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Dobson: Where have GOP values gone? [GOP was AWOL on conservative values]
WorldNetDaily ^ | November 16, 2012 | Bob Unruh

Posted on 11/17/2012 12:24:28 PM PST by fwdude

The 2012 election was an open door for the GOP to lead America back to its roots in faith and morality, and the Republicans were AWOL, says Dr. James Dobson, founder of Family Talk and a brand new political outreach arm called Family Talk Action.

“I waited throughout the campaign for Mitt Romney to declare himself, to at least identify with the moral issues that are before us. He would not touch them,” Dobson said on a two-part radio program in which Penny Nance, head of Concerned Women for America, joined.

(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2012rncstrategy; christianvote; conservatism; elections; romney2012
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To: yldstrk

Believe as you wish, I have no problem with that.

But your comments about and to those you disagree with reveal a nasty and judgmental character. You aren’t going to persuade anyone with your attitude. You will be dismissed as an arbitrary and contemptuous crank convinced of your own rectitude.


101 posted on 11/18/2012 12:05:52 PM PST by Pelham (America, 1775-2012)
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To: wintertime
Excellent suggestions! My SIL related an incident she had with my nephew when he was about five. They had gone to the grocery store and he wanted a cookie at the bakery. She got it for him but said he could have after they got home and he had lunch first. Well, he was STEAMED! He complained and whined and even told the cashier how unfair it was that he couldn't eat his cookie, now! My SIL told him calmly again that he could have it after lunch but he wouldn't stop and was at the screaming stage by the time they were heading to the car. So she said, "If you don't stop right now, I'm throwing the cookie away.". He, of course, challenged her by continuing his fit and she walked with him to the garbage can and threw his cookie away. He was shocked, but he stopped his tantrum and, guess what, she didn't have that problem with him again.

When I used to teach elementary school, from the first day I went over the rules for the classroom. We discussed each rule, why it was a good rule and what the consequences would be for breaking the rule. Every class had the few who would challenge my authority, but I showed them that I meant what I said, and there were no second chances - the punishment was meted out as we discussed. It wasn't paddling, BTW. I would usually have to be hard on them for about two weeks - not letting any slip by - but that was all it took. They knew the rules and knew I would enforce them fairly. The rest of the year went smoothly and I rarely had discipline problems. All the other teachers would ask me how I got my class to be so well-behaved.

I think what children today are missing out on because of the need for both parents to work to support the family is that they end up being raised by their teachers or other caregivers who do not have the experience, education or temperament - much less the authority - to train each child up in the ways best suited to each one. They have to go with a one-size-fits-all strategy and it's why we have so much of a problem in public schools. I taught in a private Christian school - they couldn't pay me enough to teach in public ones today! If kids do not learn respect for authority at home, they will seldom learn it anywhere else.

102 posted on 11/18/2012 1:48:32 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: yldstrk

>> “...he is a psychologist, first, which is about as respectable as an actor in a traveling troupe” <<

.
This is one of those times where I have to agree with you fully. Jungian psychology is about as anti-biblical as you can get. It totally denies the spirit nature of men, making all things secular in nature.

My suspicion is that Dobson is not saved, or he would know better.


103 posted on 11/18/2012 1:57:59 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: Barnacle; yldstrk

A dog that bares it teeth to me is going to get walloped. He’s going to wish Thor would come and strike him down with his hammer.

In addition to dogs, I’ve got horses. A horse who threatened to bite or kick me will wish it had never been born.

Guess I’m just a horrible person...

Oh, and I DID spank my kids, none of whom is anti-social, addicted, or a bully.


104 posted on 11/18/2012 1:59:45 PM PST by Mr Rogers (America is becoming California, and California is becoming Detroit. Detroit is already hell.)
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To: fwdude

Public schools keep churning out generation after generation of good little marxists...


105 posted on 11/18/2012 2:03:10 PM PST by who knows what evil? (G-d saved more animals than people on the ark...www.siameserescue.org.)
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To: daniel1212; yldstrk

>> “ But he was also a man with some steel behind his tears, and who contended against pornographers and liberal establishment, and alerted and mobilized us to action.” <<

.
Dobson is a Moralist, like most Freemasons are, but moralism is not Christian in nature, but humanist/secularist.


106 posted on 11/18/2012 2:03:37 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: yldstrk; metmom

“Oh yeah, what your dad did? How about going with you and reading you a bedtime story, wouldn’t that have been nicer than spanking you back up the stairs?”

WOW! You really ARE clueless, aren’t you!


107 posted on 11/18/2012 2:07:58 PM PST by Mr Rogers (America is becoming California, and California is becoming Detroit. Detroit is already hell.)
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To: wintertime

Yes, I like your approach


108 posted on 11/18/2012 2:11:30 PM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: metmom

I felt horrible about it every time (maybe about 10 X) that I did it. I don’t like it, and that doesn’t make me a hypocrite. I smoked cigarettes while in college, don’t now, don’t recommend it and that doesn’t make me a hypocrite either.


109 posted on 11/18/2012 2:18:34 PM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Mr Rogers

well she may have craved some attention since she was one of five and you know how kids are, if they crave attention they will take positive or settle for negative. He could have got her quieted down, but obviously you and I have different approaches. I don’t think it was a safety issue, like a horse being aggressive.


110 posted on 11/18/2012 2:23:54 PM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: editor-surveyor

wow, didn’t know the guy was a Freemason


111 posted on 11/18/2012 2:25:55 PM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: yldstrk; Mr Rogers

Well, you know what?

My parents set the guidelines and I KNEW they would be enforced and I KNEW how.

If I chose to disobey, the consequences were MY choice. I never felt they were being mean, or unfair, of unkind, or whatever else you wish to charge them with when they followed through. I knew it was my own stupid fault for challenging them.

The only times I resented discipline, and not just spankings but ANY kind of discipline, was when I didn’t do it and they either wouldn’t listen to me or believe me.

Other than that, I got what I was fairly warned was coming.

Kids aren’t stupid. They can tell the difference. Discipline, even spankings, aren’t resented when they are deserved. And there were times I’d have RATHER had the spanking over other forms of discipline.


112 posted on 11/18/2012 2:36:55 PM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: trebb

LOL,

Homosexuality the Boy Scouts and the military and removing abortion from the republican party platform are mere ‘cherry picking’ issues, and “state” issues?

The United States military, the national Boy Scouts, and the national Republican Party, and you want to let the states force local rules onto them?

“”Same with the Boy Scouts - he said the organization should make the call; not the Federal government.””

Really? The Boy Scouts don’t want to be forced to have homosexual leaders, Mitt wants them to become homosexualized, just like he supports the entire homosexual agenda.


113 posted on 11/18/2012 3:02:45 PM PST by ansel12 (The only Senate seat GOP pick up was the Palin endorsed Deb Fischer’s successful run in Nebraska)
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To: editor-surveyor

That is a revelation, either of James Dobson, or what some people are willing to believe based on dubious sources: do you have some actual documentation that he is a Mason?

Masonry is definitely not Christian, yet one is not a mere moralist because they preach Christian morality as part of the Christian message, and Dobson’s affirmation of the evangelical gospel made quite manifest over many years.

Focus on the Family yet states its mission is “disseminating the Gospel of Jesus Christ to as many people as possible,” and its Statement of Faith if definitely Christian, not Masonic. (http://www.ministrywatch.com/profile/focus-on-the-family.aspx)

And while he was somewhat too ecumenical at times with Catholics, he regularly would air evangelical testimonies and invite souls to conversion.


114 posted on 11/18/2012 3:48:42 PM PST by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: daniel1212
I used to listen to the Focus on the Family radio program every day. The Gospel was always clear and straightforward and the advice given was Biblical and extremely helpful in MANY areas. Those who criticize James Dobson with unfounded accusations either have never heard him or read his books or they disagree with a point or two and trash the entire ministry over it. He is a good and Godly man who loves his family and the families of all Americans.
115 posted on 11/18/2012 4:03:49 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: boatbums

Yes, they have their faults, but it seems some are preoccupied with looking for and magnifying them,and lack a balanced view.


116 posted on 11/18/2012 5:56:07 PM PST by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
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To: fwdude

That’s a wrong generality too. Science is a neutral thing; it is the study of empiricisms. It is the use to which the knowledge thereby gained is put, that is either evil or good.


117 posted on 11/18/2012 5:57:53 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: metmom

I officially ride the fence, how’s that for an emphatic maybe. Here’s what I said once I learned about what she was doing.


Well, quite frankly I hadn’t heard your own story and I can understand the concern of the “monsters.”

If God is truly moving you to “total nonviolence” then God will also bless it. BUT — I think it’s too easy to paint others’ somewhat different styles as “monstrous.” The touchstone of balance in chastising children is Ephesians 6:4 — “fathers, do not exasperate” (or provoke to rage) “your children, lest they lose heart.” The idea is not to get them to fear YOU personally, but to fear your specific displeasure at their misbehavior, if sweet reason is not enough to reach them. If the reaction is to burst into blind rage then you may have overdone it and you should moderate.

So I thoroughly ride the fence on this one.


118 posted on 11/18/2012 6:01:05 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: daniel1212

How something is intended and how it’s taken are different affairs.


119 posted on 11/18/2012 6:08:24 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

Spanking is necessary sometimes, but is not the only answer all the time. It’s not a one size fits all solution.

Sometimes it’s a last resort, sometimes other discipline works better. It varies from child to child, and even from situation to situation and age to age with the same child.

Too bad that those who do use spanking when necessary are broad brushed as using only it all the time without restraint, thus portraying us as essentially child abusers. Especially when we are compared to them. It’s not hard to miss the implication.


120 posted on 11/18/2012 9:44:51 PM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

Science is the study of the material world; what is objectively observable, measurable and testable. The mind is none of these things.

You make the fatal error of assuming that psychology is science. It is not. If anything, it is a religion.


121 posted on 11/19/2012 4:18:56 AM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: fwdude

You make the fatal error of ignorance. Minds and their workings CAN be at least crudely charted.

Sure, psychologists have gotten cult followings but that happens when and because they are abusing their role as scientists.


122 posted on 11/19/2012 6:19:06 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

Again, please explain how mind is empirically observable, measurable and testable.

Do you somehow make a living in the field of psychology? If so, your defensiveness is understandable.


123 posted on 11/19/2012 8:01:35 AM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: fwdude

124 posted on 11/19/2012 8:05:59 AM PST by Antoninus (Sorry, gone rogue.)
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To: DustyMoment
DM, you are mistaking me. And you aren't seeing that you and I agree on MUCH more than you give me credit for. I HAVE repudiated the RNC as an organization, and excoriate phone solicitors from the RNC every time they call - I think I even made one cry~! I have a whole toy cash till filled with toy money to send them with a note: "Fake money for fake conservatives."

I ONLY support individual candidates who unapologetically champion whole conservatism and who have a proven track record of staunch conservatism; most of whom identify as Republican.

A candidate can identify as Republican without adopting the pernicious value system of the party establishment. That's all I'm saying.

125 posted on 11/19/2012 8:16:14 AM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: Antoninus

Amen, Antoninus.

But, I wonder which group will prevail?


126 posted on 11/19/2012 8:19:30 AM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: fwdude

Man, you both assume and project much. I do not make any living out of anything even slightly psychologically related.

You are however glaringly unaware that prior to the appearance of Sigmund Freud there was an older line of, yes, Christian psychology. Dr. Freud literally hijacked that and secularized it, which is the basis of the travesty we see all too often today. There was also a respected line of medicine called “alienism” — not the study of space aliens, silly, but of understanding the mentally ill, with the purpose of counseling them towards better normalcy or at least better coping. It’s now known as “abnormal psychology.” And to have an abnormal, you need to have a normal. From which the following applies.

As with navigating geography, one does not need a perfect map in order to be useful. And yes, personalities and minds both normal and abnormal have been mapped, to useful purpose.

If it were up to you we’d still be chaining the insane.


127 posted on 11/19/2012 11:37:36 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: fwdude

The way I saw the discussion was the you were coming at me with practical reasoning and I was responding with ideological reasoning.

I fully understand that we share much more in common than not. The underlying fact remains the same for both of us - the GOP-E has lost its way and no longer represents its conservative base, nor does it care. To that end, we need to stop any and all donations to the RNC and send them to a quick death so that the Tea Party can step up.

And, yes, I do undertsnad that we agree on these things, albeit from slightly different directions. The end result is that we will both arrive at the same destination.

Thanks for a good discussion.


128 posted on 11/19/2012 12:05:23 PM PST by DustyMoment (Congress - another name for white collar criminals!!)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
Again, there is a difference between research psychology (learning about observable behaviors) and psychological counseling with the objective to "cure" a condition or behavior.

T.A. McMahon encapsulates this issue almost perfectly in his recent article The Upcoming Psychologized Generation (The Berean Call Newsletter, November 2012):

...[Christians] contradict their professing belief in biblical authority by looking elsewhere for solutions to solving life’s problems, primarily by turning to so-called authorities or “experts”—and particularly to psychologists. This is a tragic mistake because God’s Word is sufficient: “According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue” (2 Peter:1:3). The Word of God is the Manufacturer’s Handbook, with instructions for humanity regarding “all things that pertain to life and godliness.” What exactly are the “all things”? Certainly everything that pertains to or involves moral issues and anything that is sin related—either how to avoid it or how to repent of it. Clinical psychology cannot deal with sin—although most if not all of the issues for which people turn to psychotherapists are due to sin. The outcome of seeking psychotherapeutic help is always destructive for the faith of the believer for what should be obvious reasons.

Psychological counseling is an anti-biblical replacement program for the Manufacturer’s Handbook. Its essential doctrine is that self, which is declared to be innately good, is the key to solving all of life’s problems. Therefore, foundationally, it stands in direct opposition to the Scriptures, which declare that self, i.e., man, is innately sinful (Jeremiah:17:9).

Your desperate defense of clinical psychology is a tragic example of how ingrained this false "science" has become in the modern mind, even in Christian thought.

129 posted on 11/19/2012 12:30:00 PM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: fwdude

You err greatly to aver, with ad-hominem attacks packed in (”desperate”), that there can be no practice of clinical psychology that walks hand in hand with a classical Christian understanding of sin and righteousness. You err extremely greatly. But the people who practice in this manner, pay the likes of you no mind, other than to pray daily for you.


130 posted on 11/19/2012 12:34:57 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: fwdude

You have set up a straw man and masterfully bashed it. In the meantime, people who suffer from mental illness and were not healed by a traditional church format by bigots such as you, have been helped to better sanity by the application of psychological Christian understanding that, in fact, predated Sigmund Freud.


131 posted on 11/19/2012 12:38:46 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: HiTech RedNeck
Ah, the "B" word. And you thereby show yourself to be what you really are.

You belong at DU, Troll. You speak the language.

132 posted on 11/19/2012 12:42:04 PM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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To: fwdude

Ah, now the ad hominems begin flowing from you. Where is that vaunted grace?

I say bigoted with a very accurate dictionary definition, and bigots carry out what is bigoted, just as murderers carry out murders.


133 posted on 11/19/2012 12:44:36 PM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: HiTech RedNeck

The ad hominem attack is wantonly using the meaningless leftist term of derision “bigot” improperly in an attempt to denigrate another.

Where, in anything that I posted, is “bigot” even remotely appropriate?


134 posted on 11/19/2012 2:00:09 PM PST by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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