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After Birth (Snopes blames Free Republic for birther movement)
Snopes ^ | 9/16/2016 | David Emery

Posted on 09/17/2016 4:03:06 AM PDT by grayboots

CLAIM: Hillary Clinton and/or members of her 2008 presidential campaign started the "birther" movement questioning whether Barack Obama was born in the U.S.

FALSE ORIGIN:On 16 September 2016, after years of being the most visible and outspoken exponent of "birtherism" — the notion that, despite all evidence to the contrary, Barack Obama was born outside the U.S. and thus his presidency is illegitimate and his allegiances suspect — GOP presidential candidate Donald Trump stepped up to the podium at a televised campaign event and completely reversed his stance on the matter — but not before trying to lay blame for the long, drawn-out smear campaign on someone else.

(Excerpt) Read more at snopes.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: birther; birtherism; birthers; hillary; obama; snopes; trump
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To: grayboots

I remember the news media reporting on how Obama was born in Kenya back when Obama ran for senator from Illinois.
Then there are those books “written” by him which say he was born in Kenya.


41 posted on 09/17/2016 6:29:48 AM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: grayboots
Yea, I admit it! Still to this day, I'm wondering why Obozo sealed his passport/college records. Most folks are proud of their travels. Most are proud of their college accomplishments. Why hide them? It's simple, he has something to hide. It is Obozo that started the birther movement.

I for one believe he is indeed a U.S. citizen. I think the scandal comes in when he applied for U.S. student aid for foreign students. I believe he has sealed his college records because he defrauded the U.S. government in an effort to gain admission into elite institutions and to gain financial assistance as a foreign student. Basically...he lied and now is attempting to cover it up.

42 posted on 09/17/2016 6:30:10 AM PDT by servantboy777
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To: marktwain

Trump was so late into the game he wasn’t even fashionably late. He’d missed the boat and had to take his private helicopter to catch up.


43 posted on 09/17/2016 6:34:08 AM PDT by bgill (From the CDC site, "We don't know how people are infected with Ebola")
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To: grayboots

And Snopes blames FR for starting it.


44 posted on 09/17/2016 6:35:14 AM PDT by Hardastarboard (This is the legacy of Hillary Clinton: Death, destruction, terrorism and weakness.)
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To: grayboots
Excuse me, but who in their right mind believes anything this Left-wing internet site, masquerading as a "truth verifier" site, puts out?

I get emails from various people who make it a point to say that Snopes has verified this as true (or false in some cases).

I immediately trash the email because I know if the claim is "Snopes has checked this out", it like trying to believe hilLIARy or Obama when they open their mouths. You know they are lying, so why even listen?

Snopes is nothing more than another liberal website bent on destroying America.

45 posted on 09/17/2016 6:39:14 AM PDT by HotHunt
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To: Doogle
"...deplorable!"

That's "les deplorables"?

46 posted on 09/17/2016 6:40:35 AM PDT by HangThemHigh (Entropy's not what it used to be.)
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To: Delta 21

What happened with FARS? I didn’t realize he hasn’t been on FR for 3 years. Anyone know anything?


47 posted on 09/17/2016 6:40:46 AM PDT by bgill (From the CDC site, "We don't know how people are infected with Ebola")
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To: wita
WTH does that say about the country, and the people who made it happen?

That is the elephant in the living room, isn't it?

48 posted on 09/17/2016 6:44:01 AM PDT by Alas Babylon!
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To: grayboots

As SNOPES is the go to site for correct information about urban legends.


49 posted on 09/17/2016 6:52:26 AM PDT by SkyDancer ("They Say That Nobody's Perfect But Yet Here I Am")
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To: grayboots

Note the reference to Natural Law in the first sentence of our Declaration of Independence.

It is crystal clear that the Founding Fathers used the Natural Law definition of 'natural born Citizen' when they wrote Article II. By invoking "The Laws of Nature and Nature's God" the 56 signers of the Declaration incorporated a legal standard of freedom into the forms of government that would follow.

President John Quincy Adams, writing in 1839, looked back at the founding period and recognized the true meaning of the Declaration's reliance on the "Laws of Nature and of Nature's God." He observed that the American people's "charter was the Declaration of Independence. Their rights, the natural rights of mankind. Their government, such as should be instituted by the people, under the solemn mutual pledges of perpetual union, founded on the self-evident truth's proclaimed in the Declaration."

The Constitution, Vattel, and “Natural Born Citizen”: What Our Framers Knew

The Laws of Nature and of Nature's God: The True Foundation of American Law

The Supreme Court of the United States has never applied the term “natural born citizen” to any other category than “those born in the country of parents who are citizens thereof”.

MINOR V. HAPPERSETT IS BINDING PRECEDENT AS TO THE CONSTITUTIONAL DEFINITION OF A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN.

Neither the 14th Amendment nor Wong Kim Ark make one a Natural Born Citizen

The Harvard Law Review Article Taken Apart Piece by Piece and Utterly Destroyed

Citizenship Terms Used in the U.S. Constitution - The 5 Terms Defined & Some Legal Reference to Same

"The citizenship of no man could be previous to the declaration of independence, and, as a natural right, belongs to none but those who have been born of citizens since the 4th of July, 1776."....David Ramsay, 1789.

A Dissertation on Manner of Acquiring Character & Privileges of Citizen of U.S.-by David Ramsay-1789

The Law of Nations or the Principles of Natural Law (1758)

The Laws of Nature and of Nature's God: The True Foundation of American Law

Publications of the Colonial Society of Massachusetts, Volume 20 - Use of The Law of Nations by the Constitutional Convention

The Biggest Cover-up in American History

Supreme Court cases that cite “natural born Citizen” as one born on U.S. soil to citizen parents:

The Venus, 12 U.S. 8 Cranch 253 253 (1814)

Vattel, who, though not very full to this point, is more explicit and more satisfactory on it than any other whose work has fallen into my hands, says: “The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives or indigenes are those born in the country of parents who are citizens. Society not being able to subsist and to perpetuate itself but by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights.

Shanks v. Dupont, 28 U.S. 3 Pet. 242 242 (1830)

Ann Scott was born in South Carolina before the American revolution, and her father adhered to the American cause and remained and was at his death a citizen of South Carolina. There is no dispute that his daughter Ann, at the time of the Revolution and afterwards, remained in South Carolina until December, 1782. Whether she was of age during this time does not appear. If she was, then her birth and residence might be deemed to constitute her by election a citizen of South Carolina. If she was not of age, then she might well be deemed under the circumstances of this case to hold the citizenship of her father, for children born in a country, continuing while under age in the family of the father, partake of his national character as a citizen of that country. Her citizenship, then, being prima facie established, and indeed this is admitted in the pleadings, has it ever been lost, or was it lost before the death of her father, so that the estate in question was, upon the descent cast, incapable of vesting in her? Upon the facts stated, it appears to us that it was not lost and that she was capable of taking it at the time of the descent cast.

Dred Scott v. Sandford, 60 U.S. 393 (1857)

The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens. As society cannot perpetuate itself otherwise than by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their parents, and succeed to all their rights.' Again: 'I say, to be of the country, it is necessary to be born of a person who is a citizen; for if he be born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of his birth, and not his country. . . .

Minor v. Happersett , 88 U.S. 162 (1875)

The Constitution does not in words say who shall be natural-born citizens. Resort must be had elsewhere to ascertain that. At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children born in a country of parents who were its citizens became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners. Some authorities go further and include as citizens children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents. As to this class there have been doubts, but never as to the first.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)

At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children, born in a country of parents who were its citizens, became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives, or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners.

Perkins v. Elg, 307 U.S. 325 (1939),

Was a decision by the Supreme Court of the United States that a child born in the United States to naturalized parents on U.S. soil is a natural born citizen and that the child's natural born citizenship is not lost if the child is taken to and raised in the country of the parents' origin, provided that upon attaining the age of majority, the child elects to retain U.S. citizenship "and to return to the United States to assume its duties." Not only did the court rule that she did not lose her native born Citizenship but it upheld the lower courts decision that she is a "natural born Citizen of the United States" because she was born in the USA to two naturalized U.S. Citizens.

But the Secretary of State, according to the allegation of the bill of complaint, had refused to issue a passport to Miss Elg 'solely on the ground that she had lost her native born American citizenship.' The court below, properly recognizing the existence of an actual controversy with the defendants [307 U.S. 325, 350] (Aetna Life Ins. Co. v. Haworth, 300 U.S. 227 , 57 S.Ct. 461, 108 A.L.R. 1000), declared Miss Elg 'to be a natural born citizen of the United States' (99 F.2d 414) and we think that the decree should include the Secretary of State as well as the other defendants. The decree in that sense would in no way interfere with the exercise of the Secretary's discretion with respect to the issue of a passport but would simply preclude the denial of a passport on the sole ground that Miss Elg had lost her American citizenship."

The Supreme Court of the United States has never applied the term “natural born citizen” to any other category than “those born in the country of parents who are citizens thereof”.

Citizenship Terms Used in the U.S. Constitution - The 5 Terms Defined & Some Legal Reference to Same

"The citizenship of no man could be previous to the declaration of independence, and, as a natural right, belongs to none but those who have been born of citizens since the 4th of July, 1776."....David Ramsay, 1789.

A Dissertation on Manner of Acquiring Character & Privileges of Citizen of U.S.-by David Ramsay-1789

The Law of Nations or the Principles of Natural Law (1758)

The Laws of Nature and of Nature's God: The True Foundation of American Law

Publications of the Colonial Society of Massachusetts, Volume 20 - Use of The Law of Nations by the Constitutional Convention

The Biggest Cover-up in American History

If there is extensive law written that covers election fraud, but it is impossible to enforce, or if a sufficient number of people agree that So-and-So is the President or Pope despite the law, how does that not utterly, completely destroy the entire notion of the Rule of Law itself? As I have said for years with regards to Obama, if you can’t enforce Article II Section 1 Clause 5 of the Constitution, what can you enforce? Can you enforce the border? Can you enforce citizenship? Equal protection? Search and seizure? Right to bear arms? Can you enforce the law against treason? Theft? Murder? Trafficking in body parts? Religious persecution?

Mark Levin Attacks Birthers: Admits He Hasn't Studied Issue; Declares Canadian-Born Cruz Eligible

Not much information exists on why the Third Congress (under the lead of James Madison and the approval of George Washington) deleted "natural born" from the Naturalization Act of 1790 when it passed the Naturalization Act of 1795. There is virtually no information on the subject because they probably realized that the First Congress committed errors when it passed the Naturalization Act of 1790 and did not want to create a record of the errors.

It can be reasonably argued that Congress realized that under Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution, Congress is given the power to make uniform laws on naturalization and that this power did not include the power to decide who is included or excluded from being a presidential Article II "natural born Citizen." While Congress has passed throughout United States history many statutes declaring who shall be considered nationals and citizens of the United States at birth and thereby exempting such persons from having to be naturalized under naturalization laws, at no time except by way of the short-lived "natural born" phrase in Naturalization Act of 1790 did it ever declare these persons to be "natural born Citizens."

The uniform definition of "natural born Citizen" was already provided by the law of nations and was already settled. The Framers therefore saw no need nor did they give Congress the power to tinker with that definition. Believing that Congress was highly vulnerable to foreign influence and intrigue, the Framers, who wanted to keep such influence out of the presidency, did not trust Congress when it came to who would be President, and would not have given Congress the power to decide who shall be President by allowing it to define what an Article II "natural born Citizen " is.

Additionally, the 1790 act was a naturalization act. How could a naturalization act make anyone an Article II "natural born Citizen?" After all, a "natural born Citizen" was made by nature at the time of birth and could not be so made by any law of man.

Natural Born Citizen Through the Eyes of Early Congresses

Harvard Law Review Article FAILS to Establish Ted Cruz as Natural Born Citizen

Watch: Mark Levin declares Ted Cruz a "Naturalized Citizen"

Mark Levin Attacks Birthers: Admits He Hasn't Studied Issue; Declares Canadian-Born Cruz Eligible

The settled law of the land is that the US President must be a natural born citizen, and that to be a natural born citizen, you must have been born in the United States to parents both of whom were US citizens when you were born.

You may disagree with the goal of the Constitutional Convention, and/or with the means they chose to achieve it. But it's not a technicality, not an anachronism no longer relevant in modern times, nor is it racist. Especially in modern times, it enables persons of any race or ethnic heritage to become President. And it's what the Constitution requires.

You may also disagree with binding precedent regarding the meaning of "natural born citizen" as established in Minor. But in our system, the Constitution, and the Supreme Court's interpretation of it, are the "supreme law of the land." And if one faction gets to disregard the Constitution and/or the Supreme Court because they disagree, then that sets a precedent where all other factions can do the same.

Any Argument Against the Natural Law Definition of "Natural Born Citizen" Can easily be Defeated Here

50 posted on 09/17/2016 6:55:31 AM PDT by Godebert (CRUZ: Born in a foreign land to a foreign father.)
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To: grayboots

I knew about his B.C. and everything else in 2004, An article published in 2004 about then U.S. Senate hopeful Barack Obama also identified him as Kenyan-born. According to Gateway Pundit, Obama never refuted the article.


51 posted on 09/17/2016 6:58:16 AM PDT by hawg-farmer - FR..October 1998 (VMFA 235 .69-'72)
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To: hawg-farmer - FR..October 1998
An article published in 2004 about then U.S. Senate hopeful Barack Obama also identified him as Kenyan-born. According to Gateway Pundit, Obama never refuted the article.

Well...then he used to be born in Kenya.

52 posted on 09/17/2016 7:01:09 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (RATs, RINOs......same thing.)
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To: grayboots

According to Team Clinton [probably an excuse, rather than the truth], a couple of people came up with the birth issue when Obama was running for the Senate in 2004.

==

I question the validity of that, because running for House or Senate has only a ‘citizenship’ requirement regardless of place of birth.

So, why would anyone question Obama’s birth place when he was running for the Senate? They wouldn’t.

Pending more proof that the issue was raised in 2004, I would classify this as another Team Clinton lie attempting to deflect from Hillary being pointed at as the source for questioning Obama’s birth certificate.


53 posted on 09/17/2016 7:47:49 AM PDT by TomGuy
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To: grayboots

Sid “The Squid” Blumenthal is guilty.


54 posted on 09/17/2016 7:54:30 AM PDT by kiryandil (m)
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To: Jim Robinson

Ping!


55 posted on 09/17/2016 8:21:03 AM PDT by Albion Wilde (We will be one People, under one God, saluting one American flag. (standing ovation) --Donald Trump)
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To: grayboots

I remember when that came up, there were plenty of birther articles posted here, but initially all the articles were sourced from Democrats.

I remember most of this was all sourced back to that Democrat in PA who was a lawyer.


56 posted on 09/17/2016 8:30:20 AM PDT by dila813 (Voting for Trump to Punish Trumpets!)
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To: grayboots

To be completely fair and honest, Big 0 started it.

This FReeper heard it straight from the horse’s patooty’s own mouth. They can destroy the evidence, but they can’t take all of us on a one-way trip to Fort Marcy Park.


57 posted on 09/17/2016 8:33:06 AM PDT by Heart of Georgia (#neverhellary ... but then, I'm just an uneducated hayseed)
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To: arthurus

Yup


58 posted on 09/17/2016 8:52:48 AM PDT by Vaquero ( Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: grayboots

OK, assume that the *** WAS born in Hawai’i. His father of record was not a U.S. citizen; his mother was too young to automatically confer citizenship. And he was taken to Indonesia at a very early age and was an Indonesian citizen. When was that corrected? WAS it corrected?

Why did a flier introducing him as the first African American president of Harvard Law Review state that he was born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawai’i? WHY ARE HIS F*****G RECORDS SEALED???


59 posted on 09/17/2016 9:11:17 AM PDT by JimRed (Is it 1776 yet? TERM LIMITS, now and forever! Build the Wall, NOW!)
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To: JimRed

Post #10 shows the flier in question.


60 posted on 09/17/2016 9:13:56 AM PDT by JimRed (Is it 1776 yet? TERM LIMITS, now and forever! Build the Wall, NOW!)
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