The scourge from nowhere

Dawn ^ | 9 April, 2005 | Dawn

[ozzymandus]

Maybe we should hire this Kahn guy to run the War On Terror.

[swilhelm73]

Babur.

Inherited lands in Afghanistan and Transoxania that were what was left from his grandfather (IIRC) Tamerlane - a man perhaps more brutal then Genghis, and a fanatical Muslim.

Babur decided that fighting his traditional enemy the Uzbeks over pats of Tamerlane's old empire wasn't worth it and expanded instead into northern India, which was wealthy but ruled by a weak and incompetent line of sultans.

After winning the battle of Panipat against serious odds, Babur became the ruler of northern India.

[swilhelm73]

Oh, and Babur also claimed, accurately IIRC, to be related to Genghis.

[muawiyah]

As are at least 10% of all the men in all the lands the Mongols conquered.

They all have his y chromosome!

[Dad yer funny]

ping , this is a great thread,...I hope it keeps going,...I'll get back to it after the Little League game in the a.m.

[Dad yer funny]

ping , this is a great thread,...I hope it keeps going,...I'll get back to it after the Little League game in the a.m.

[muawiyah]

The Mongol Conquest thread comes up about once a month. People continue to react to the reopening of the Silk Road as though it were the latest thing in Interstate highways!

[Cronos]

The Huns cam from an area around what is now Ukraine, more than 1000 years before the incursions of the Mongols. Many Huns settled eventually in what is now Central Europe, and specifically in Hungary.

Then how come the Huns are spoken of in China at the same time they were invading the Roman Empire and a branch of the huns, called the White huns were invading north-western India?

[Cronos]

Good points in posts #36 and 37

[Cronos]

I seem to recall that the Mongols started their invasion of the Middle East with a state called Kwarzim (sp?) that would probably be about where Pakistan is today.

Actually closer to northern Afghanistan- the valley of Fergana. The initial flush of Mongols never entered the Indian sub-continent. Their later descendents (the Moghuls, a mix of Mongols and Turks) conquered northern, eastern, western and central India around the 16th century.

[Fractal Trader]

I doubt the Wash Post called the Mongols "a species"

I think the species argument relates to the fact that Genghis's genes have been passed on through many descendants across many different cultures. Too put it bluntly, he raped/copulated with a phenomenal amount of women wherever he conquered.

No other individual comes close to Genghis Khan in terms of their contribution to the human gene pool. A species, perhaps not, but a notable (and probably pleasurable) accomplishment from an extremely talented marauder.

[GoLightly]

More like, he'd extend our borders far enough to where there wouldn't be any problem from any direction.

[Cronos]

Timur-e-Lang was not Babur's grandfather, but his ancestor and Babur was one of the Timurid princes in line to take over Samerkhand.

[Cronos]

on his mother's side.

[Mike Darancette]

BTW, the actual date of economic collapse of the entire world was about 538 AD.

Catastrophe PING.

[Spktyr]

Ghengis tried to set up a peaceful trading empire after conquering China. He didn't go back on the warpath and start heading for Europe until the idiot Persians sent his ambassador's head back to the "weak and distant barbarian" Khan in a bag. Unfortunately, the ambassador was a friend of the Khan.

We all know what happened next.

[John Valentine]

Steppe peoples were nomadic, cohesive, tribal, and wide-ranging. It is not beyond reason that they could have made appearances in all these places.

And when you say "at the same time" you don't really mean "at the same time", you mean "around the same time, say plus or minus 20 to 50 years, don't you? I'm not saying that the SAME groups of Huns atacked the outposts of the Roman Empire and outposts of China or India at different times, but as the main groups moved around it is highly likely that their presence would be felt in widely displaced locations.

[CobaltBlue]

I've been reading Alan Furst's novels about WWII. Seems that the Russians (Soviets) were using Mongol soldiers even then, and they scared the pants off of their enemies even then.

[ekidsohbelaas]

Dude... u have a thread dedicated to you!

[Modernman]

The "golden age" of muslim accomplishments is greatly overrated. They are, and always have been, an inferior society.

Objectively, the Muslim Middle-East during the period was at the height of civilization at the time. Most of Europe was still immersed in medieval barbarism.