Posted on 01/05/2012 7:44:29 AM PST by SLB
An Afghanistan war veteran is in trouble for giving a political speech while in uniform at a caucus night rally with Ron Paul on Tuesday in Iowa.
A spokeswoman for the U.S. Army Reserve told TPM on Wednesday that Cpl. Jesse Thorsen may have violated military policy when he wore his fatigues on stage and praised the Texas congressman’s presidential bid.
Thorsen’s commander is now looking into the speech and will figure out what to do next, said the spokeswoman, Maj. Angel Wallace.
The Des Moines-based soldier served in Afghanistan but hasn’t been on active duty since October, Wallace said. However, he still serves a weekend a month and two weeks a year as a reservist and may be deployed to Afghanistan again in about a year.
Thorsen seemed awestruck to stand alongside the Republican candidate on Tuesday, telling the crowd it was “like meeting a rock star.” He praised Paul’s anti-war stance.
“His foreign policy is, by far, hands down, better than any candidate’s out there. And I’m sure you all know that,” the reservist said. “We don’t need to be picking fights overseas and I think everybody else knows that, too.”
The crowd cheered, but observers who know military law cringed.
“He’s got a problem on his hands and certainly he should have known better,” said Eugene Fidell, who teaches military justice at Yale Law School. “All kinds of lights and buzzers should have gone off.”
Had Thorsen been on active duty, he could have faced up to two years in military prison and a dishonorable discharge, Fidell said. But even off active duty, he may still be facing punishment.
Fidell said Paul’s campaign should have known better, too. That night’s third-place finish “must have been better than they expected,” Fidell said, because “they allowed their better judgement to get away from them.”
Paul’s campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Meanwhile, the military distanced itself from the speech.
“His beliefs and speech in no way reflect the views of the Army Reserve,” Wallace said. “This soldier stands alone.”
I saw a posting in another thread on this subject that service members could participate in a campaign rally as spectators while in uniform. From what I read about this incident elsewhere, he wasn't there to appear, but was called up on stage by the candidate.
Yes, both he and the candidate (or at least the candidate's campaign staff) should have known better. But, that would be an uncomfortable invitation to refuse.
Equally if not more valid questions: He supports Ron Paul's foreign policy positions? Is he even capable of rational thought?
Actually, if you click through to the link, than then the "record removal" at the top right:
https://florida.arrests.org/remove/?id=3040590
You'll see that the record was sealed or expunged.
I don't know the reliability of the record removal request. This isn't an official source of data. Their own disclaimer says:
No claims to the accuracy of this information are made. The information and photos presented here have been collected from county sheriff's websites. The people featured here may not of been convicted of the charges or crimes listed and are presumed innocent. Do not rely on this site to determine any person's actual criminal record. Contact the county clerk or State's Attorney's office for more information. All comments and opinions are submitted by internet users and in no way reflect the views or opinions of the site operators.
Don't mistake this as a defense of the guy. I just don't think he should be unjustly accused, especially if the arrest itself was some kind of mistake.
Ron Paul should have known this action violated the Hatch Act and prevented the corporal from embarrassing himself. Instead, Rue Paul called attention to the corporal.
The article claims that he is a felon. But, 30 months of probation and 3 weeks of community service sounds like it was at least pled down to a misdemeanor. If it was indeed a felony, would he have been able to re-enlist?
“Cpl. Jesse Thorsen may have violated military policy when he wore his fatigues on stage”
May have? No question, it’s the most common thing we brief people on every election season. What an idiot.
Colonel, USAFR
Can’t - he wasn’t in status (on active duty or performing inactive duty for training), so UCMJ doesn’t apply. Sucks, but there you go.
Colonel, USAFR
Yes as to all. Just no excuse for this.
He’s in hot water? Five’ll get you ten he’s a tent pole in a bath and shower unit.
Exatly. If he’s not in some sort of status...IDT...AT...Title 32 of some sort...Title 10...there’s not a lot that can be done I would think...but then again...I’m not a JAG. Now...they could maybe give him an LOR or LOC...but UCMJ? Doubt it. A lawyer would have a field day.
Navy officials said it was the first time on record that a same-sex couple was chosen to kiss first upon a ship's return.
Exactly! This guy says a few words in support of Ron Paul (no, I don’t support him) and he could be in trouble yet a group of perverts parade around in uniform in an obvious political event (a homo-pride parade) and nothing is said or done to them.
This is the double standard many feared when allowing open perversion within the military.
Yet the staged photo-op with young folk in Military costume purportedly protesting DADT seems to have gone unpunished?
I guess the unit Commander of the Reservist was no Paulbot— while the Unit Commander(s) of those in the staged chained to the WhiteHouse fence kids got a pass because their CO was brown nosing the selected President?
I’m an AF reserve JAG. I don’t know that they could even go the LOC/LOR route for conduct while not in status - but I haven’t done that research since I was a unit guy almost 10 years ago.
I can’t believe it. He is actually going to get the treatment that Joe the Plumber received. Amazing since Paul is a rather liberal candidate.
He is a reservist....hasn’t been on duty since October.
He went to the event in uniform for the express purpose of getting attention. He got it.
Wore his lowest class uniform too.
He will get punished, EVERYONE knows this is a no-no.
"5. RESERVE/GUARD MEMBERS. According to AFI 36-2907, IC 2005-1, para. 3.1, commanders, supervisors, and other persons in authority can issue administrative counselings, admonitions, and reprimands to reservists who commit an offense even while in civilian status. Under AFI 36-2907, para. 3.5.1.4, non-EAD reservists have 30 calendar days from the date of receipt of the certified letter to acknowledge the notification, intended actions, and provide pertinent information before the commander makes a final decision....AFI 36-2907 does not apply to Air National Guard (ANG) members. Many state codes of military justice authorize letters of admonition or reprimand. There is no AFI or ANGI that addresses the issuing of counselings, admonitions, and reprimands to ANG members; however, commanders and supervisors have inherent authority to do so. Consult your local staff judge advocate before issuing an LOC, LOA or LOR to an ANG member."
I had to do this once to a reservist in civilian status several years ago, so it was fresh on my mind. We had to consult the Texas UCMJ regarding NG members since the UCMJ didn't apply. However, according to the AFI...a reservist can be given an LOR even in civilian status. When it comes to guardsmen...you have to consult the State laws. I would imagine most states give commanders the authority. There has to be a way to punish conduct unbecoming...DWI...etc.
You are more than welcome to a copy of the guide. FREEPMAIL me with your email and I'll send it to you via my .mil
He’s in hot water? Five’ll get you ten he’s a tent pole in a bath and shower unit.
He will probably just get a letter of caution or something. I don’t see him going to a big trial. I hope not anyway. The trial would be occurring in October and november and Obama can say that the Republicans don’t support the troops or some crap like that.
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