Posted on 07/07/2013 10:37:51 AM PDT by Colofornian
On the day of July 8, 1838 -- 175 years ago tomorrow -- the original "prophet" of the Church of Mormon, Joseph Smith, made up four "revelations" from the Mormon god:
These are recorded in Doctrine & Covenants (numbers 117, 118, 119, & 120). Let's look at some of the verses in these:
117:12: I say unto you, I remember my servant Oliver Granger; behold, verily I say unto him that his name shall be had in sacred remembrance from generation to generation, forever and ever, saith the Lord."
Of course, you all know Oliver Granger, right? ....Uh, right?
Well, surely, you Mormons do. Right? You hold his name as a household sacred byword. Right? Generation after generation? Yes? No?
Apart from this entry, who remembers Oliver Granger? (And why?)
What? As Oliver Granger obscurity continues, a false prophesy by Smith, then? (Apparently so)
***************************************
Earlier in the chapter, Smith returns to talk about "the mountains of Adam-ondi-Ahman and on the plains of Olaha Shinehah, or the land where Adam dwelt..." (v. 8) [In D&C 116, Adam had unveiled less than two months earlier that "Adam shall come to visit his people" in this place; original reference was in D&C 78]
Per Lds "apostle" Bruce R. McConkie: "Adam-ondi-Ahman -- meaning the place or land of God where Adam dwelt -- is at a place called Spring Hill, Davies County, Missouri. This site is named by the Lord 'Adam-ondi-Ahman...'" (The Millennial Messiah, pp. 587-588)
LDS Church "prophet" Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr. stated that before the Second Coming, Adam will convene another meeting at that place to turn the government of the human family officially to Jesus Christ (Source: Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p. 13)
So...Spring Hill, MO...I know that's on the bluffs of a river. Yet Smith talks about "the mountains" of this area, which is now farmland owned by the Mormon church. What "mountains" rise up there?
Per another Lds "apostle" -- Mark E. Petersen, in his book, Adam: Who is He? -- says on p. 15 that Adam lived in Missouri.
Enough to measure a few of Joseph Smith's prophecies, right? Or, just take one: Lds "scripture" -- D&C 117:12:
From the article:
I say unto you, I remember my servant Oliver Granger; behold, verily I say unto him that his name shall be had in sacred remembrance from generation to generation, forever and ever, saith the Lord."
Of course, you all know Oliver Granger, right? ....Uh, right?
Well, surely, you Mormons do. Right? You hold his name as a household sacred byword. Right? Generation after generation? Yes? No?
Apart from this entry, who remembers Oliver Granger? (And why?)
What? As Oliver Granger obscurity continues, a false prophesy by Smith, then? (Apparently so)
***************************************
Earlier in the chapter, Smith returns to talk about "the mountains of Adam-ondi-Ahman and on the plains of Olaha Shinehah, or the land where Adam dwelt..." (v. 8) [In D&C 116, Adam had unveiled less than two months earlier that "Adam shall come to visit his people" in this place; original reference was in D&C 78]
LDS Church "prophet" Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr. stated that before the Second Coming, Adam will convene another meeting at that place to turn the government of the human family officially to Jesus Christ (Source: Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p. 13)
Ping for later
I personally cannot imagine anyone being a “morman” after careful analysis.
The dna evidence is against them, the BOM, refutes archeology, and history is a mean thing. I have read the BOM, the DOC, and much history.
If someone running for president believes in these myths, he will not be elected. That is how Romney couldn’t win.
Ping for July, 2213.
The argument is that since he is in the D&C, then by that alone his name is in sacred remembrance.
I’m serious.
http://www.cathar.info/120502_arnaud.htm
Is FR really the place for such prejudiced diatribes? I would hope FR is above such selective hatred?
No?
Well ... it's been 175 years ... [long] enough to measure a few of Joseph Smith's prophecies, right?
Yep ... and here are a few of my favorites ...
A financial empire: A banking institution, who like Aaron's rod shall swallow up all other banks … and grow and flourish and spread from the rivers to the ends of the earth, and survive when all others should be laid in ruins. – Zion’s Watchman, March 24, 1838
Joseph’s revelation concerning the Kirtland Safety Society – a bank that failed within two weeks and triggered the recession of 1837. For years, this was the largest financial fraud (and one of the most blatant ever) in U.S. history.
Missouri will be devastated: … I prophesy in the name of the Lord God of Israel, unless the United States redress the wrongs committed upon the Saints in the state of Missouri and punish the crimes committed by her officers that in a few years the government will be utterly overthrown and wasted, and there will not be so much as a potsherd left. – February 1835 – History of the Church, Vol. 2, p. 182.
And a few years later, Missouri was indeed wasted.
Polygamy ... for ever: For behold, I reveal unto you a new and everlasting covenant; and if ye abide not that covenant, then are ye damned; for no one can reject this covenant and be permitted to enter into my glory – Doctrine & Covenants – Section 132
Mormonism’s god required polygamy – after outlawing it in the Book of Mormon and D&C Section 101. And it was indeed everlasting – until the 1890 Manifesto, or the 1906 Second Manifesto, or the 1923 Prohibition, or whenever.
An eternal place of worship:The Nauvoo House [Temple] shall stand for ever and ever. – Doctrine and Covenants 124:56-60
And indeed it did. Until 1848, when, after Brigham tried to unsuccessfully sell the building to the Jesuits, it burned down.
The Second coming of Christ: … go forth to prune the vineyard for the last time, or the coming of the lord, which was nigh even fifty-six years should wind up the scene – Joseph Smith – History of the Church, Vol. 2, p. 182 – prophesied on February 14, 1835On the 14th of Feb. 1835, Joseph Smith uaid [said] that God had revealed to him that the coming of Christ would be within 56 years, which added to 1835 shows that before 1891 and the 14th of Feb. the Savior of the world would make his appearance again upon the earth and the winding up scene take place – Journal of Oliver Huntington, Vol. 2, pp. 128,129.
Sure enough, the Second Coming of Christ occurred on Valentine’s Day, 1891.
Moonmen: The inhabitants of the moon are more of a uniform size than the inhabitants of the earth, being six feet in height. They dress very much like the Quaker style and are quite general in style or fashion of dress. They live to be very old; coming generally near a thousand years. This is the description of them as given by Joseph Smith the Seer. – Journal of Oliver B. Huntington, Vol 2, p 166.
It’s not Joseph’s fault NASA missed these people in 1969. They really are still up there. Somewhere. Really.
The throne of God: Abraham saw, by the Urim and Thummim, the huge star Kolob, "that it was nearest to the throne of God" – Abraham 3:2; that Kolob is the first of all of God’s creations and is the greatest (largest in mass) of all the stars – Abraham 3:16; and that it "governs all the stars which belong to the same order as that upon which thou [Abraham] standest [earth]" – Abraham 3:3. The scriptures also establish that God’s throne is in the "midst [center] of all things" – Doctrine and Covenants 88:13.
Somewhere, over the rainbow … in Sector 1328 of the Constellation Cancer, or in the center of the Milky Way Galaxy in the Constellation Sagittarius, or near the Star Sirius in the Constellation Canis Major, or in the center of the Andromeda Galaxy, or …wherever.
Global Warming: Those who are in the north countries... shall smite the rocks, and the ice shall flow down at their presence. – Doctrine and Covenants 133:26.
Smith's uncanny prediction of Global Warming resulting from hydrocarbons taken by smiting the rocks has been confirmed by no less of an authority than the Nobel Laureate Al Gore.
Destruction of the US government: Joseph Smith prophesies "by virtue of the holy priesthood... and in the name of the Lord" that if Congress or the United States will not redress the wrongs which the Mormons suffered in Missouri, and grant them protection, "the government will be utterly overthrown and wasted," they shall be "broken up as a government" and there will be nothing left of them. – Joseph Smith – History of the Church 5:394
Obama may yet fulfill this one!
A vain prophet will be thrown down: For although a man may have many revelations, and have power to do many mighty works, yet if he boasts in his own strength, and sets at naught the counsels of God, and follows after the dictates of his own will and carnal desires, he must fall and incur the vengeance of a just God upon him. – Joseph Smith – Doctrine and Covenants 3:4
Joseph got one right! But for some reason, the Mormon Church skips over this prophesy. Anybody out there know why?
People here like to have debates with accurate information. Mormons are great people; but the religion they practice is one that is entirely made up by man.
Mormonism doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.
You brought out abuses that were practiced by some Christians in the past. Those abuses do not invalidate Christianity. But rather those abuses show why man needs to find and follow the word of God, so those abuses are not repeated.
Are those Warren Jeff’s wives?
Some kind of LDS group.
Here’s your sign, apologist.
Parade your victimhood somewhere else. If you’re not aware that the Episcopalian embrace of the degeneracy (for instance) has been attacked thoroughly at FR, then you might want to do a little research before whining your victimhood. But you are reinforcing the notion that Mormonism apologists are trained in deception techniques (read, not so subtle lying).
Not any more, anyway. FR Keyword: Blood Atonement
I don’t know much about LDS theology. I believe that a lot of their scriptures are challenged by people more educated than me.
But,,, if “by their fruits you shall know them”, then something works for them. I have lived in Utah among them. I have seen the clean homes, parks, retail areas, no graffiti, respectful young people, and especially helpful and respectful clerks in store toward elderly people. I have seen their patriotism and social stability up close. I’m not even talking about their SHTF preparedness.
So what does their religion contribute to this stability and quality of life? If their theology is flawed, what are they doing better than all of the rest of us?
I can't either. It should be clear that Joseph Smith was no prophet.
Moses was confirmed as a prophet by amazing miracles. And Moses laid down the test of a prophet and prophesized about the prophets to come after him. Those prophets themselves were also confirmed by miracles, though none as extensive as Moses. Until Jesus came and Jesus was confirmed by many miracles as well as hundreds of prophecies made by the prophets before him.
The Apostle John prophesied about two prophets during the end time. But no prophet ever mentioned Joseph Smith. A gap so glaring that Joseph Smith actually tried to rewrite the Bible to include himself in the Books of Moses to try to gains some legitimacy.
Where are the miracles confirming Joseph Smith? Instead of confirmation what you see is an abuse of power ala Mohammad style. You see the marrying of many women including relationships expressly forbidden by the Old Testament such as marrying sisters, and marrying both a child and her mother. And to justify this behavior he has to contradict the clear words of Jesus who said their was no marriage in Heaven.
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