Posted on 03/24/2015 5:34:35 AM PDT by HomerBohn
The Justice Department is ordering bank employees to consider calling the cops on customers who withdraw $5,000 dollars or more, a chilling example of how the war on cash is intensifying.
Banks are already required to file ‘suspicious activity reports’ on their customers, with threats of fines and even jail time for directors if financial institutions don’t meet quotas.
But as investor and financial blogger Simon Black points out, last week, “A senior official from the Justice Department spoke to a group of bankers about the need for them to rat out their customers to the police.”
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Assistant attorney general Leslie Caldwell gave a speech in which he urged banks to “alert law enforcement authorities about the problem” so that police can “seize the funds” or at least “initiate an investigation”.
As Black highlights, according to the handbook for the Federal Financial Institution Examination Council, such suspicious activity includes, “Transactions conducted or attempted by, at, or through the bank (or an affiliate) and aggregating $5,000 or more…”
Black provides a chilling scenario under which an attempt to withdraw your own money from your bank account could end with a home visit from the cops.
“As you pull into your driveway later there’s an unexpected surprise waiting for you: two police officers would like to have a word with you about your intended withdrawal earlier,” writes Black, who accuses banks of already operating as “unpaid government spies”.
“Do you need to withdraw cash to purchase a used car from a private seller? Or perhaps you are pulling out some emergency cash for a loved one,” writes Mac Slavo.
“Either one of these activities are now considered suspicious and if your cash withdrawal amounts to even a few thousand dollars your bank teller is under a legal requirement to alert officials about your suspected criminal activity. And before you argue that you can’t possibly be a suspect because you have done nothing wrong, consider that even being suspected of being a suspect is now enough to land you on a terrorist watchlist in America.”
The war on cash is intensifying as authorities attempt to crack down on one of the few remaining modes of anonymity.
Over in France, Finance Minister Michel Sapin hailed the introduction of measures set to come into force in September which will restrict French citizens from making cash payments over 1,000 euros.
The new regulations, introduced in the name of fighting terrorism, will also see cash deposits of over 10,000 euros during a single month reported to anti-fraud authorities.
Meanwhile, in the UK, HSBC is now interrogating its account holders on how they earn and spend their money as well as restricting large cash withdrawals for customers from £5000 upwards.
Back in America, purchasing Amtrak train tickets with cash is being treated as a suspicious activity as part of a number of behaviors that are “indicative of criminal activity”.
Banks are also making it harder for customers to withdraw and deposit cash, with Chase imposing new capital controls that mandate identification for cash deposits and ban cash being deposited into another person’s account.
In October 2013, we also reported on how Chase instituted policy changes which banned international wire transfers while restricting cash activity for business customers (both deposits and withdrawals) to a $50,000 limit per statement cycle.
They don’t care about checks or xfers. It’s green cash they hate (and which the KYC Know Your Customer / Suspicious Activity laws apply to)
All you need if 500,000 people on a daily basis at 9AM...walk in and ask for $5,001 in cash. Walk around for six hours, then insert the $5,001 in cash back into the bank account. It’d take a month for the Feds to wise up that they were wasting six million reports a week on this banking report deal.
I've carried as much as $15K in cash without any problem. I also 'carry' so no-one is going to steal it from me. ;)
I pay most of my bills in cash, not that there are that many with a paid off house and no mortgage payment.
Different strokes for different folks, and circumstances.
There ain't no ONE right way.
/johnny
OUT-OF-CONTROL executive branch ALERT!
At today’s fractional interest rates you’re much further ahead to just stuff it in your mattress.
Call the cops? ... LOL ...
If my bank here in Tulsa called the Tulsa Police Department and said, “We’ve got a customer here who just withdrew $5,000 from his bank account! Come quickly!” ... the cops here would be laughing their heads off, rolling on the floor! ... :-) ...
That sounds extremely inconvenient.
I mean even my grandparents wrote personal checks for most bills way back in the stone age, but now they got electronic bill-pay that's much easier to use than that.
Another drawback of using cash is getting change back.
Better yet my credit card banks pay me for using them for purchases , 1 to 3 % back depending on the specials.
Cash wont do that.
It seems to be an announcement of a new policy. Wait.
Cops: “Sir, why did you draw $5000 out of the bank?”
Me: “None of your damn business.”
Depends on your circumstances. I pay most of my bills annually, and I pay some quarterly, including water. Depends on circumstances and what works best. I don't pay anything on a monthly basis.
I can always use the change for cash purchases. If I have to worry and fight over 1-3% of a $180 quarterly water bill, I'm doing something wrong in my world...
One size doesn't fit all, thank goodness the market sees that.
Of course, you are correct that some can't manage even with modern tools, but they can learn or pay the price.
/johnny
Name the bank.
Did everyone miss the two critical words from the article?
They would be “transactions” (plural) and “aggregate”.
So they aren’t just talking about single transactions of $5001 or more. They’re talking about MULTIPLE transactions TOTALLING $5001 or more.
Over what time period is left unsaid. So, say you have a business (such as a sole proprietorship) that requires cash transactions of >$5000 per month. You go to the bank once a week and withdraw $1000 for the cashbox. There’ll be months where you hit that $5000 threshold, and if this rule is in effect with a monthly aggregation your bank calls the cops and you may get a visit.
Worry and fight?
Electronic payments are in some ways easier than posting some of the stuff I do here, in some cases I give my CC over the phone then of course pay the bill monthly electronically (easier than posting a thread here) , and my reward for this simplicity? cash back?
I dont think I have a single bill that gets paid annually by me,
The war on drugs may be the original rationale, but the big impact is that it lets the IRS know when people run up against the gift-tax theshold.
There is a very little these days that you actually NEED cash for but it should be the right of the person to use cash if they desire. A person should be able to say NO to even using a bank.
If the government can make it 5K they can just as easily make the number 1K if they desire or even $500. I believe it is yet another freedom they are taking away.
I have an elderly relative that lives in an area where you have to have cash to pay for a taxi cab. It is a pain in the butt to deal with..I would like the government to MAKE them take a debit card. HA!
Stop doing business with government banks. Problem solved!
I personally pay all my bills with money orders. Yes, it is a little more work and running around, but, I have a complete paper trail without notice to the government what I spend my money on or who I give it to. This is another way for the government to track which candidate you give money to, or weapons you purchase, etc.
I do not do any business with any government bank.
I can't speak on a telephone today, but I understand what you are saying about what tools you use, and how easy you find them.
I just don't mess with 3% of $180. Probably not even to bend over and pick it up in a parking lot. It's tiny money, in some eyes.
/johnny
I withdrew 5k last June to go on a trip to Vegas. The teller asked me if I was buying a car. I said I was going to Vegas. She told me good luck.
My impression then was she was just making conversation. But since I go to Vegas about once a year, and carry cash with me, I’ll be on the lookout for more in-depth questioning of my need for the cash.
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