777 Crash at SFO (San Francisco)

Twitter ^ | July 6, 2013

[FreedomPoster]

Currently just Tweets and locals talking about this, nothing on news sites yet. Lots of stuff in the Twitter feed, including links to uploaded videos of the smoking mess.

[Lmo56]

He brought it in too low and tried to correct but it was too late.

Eyewitness who is an experienced plane spotter said that the plane came in waaay too low and that the fuselage was in about a 45-degree attitude before the tail hit the sea wall ....

[RayChuang88]

I doubt low on fuel. The 777-200ER has a range of around 7,200 nautical miles for most versions--and ICN to SFO is probably around 5,100 nautical miles total traveled distance.

It's possible that without ILS assistance (the ILS at SFO was turned off today), the pilot attempted a manual glide slope landing and came in too low. Mind you, the very latest 777-300ER's (the Asiana 777 was an older 777-200ER model) does have GPS guidance, and that can usually compute glide slope accuracy to around 30 feet.

[CodeToad]

You mean to tell us that a crew would use an inop ILS that far down to touchdown? Was the ILS transmitting?

[NonValueAdded]

airport presser coming up.

[Moose4]

That picture upthread sure looked like “severe clear” conditions to me...not a cloud in the sky. The METAR from KSFO at 11:56 local was:

METAR text: KSFO 061856Z 21007KT 170V240 10SM FEW016 18/10 A2982 RMK AO2 SLP098 T01830100
Conditions at: KSFO (SAN FRANCISCO , CA, US) observed 1856 UTC 06 July 2013
Temperature: 18.3°C (65°F)
Dewpoint: 10.0°C (50°F) [RH = 58%]
Pressure (altimeter): 29.82 inches Hg (1009.9 mb)
[Sea-level pressure: 1009.8 mb]
Winds: from the SSW (210 degrees) at 8 MPH (7 knots; 3.6 m/s)
Visibility: 10 or more miles (16+ km)
Ceiling: at least 12,000 feet AGL
Clouds: few clouds at 1600 feet AGL
Weather: no significant weather observed at this time

Could be pilot error that caused him to land short, or could’ve been a mechanical problem. Think British Airways 038 at London Heathrow a few years ago, and in fact this crash profile is eerily similar. But, that plane had an issue with its Rolls-Royce Trent 800 engines and I think, from what somebody said back a few hundred posts ago, this aircraft had Pratt and Whitney 4090 engines. Similar size, similar power, but different design. (777s can be ordered with GE, P&W, or Rolls-Royce engines depending on airline preference.)

}:-)4

[Deo volente]

Press conference at SFO will take place any moment now:

http://www.ktvu.com/videos/news/ktvu-live-news/vtSfR/?updated

[publius911]

Purely uninformed speculation, but it sounds to me like someone failed to reset the altimeter before approach.

Shouldn't matter. Conditions were VFR and presumably the pilot was looking out the windshield. He should have had at least 30 seconds of warning.
Plus, don't these animals have radar altimeters? Not dependent on atmospheric pressure.

[mulder1]

Prayers for the victims and their families.

[ncfool]

Since July 1, This plane had been everywhere.
http://planefinder.net/data/airplanes/HL7742

Previous flights by HL7742

FLIGHT ROUTE DATE
OZ214 Incheon Intl (ICN) - San Francisco Intl (SFO) 2013-07-06
OZ111 Kansai (KIX) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-06
OZ112 Incheon Intl (ICN) - Kansai (KIX) 2013-07-06
OZ203 Los Angeles Intl (LAX) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-05
OZ204 Incheon Intl (ICN) - Los Angeles Intl (LAX) 2013-07-04
OZ121 Chubu Centrair Intl (NGO) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-04
OZ502 Charles De Gaulle (CDG) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-04
OZ501 Incheon Intl (ICN) - Charles De Gaulle (CDG) 2013-07-04
OZ502 Charles De Gaulle (CDG) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-03
OZ501 Incheon Intl (ICN) - Charles De Gaulle (CDG) 2013-07-03
OZ213 San Francisco Intl (SFO) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-01
OZ214 Incheon Intl (ICN) - San Francisco Intl (SFO) 2013-07-01
OZ111 Kansai (KIX) - Incheon Intl (ICN) 2013-07-01
OZ112 Incheon Intl (ICN) - Kansai (KIX)

[Deo volente]

Two runways have reopened at the airport.

[Selene]

61 americans on board per KTVU

[Moose4]

BA 038 wasn’t the autopilot. There was a design problem in the 777’s Rolls-Royce engines where at certain (exceptionally cold) cruising temperatures, ice would form in the fuel lines at a slushy consistency. That ice could, when the engines were at low power for an extended period (like on descent), build up and break loose when the throttles were pushed forward. Some tiny projections on a heat exchanger designed to melt fuel ice would instead snag the ice and block the fuel lines when a big clump of slush hit them.

The result was that when the pilot of BA 038 pushed the throttles up to compensate for a wind gust on short final, nothing happened except the engines rolling back to near idle power. He actually did a very good bit of piloting to stretch his glide over a perimeter road and “flop” the airplane down onto the very start of the actual runway.

The only reason they found the problem was that a Delta 777 had the same issue while at high altitude cruising over China many months later, and the data from that incident helped point the investigators to the issue.

}:-)4

[pops88]

I knew I wouldn’t be disappointed, waiting for a $%^&* slap worthy of John Wayne in “The High and the Mighty.” I can hear my mother saying, “Let the adults talk.”

[American Constitutionalist]

There is technology today that tells the pilot where the plane is in relation to the ground.
For example this technology can tell the pilot if the plane is about to run into a mountain or not if there was fog or bad weather coming into land.
With this plane sounds like something happened in mid air just seconds or minutes before landing.

[Mr. Wright]

“While Qantas has never had a fatal jet airliner accident” . .

Read your link again, you overlooked this.

[Conserev1]

This from a poster @CBS "Malik Nidal • 2 hours ago − I just checked the Flight Aware graph of AAR214 - It shows the plane was too low and slow, flying at 100ft above sea level and crabbing slightly to the right with a 294 degree heading....ground speed was only 109 kts when the pilot pulled up, climbing 100 ft and stalling the plane further to 85 kts."

[Mr. Wright]

They DO NOT tolerate the political correctness bullsh - t that is placed on American Citizens flying of U.S. Airlines. The Israelis know hot to handle airline travel.

[diogenes ghost]

"See the picture at post 220....can see the tail section hitting or about to hit the rock berm."

Where in the world do you see that?

What I see is a 74, probably awaiting TO clearance, and what may be initial blowing dust/smoke from the incident to the left of him.

[floralamiss]

You might be right, moose. I’m not sure I would know what to say if I had the misfortune to witness something like that.

[MestaMachine]

Is there even a remote possiblity that this was a shootdowm?