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To: Safrguns; Elsie
To add to your discussion, “OSAS” is nowhere to be found in scripture. You cannot lose what you do not yet have.

Nobody is yet “saved” because that salvation lies in the spiritual rebirth Yeshua described to Nicodemus in John Ch 3, which rebirth enables the re-born to travel invisibly through our present dwelling place like the wind, as described clearly in verse 8:

John 3:

[6] That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
[7] Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.
[8] The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.


We must “endure to the end,” as Yeshua plainly stated in Matthew 24, and as repeated by all of the apostles numerous times in the various epistles.
1Peter 1:

[9] Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Hebrews 4:

[1] Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
[2] For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Philippians 2:

[12] Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

We can “know that we will be saved” if we so endure.

To that end, Yeshua writes his commandments “on the fleshly tables of their hearts.”

.

122 posted on 11/18/2014 10:14:28 AM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: editor-surveyor
Nobody is yet “saved” because that salvation lies in the spiritual rebirth Yeshua described to Nicodemus in John Ch 3, which rebirth enables the re-born to travel invisibly through our present dwelling place like the wind, as described clearly in verse 8:

Another part you missed...Before Jesus 'went up', his body was glorified just as our will be...

1Co_15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

1Co_15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

1Co_15:40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

While our terrestrial bodies contain the Spirit of God, we're still glued to the earth...When we die, or at the Rapture, our terrestrial bodies will change into celestial bodies as Jesus' body did just before he was risen...

Had Jesus not had his physical body changed, when he went to travel thru that wall, his body would have flattened out against the wall and slid down the wall just as cartoons depict...

130 posted on 11/18/2014 11:57:16 AM PST by Iscool
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To: editor-surveyor

>>> “OSAS” is nowhere to be found in scripture.

Neither is the word “Trinity”, but we understand the truth of it.

Actually, there are many truths that are not specifically spelled out for us in easy-to-read one-liners. Some truths are left for us to seek and find in scripture with the council of the Holy Spirit.

I’m having a really hard time with your argument, which is why I took so long to respond...

You say that NOBODY is yet saved, but then claim Jesus was describing how the re-born are enabled to travel invisibly through our PRESENT dwelling place like the wind. This is a self contradicting statement. We become saved during our life on earth, or we do not. If NOBODY is yet saved, then salvation must come after death.

Jesus said in the passage you referenced that we must be born again to be saved. That is what is clear and relevant... so the question becomes “When are we born-again?” When you say that NOBODY is yet saved because salvation lies in spiritual rebirth, I can only surmise that what you are saying is that we are not reborn until after we die, OR that we cannot know that we are saved until after we die.

>>> We must “endure to the end,” as Yeshua plainly stated in Matthew 24, and as repeated by all of the apostles numerous times in the various epistles.

Chuck Missler made the observation that there is more in the bible about end times than any other subject in the bible, including the subject of Jesus’ ministry on earth.

Such is the case with Matthew 24 in which Jesus is responding to a question about the end of days. We are currently living in the age of Grace. While the Holy Spirit resides here on earth, salvation is promised to those who repent and believe in Jesus. Once the Holy Spirit lifts His hand from the earth, the age of grace ends, and what begins is testing and judgment of the nations. Salvation at that point takes on an additional requirement, namely that believers NOT take the mark of the beast. “Enduring to the end” is a tribulation era reference only. By applying this phrase to the church age, you must also define specifically WHAT is to be endured... because Jesus specifically lays out in Matt 24 what is to be endured DURING THE TRIBULATION in order to be saved.


131 posted on 11/18/2014 12:17:14 PM PST by Safrguns (PM me if you like to play Minecraft!)
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To: editor-surveyor

>>> We can “know that we will be saved” if we so endure.

How can one know that they will endure?

Peter did not believe he would deny Christ 3 times, and yet Jesus knew that he would.

It is impossible for anyone to know that they will succeed or fail in anything.

Endurance is a work.

Salvation is by Grace not by works.

The sacrificial blood of Christ cannot be mingled with the filthy rags of man’s works.


132 posted on 11/18/2014 12:23:07 PM PST by Safrguns (PM me if you like to play Minecraft!)
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To: editor-surveyor
You cannot lose what you do not yet have.

You CAN lose what you DO have!

1 John 5:13

I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

Take your argument up with JOHN!

139 posted on 11/18/2014 2:00:38 PM PST by Elsie ( Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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