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Sticking to their guns: Marines place $22.5M order for the Colt .45 M1911
Foxnews ^

Posted on 07/28/2012 11:46:19 AM PDT by Red in Blue PA

It’s been called the greatest handgun ever made, and it has barely changed sine 1911, when the legendary John Browning designed it especially for the U.S. Military.

And now, the Colt .45 M1911 is making a big comeback, now that the U.S. Marines have placed a $22.5 million order for the Connecticut-made pistols.

The gun, which has been wielded on film by John Wayne and in real life by Sgt. Alvin York and Maj. Audie Murphy, was the standard-issue sidearm in the military for decades, until it was replaced by the Beretta M9 in 1985.

"It just became an iconic part of military and American history." - Gerry Dinkel, CEO and president of Colt Defense

"It just became an iconic part of military and American history," Gerry Dinkel, CEO and president of Colt Defense, told FoxNews.com.

The gun, one of the most successful pistols ever used at Camp Perry's National Matches, a competition known to be the main world event in artillery sports, has barely changed since it's creation. Dinkel says that shows the gun's "elegant design" just can't be improved on. And firearms experts agree.

"You can’t beat a .45 cartridge," Jack Lewis, firearms director for Cowan's Auctions, told FoxNews.com. "Some things are hard to replace," he said.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 1911; banglist; marines; usmc
Over 100 years later, nobody has improved on John Moses Browning's design.
1 posted on 07/28/2012 11:46:32 AM PDT by Red in Blue PA
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To: Red in Blue PA
Good news.


2 posted on 07/28/2012 11:52:56 AM PDT by jazusamo ("Intellect is not wisdom" -- Thomas Sowell)
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To: Red in Blue PA

Only the best for our best...


3 posted on 07/28/2012 11:56:28 AM PDT by Caipirabob (I say we take off and Newt the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure...)
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To: Red in Blue PA
From another source:Accuracy, hmmm? I never had to qualify with the M1911 pistol, but the few times I did fire it, I could barely hit the side of a barn.
And I was a good enough to shoot Expert 4 times in 3 years with the M-14.
4 posted on 07/28/2012 12:04:16 PM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: oh8eleven
The problem with most of the .45s from our era is they had their guts shot out of them in the jungles of the Philippines and the frozen fields of Belgium, France, Korea,etal.

Also, by the time they got to the actual troops that would use them (in combat) they had been cherry-picked.

5 posted on 07/28/2012 12:10:13 PM PDT by donozark (A Socialist is a Communist who doesn't have the balls to pull the trigger!)
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To: oh8eleven

I found the 1911 among the most pleasant of my pistols to shoot. With its fairly high mass and low velocity round I found it much easier to hit the target that with the Glock. Perceived recoil of the Glock was higher and with the changing mass of the gun the recoil increases with each shot.

Now I do have a derringer from Waco Arms in .45 APC that is really not fun to shoot at all, but that’s another story.


6 posted on 07/28/2012 12:12:30 PM PDT by Mycroft Holmes (<= Mash name for HTML Xampp PHP C JavaScript primer. Programming for everyone.)
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To: Red in Blue PA

I always thought the Star model P was a slight improvement over the 1911 tho for the most part it is a copy.


7 posted on 07/28/2012 12:21:58 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: donozark
The problem with most of the .45s from our era is they had their guts shot out of them in the jungles of the Philippines ...
That makes sense.
8 posted on 07/28/2012 12:23:42 PM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: jazusamo

So where can I buy one already???


9 posted on 07/28/2012 12:23:57 PM PDT by ctdonath2 ($1 meals: http://abuckaplate.blogspot.com)
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To: oh8eleven

Post 8 at: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2911860/posts


10 posted on 07/28/2012 12:24:46 PM PDT by Sea Parrot (Once I was young, now I am old and the in between went way too fast)
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To: jazusamo

So where can I buy one already???


11 posted on 07/28/2012 12:24:58 PM PDT by ctdonath2 ($1 meals: http://abuckaplate.blogspot.com)
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To: donozark

Amen bro.

They were worn out sloppy examples.


12 posted on 07/28/2012 12:31:29 PM PDT by 2111USMC (Aim Small, Miss Small)
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To: Red in Blue PA
True though some have tried ... not very well

.

13 posted on 07/28/2012 12:34:26 PM PDT by Elle Bee
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To: ctdonath2
Haven't any idea if this tan color will be on civilian models but I haven't kept up on firearms. I've got a Colt Government Model (1911) I bought new many years ago and I love it.
14 posted on 07/28/2012 12:35:01 PM PDT by jazusamo ("Intellect is not wisdom" -- Thomas Sowell)
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To: Red in Blue PA
“Over 100 years later, nobody has improved on John Moses Browning's design.”
Yeah, if you take the basic off the shelf government model and put about 100 hours of gunsmithing into it, it works just fine.
Out of the box, not so much.
15 posted on 07/28/2012 12:53:51 PM PDT by bitterohiogunclinger (Proudly casting a heavy carbon footprint as I clean my guns ---)
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To: oh8eleven
I never had to qualify with the M1911 pistol, but the few times I did fire it, I could barely hit the side of a barn.

I'm with you. I never shot better than marksman with the 1911 but shot expert every time after the Navy switched to the M92. And I also shot expert with the M-14.

16 posted on 07/28/2012 1:01:46 PM PDT by GATOR NAVY
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To: GATOR NAVY

Shot Expert with the damned thing, got to the point where I could keep a beer can in the air, some old guy gave me some pointers.

Last time I shot one, 40 years later, I couldn’t hit a Bull in the butt, I forgot the pointers.


17 posted on 07/28/2012 1:11:50 PM PDT by Little Bill
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To: Mycroft Holmes
That derringer sounds like the Star PD that I shot. Cute little thing, but remove too much mass, and any .45 reaches recoil levels that even those like me, who actually "enjoy" recoil, find unpleasant. And too short a .45 barrel produces muzzle blast that literally slaps you in the face, and muzzle flash that would singe the hair off a hog...

I prefer something shorter than the stock 1911 for carry -- but you can easily go too far. Anyone considering a "concealable" .45 better try it before they buy it.

18 posted on 07/28/2012 1:12:07 PM PDT by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: Red in Blue PA
Some reports suggest Marines are not happy with their main Beretta M9s for their lack of accuracy and stopping power.

Or in other words, DoD procurement forgot about the lessons learned from the Philippine Insurrection, in which the .38 revolvers could not stop drug-crazed Muslim rebels.

19 posted on 07/28/2012 1:12:07 PM PDT by Timber Rattler (Just say NO! to RINOS and the GOP-E)
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To: TXnMA

I don’t particularly like recoil but the Star PD never bothered me.

I have owned two of them and thought they were about the right size for a lightweight .45. I also like the Combat Commander and regular Commander, but I guess the full size standard model is my favorite.

I agree with Jeff Cooper on one thing. The closer a 1911 is to stock, the better. About the only thing they need is some could use a better trigger. Some are fine as is.

The regular sights are OK to me but a lot of people prefer a higher, easier to see one.


20 posted on 07/28/2012 1:21:20 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: Red in Blue PA

I’m not sure what John Moses Browning would think about the rail. But, good. I like my 1911 (except for the dents that the I put in the ceiling with the recoil spring plug).


21 posted on 07/28/2012 1:50:54 PM PDT by Sooth2222 ("Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But I repeat myself." M.Twain)
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To: Red in Blue PA

yea, the best auto pistol that i know. had a browning HP also. great gun.

for hunting, nothing could beat a ruger blackhawk. love revolvers, my favorite is a dan wesson 357.

if i had to go to combat, i would prefer a 1911.

with a lot of clips, of course.

Blessings, bobo


22 posted on 07/28/2012 1:57:46 PM PDT by bobo1
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To: bobo1
Top of my "to buy" list- (45 Colt/45 ACP)
23 posted on 07/28/2012 2:13:27 PM PDT by matthew fuller (I will be voting for the real American for President.)
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To: Red in Blue PA
"FOR WHEN YOUR BAYONET BREAKS


24 posted on 07/28/2012 2:19:35 PM PDT by Mormon Cricket
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To: Red in Blue PA
Seriously, how can you be a first rate fighting force with 20th century technology? The Marines could have Glock 21s with 13 round basic capacity, 27 round sticks , and a 3 round auto sear for half the money.

Lose the romance of the 1911.


25 posted on 07/28/2012 2:31:20 PM PDT by Mormon Cricket
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To: Timber Rattler

Some reports suggest Marines are not happy with their main Beretta M9s for their lack of accuracy and stopping power.

FYI, Since the Marsoc guys stopped using 1911’s they got rid of 9MM. My son was one of the first operators and they were the same until they tested and finally on the Colt.
By tha time my son had rotated out of Afghanistan and had about 3 years to stay around as a Marsoc instructor both pistol or rifle. ( switched and now an officer)


26 posted on 07/28/2012 2:31:42 PM PDT by Recon Dad (Gas & Petroleum Junkie)
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To: yarddog

First .45 I owned was a Star PD. I bought it used and shot it a lot, thousands of rounds, and the frame cracked. I used it a lot harder than it was meant to be used, so I still think of it as a decent carry pistol. If another came my way, I wouldn’t turn my nose up at it.

As to the USMC purchasing this gussied up M1911A1, I think it’s a good decision. I never had a problem shooting those “old, worn out” pistols that Uncle Sam issued to us, even though several examples required some pretty pronounced Kentucky windage and elevation. Never did feel as secure with that M9 as with that old slabsided hand cannon by my side.

If I recall correctly, the USMC fairly recently decided that sidearms were only going to be issued to officers O-6 and above, and the SNCOs and junior officers were going to get M4 carbines. This new 1911 is going to be for special operators, an important but limited role. It’s not like they are ditching all the M9 Pistols and M4 carbines USMC wide to go back to the 1911.


27 posted on 07/28/2012 2:33:22 PM PDT by M1911A1
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To: oh8eleven
As others have said, worn out guns make for bad shooting.

I have had the pleasure of firing an Army 1911 built in 1921 and re-arsenaled at Anniston Arsenal, GA. in 1945. It shot unnaturally well-I actually shot better with it than with a finely tuned custom 1911.

It's a mortal sin to shoot such a thing, but one should do it a few times just to know what shooting is supposed to be like.

28 posted on 07/28/2012 2:41:28 PM PDT by jboot (OPSEC. It's a killjoy, but it may save your life someday.)
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To: Mormon Cricket
Seriously, how can you be a first rate fighting force with 20th century technology? The Marines could have Glock 21s with 13 round basic capacity, 27 round sticks , and a 3 round auto sear for half the money.

We don't need a plastic pistol that blows up and has inadequate safety features. Kimber would have been a better choice than Colt, however.

29 posted on 07/28/2012 2:44:25 PM PDT by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: Red in Blue PA

Great face-eating-zombie stopping power!


30 posted on 07/28/2012 3:01:44 PM PDT by vanilla swirl (searching for something meaningfull to say)
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To: SVTCobra03

Much as I love my 1911 pistols, a handgun in today’s military of little consequence in the big scheme of things. The new M45 is a specialized tool in a specialized role.

If I was in charge (shudder to think of it) I’d let NCO’s and officers carry any pistol or revolver they wanted, if they didn’t like the GI one and they could qualify with it.


31 posted on 07/28/2012 3:12:01 PM PDT by M1911A1
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To: M1911A1

That sounds about right for the PD. As you said it was intended as a carry pistol not for heavy duty use. Star certainly knew how to build heavy duty guns tho.

I have read that some of the model 28/30s have fired over 90,000 rounds.

I think part of the problem with the .38s in the Phillipines was those .38 Colt Army and Navy revolvers fired a really weak cartridge, less than half as powerful as the 9mm.


32 posted on 07/28/2012 3:17:27 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: SVTCobra03
When we face a real military (and we surely will), the Marine infantry had better up their game.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/1041872/chinese_pla_infantry_weapons/

U.S Marines vs Chinese Marines

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFoWCbQjwXw

Semper Fi

33 posted on 07/28/2012 3:48:43 PM PDT by Mormon Cricket
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To: oh8eleven

A .45 has such a kick to it unless your wrist is as thick as a normal guy`s leg.

After each shot I`ve always had to pause and reacquire the target.

But I do like the slug. Even Rodney King on crack wouldn`t get up when you get hit with one.


34 posted on 07/28/2012 4:07:54 PM PDT by Para-Ord.45
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To: M1911A1

As a “non-combatant” corpsman i carried the m1911a1 in Nam until it was stolen. I replaced it with a sawed-off 12 gauge pump shotgun. I was never questioned about what i carried.


35 posted on 07/28/2012 4:30:05 PM PDT by fatrat (extremely extreme right-wing radicalized veteran)
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To: Red in Blue PA
It took the USMC almost thirty years to figure out what most of knew from the start: There was just no way that Eye-talian made 9MM could effectively replace an American made Colt Model 1911A1 .45 Pistol.
36 posted on 07/28/2012 4:58:26 PM PDT by DJ Taylor (Once again our country is at war, and once again the Democrats have sided with our enemy.)
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To: Red in Blue PA

.45 ACP. designed especially to kill moslem Juramentados. and it works!


37 posted on 07/28/2012 6:45:56 PM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: Mormon Cricket

I would have to learn a lot more about that obstacle course before I worried about it.

Was that just a regular Marine unit grabbed off the base and seeing the course for the first time, and who were the Chinese, and had they trained for the event on that course.


38 posted on 07/28/2012 8:24:08 PM PDT by ansel12 (Massachusetts Governors,,, where the GOP goes for it's "conservative" Presidential candidates.)
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