucracy are actively involved in the "Resistance;" the Dems in Congress oppose everything Trump proposes; and he has RINOs and FReepers like you attacking him. Despite all this, Trump moves on, indefatigable and resolute, to fulfill his campaign promises. My money is on him to succeed.

Perhaps there is more within that these blurbs but I think it is incumbent on you to enumerate them rather than leaving it to the reader to do that job. Until we get some real meat, the observation stands that Trump has no significant legislative achievement and one fiasco.

Trump cannot control the legislative process in Congress or force the GOP to start acting like the governing party and reach a consensus on policy. He has taken action on those things he can control thru the EO process and his cabinet appointments.

You exempt Trump from all responsibility for the fiasco of Trump/Ryancare when the bill incorporates the very elements that made Obama care unworkable and uneconomic. You fail to mention that the bill breaks the essential promise made in the campaign, to lower premiums, deductibles and co-pays. You point out as though it were in exculpation that Trump appointed as HHS secretary, Dr. Price whose proposals were evidently known before his appointment and which paralleled the bill which proved such a fiasco. Are we supposed to presume that Trump was ignorant of those proposals?

First, there are limits to what can be done thru budget reconciliation. The Reps do not have 60 voters to invoke cloture in the Senate. The GOP had to develop a three phase plan to repeal and replace Obamacare. Sorry to introduce reality into your fantasy land.

Second, have you read, H.R.1628 - American Health Care Act of 2017? Here are some of things contained in the bill that I would assume you don't object to:

Sec. 111. Repeal of Medicaid provisions.

Sec. 112. Repeal of Medicaid expansion.

Sec. 113. Elimination of DSH cuts.

Sec. 114. Reducing State Medicaid costs.

Sec. 115. Safety net funding for non-expansion States.

Sec. 116. Providing incentives for increased frequency of eligibility redeterminations.

Sec. 201. Recapture excess advance payments of premium tax credits.

Sec. 202. Additional modifications to premium tax credit.

Sec. 203. Premium tax credit.

Sec. 204. Small business tax credit.

Sec. 205. Individual mandate.

Sec. 206. Employer mandate.

Sec. 207. Repeal of the tax on employee health insurance premiums and health plan benefits.

Sec. 208. Repeal of tax on over-the-counter medications.

Sec. 209. Repeal of increase of tax on health savings accounts.

Sec. 210. Repeal of limitations on contributions to flexible spending accounts.

Sec. 211. Repeal of medical device excise tax.

Sec. 212. Repeal of elimination of deduction for expenses allocable to medicare part D subsidy.

Sec. 213. Repeal of increase in income threshold for determining medical care deduction.

Sec. 214. Repeal of Medicare tax increase.

Sec. 215. Refundable tax credit for health insurance coverage.

Sec. 216. Maximum contribution limit to health savings account increased to amount of deductible and out-of-pocket limitation.

Sec. 217. Allow both spouses to make catch-up contributions to the same health savings account.

Sec. 218. Special rule for certain medical expenses incurred before establishment of health savings account.

Sec. 221. Repeal of tax on prescription medications.

Sec. 222. Repeal of health insurance tax.

Sec. 231. Repeal of tanning tax.

The Freedom Caucus and the Tuesday Group are coming very close to a consensus bill that will pass the House. The vast majority of H.R. 1628 will be in the revised bill. This could happen as early as next week. Trump is not to blame for the healthcare bill "fiasco." The House GOP is responsible. Trump will sign whatever comes out of the GOP controlled Congress.

Finally, you cite opposition to the bill as making the perfect the enemy of the good as though Trump/Ryancare were good! As I pointed out in a previous reply, that Bill would have chiseled in granite all the worse provisions of Obama care. Thank God there are some real conservatives in the House of Representatives with the moral courage to stand against this sellout. Their courage calls into question the conservative bona fides of those behind this treacherous "reform" attempted even without any pretense of the repeal that was so often and so earnestly promised to us.

As I indicated, read the bill and understand the legislative process and what can be achieved thru budget reconciliation. And if a consensus is reached for the second bite of the apple, the vast majority of the bill will be what was already proposed in H.R. 1628.

As I asked above, is this bill the reason we put this man of ballyhooed superhuman talents in the White House?

You certainly were no big supporter of Trump and given the tenor of your reply, are still not a supporter. Trump was the only GOP candidate who could have beaten Hillary. And that was the alternative. Can you imagine what the first 100 days would have looked like under Hillary? I am very happy with Trump's performance and look at each day for the next four years as a reprieve from the Obama years. We have one of the best national security teams I have seen in a long time. America is back as the leader of the Free World. Consumer confidence is higher than in a very long time. A good tax reform policy coupled with Trump's economic nationalism will lift this economy and put American workers first.