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SBC doesn’t call for Boy Scout exodus
ABPNews ^ | Wednesday June 12, 2013 | Bob Allen

Posted on 06/12/2013 9:04:27 PM PDT by Rashputin

SBC doesn’t call for Boy Scout exodus

A highly anticipated resolution condemning the Boy Scouts’ new membership policy affirms churches and individuals that sever ties, while calling for greater engagement by those that don’t.

By Bob Allen

The Southern Baptist Convention stopped short of urging churches to sever ties with the Boy Scouts of America in a June 11 resolution condemning the organization’s recent decision to drop its ban on Scouts who are openly gay.

The non-binding resolution expresses “continued opposition to and disappointment in the decision of the Boy Scouts of America to change its membership policy” and called for the removal of Scout leaders who pushed for the policy change.

It affirms “the right of all families and churches prayerfully to assess their continued relationship with the BSA” and expresses “support for those churches and families that as a matter of conscience can no longer be part of the Scouting family.”

Meanwhile it encourages churches and families “that seek to remain in the Boy Scouts to impact as many boys as possible with the life-changing gospel of Jesus Christ.”

The resolution urges churches that choose to end sponsorship of Scout units to continue ministering to boys by expanding the Royal Ambassador ministry, “a distinctively Southern Baptist missions organization to develop godly young men.”

It also cites “well-founded concern that the current executive leadership of the BSA, along with certain board members, may utilize this membership policy change as merely the first step toward future approval of homosexual leaders in the Scouts.”


TOPICS: General Discusssion; Moral Issues
KEYWORDS: baptist; boyscouts; homosexualagenda; religion; sbc
Is this a sufficient reaction from the Southern Baptist Convention or should they have recommended that every SBC church completely sever ties with the Boy Scouts?

I'm especially interested in what people who are members of an SBC church think about this approach.

1 posted on 06/12/2013 9:04:28 PM PDT by Rashputin
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To: Rashputin

Wife and I are battling with this.. Kid loves it but.. We might let him finish off cub scouts and move on to something else.

Church we met in has told our pack we won’t be welcome much longer and to start looking for a “friendly” building to meet in.

I might be in Minnesota but I’m in the 6th.. About as red as you can get in MN.


2 posted on 06/12/2013 9:07:34 PM PDT by cableguymn (The founding fathers would be shooting by now..)
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To: Rashputin

I’m a member of a SB church.

I am very disappointed. Not surprised, just disappointed.

I am motivated at this point to just go find a church that has the gonads to actually stand up and do something instead of issuing shallow condemnations.

They might as well have said “we’re ok with it.”


3 posted on 06/12/2013 9:09:53 PM PDT by Safrguns (PM me if you like to play Minecraft!)
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To: Rashputin

People who parse and excuse deserve what happens to their kids. Their waffling brings that on them. It will be their fault for helping push the lib agenda.


4 posted on 06/12/2013 9:10:09 PM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: Rashputin; HoosierDammit; TYVets; red irish; fastrock; NorthernCrunchyCon; UMCRevMom@aol.com; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

5 posted on 06/12/2013 9:13:06 PM PDT by narses
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To: Rashputin
I guess the SBC doesn’t want to give up that Gay Lobby money either. The SBC has been leaning left for more than 40 years, guess they have finally arrived.

I gave up on them when they changed their tract literature to indicate that a young girl conceived not a Virgin conceive, when discussing the story of Mary. That was almost 4o years ago.

6 posted on 06/12/2013 9:15:24 PM PDT by itsahoot (It is not so much that history repeats, but that human nature does not change.)
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To: itsahoot

My soul magnifies the Lord,
And my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.
For He has regarded the low estate of His handmaiden,
For behold, henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
For He who is mighty has done great things for me, and holy is His name. And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.
He has shown strength with His arm:
He has scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts.
He has put down the mighty from their thrones,
and exalted those of low degree.
He has filled the hungry with good things;
and the rich He has sent empty away.
He has helped His servant Israel, in remembrance of His mercy;
As He spoke to our fathers, to Abraham and to His posterity forever.

Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit.
As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen

Magníficat ánima mea Dóminum,
et exsultávit spíritus meus
in Deo salvatóre meo,
quia respéxit humilitátem
ancíllæ suæ.

Ecce enim ex hoc beátam
me dicent omnes generatiónes,
quia fecit mihi magna,
qui potens est,
et sanctum nomen eius,
et misericórdia eius in progénies
et progénies timéntibus eum.
Fecit poténtiam in bráchio suo,
dispérsit supérbos mente cordis sui;
depósuit poténtes de sede
et exaltávit húmiles.
Esuriéntes implévit bonis
et dívites dimísit inánes.
Suscépit Ísrael púerum suum,
recordátus misericórdiæ,
sicut locútus est ad patres nostros,
Ábraham et sémini eius in sæcula.

Glória Patri et Fílio
et Spirítui Sancto.
Sicut erat in princípio,
et nunc et semper,
et in sæcula sæculórum.

Amen.


7 posted on 06/12/2013 9:16:24 PM PDT by narses
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To: Rashputin

This is baloney. Boy Scouts are boys. They don’t need to be exposed to adult horsehockey and debauchery.


8 posted on 06/12/2013 9:17:41 PM PDT by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
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Comment #9 Removed by Moderator

To: Rashputin
I am not a member of the SBC, but I am a member of the LC-MS, which is a conservative Lutheran denomination. It is struggling with this matter, and I fear that it, too, will come out with a lame statement similar to the one issued by the SBC. It is an effort not to offend anyone, and the fantasy that it will all go away. It would be refreshing for one of these churchocrats to have the gonads to tell it like it is.
10 posted on 06/12/2013 9:33:13 PM PDT by Nemoque
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To: Rashputin
Is this a sufficient reaction from the Southern Baptist Convention or should they have recommended that every SBC church completely sever ties with the Boy Scouts? I'm especially interested in what people who are members of an SBC church think about this approach.

While I'm not unhappy with what was said, I definitely sympathise with everyone who is unhappy about what wasn't said (i.e. an emphatic and direct recommendation/condemnation). We didn't get more IMO because of the non-hierarchical nature of the SBC itself. The Convention doesn't demand obedience or dictate policy to the member churches, therefore it would be highly improper (to say the least) for it to issue a demand or requirement against the membership.

If you look at the exit polling in the last ten years, the SBC has proven itself to be a reliable voting bloc re conservative issues (not overwhelming, but far better than many Protestant bodies), I think their ecclesial structure has worked pretty well, and has helped them to be on the right side of social issues.

Thanks for posting this thread, Rashputin!

11 posted on 06/12/2013 9:36:19 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
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To: Nemoque

The slippery slope just got a new coat of wax. Now we just wait and see which churches give the BSA a nudge.


12 posted on 06/12/2013 9:39:15 PM PDT by pennyfarmer (Your socialist beat our liberal AGAIN.)
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To: Rashputin

It was an even better resolution.

They asked for the top leadership of the Boy Scouts to resign.

Time to fight back.


13 posted on 06/12/2013 10:27:12 PM PDT by Pikachu_Dad (Impeach Sen Quinn)
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To: Rashputin
I'm SB and I'm definitely disappointed at the response.

It's as though those voting to not sever ties are saying, "deny the sin, embrace the sinner, lest I be called a bigot!"

This tactic, like that of the BSA, will only be labeled bigotry anyway by the homosexual activists. Give them an inch, they demand the whole block!

14 posted on 06/12/2013 10:28:33 PM PDT by zerosix (Native Sunflower)
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To: Rashputin

Read the resolution.

They pretty much urged members to cut ties and move to Royal Rangers.


15 posted on 06/12/2013 10:29:30 PM PDT by Pikachu_Dad (Impeach Sen Quinn)
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To: Rashputin

I am a member of a local SBC and a church goer, but for how much longer I’m not sure. Sunday I noticed the music yeller has a piercing across one eyebrow.
Some teens wear short short shorts to Church. There is no longer dress codes nor ruler nor respect for God, so I am not surprised the Boy Scouts are still okay. They might be using the ladies bathroom, I am not sure.
It is hard to remember when people had respect for things holy.
We even had candles at Sunday Service. Never have seen that before.


16 posted on 06/12/2013 10:31:56 PM PDT by Ramonne
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To: Nemoque
I was a member of a LC-MS church most of my life and we had a large block of German and German heritage folks who would regularly lobby to have the church leave the MS over various issues and join, as I recall, WELS which they claimed was even more conservative.

In my experience there were always a good number of people who felt like withdrawing from any organization that went off the rails would a form of surrender. Even some of the most conservative folks often argued that that we should stay a part of this or that to be a burr under their saddle.

Everything seemed to take about five times as long to resolve as it should have because even a good many conservative people didn't want to seem like they weren't willing to listen to both sides. We usually ended up with something that didn't please anyone but wasn't so distasteful to anyone that they'd leave the congregation over it.

17 posted on 06/12/2013 10:48:43 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Pikachu_Dad

So you think it’s fine.

Urging is sufficient then.


18 posted on 06/12/2013 10:50:13 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin
Why Christ did warn to ‘Remember Lot's wife’. Seems few Christians ever get around to reading that warning. Taking a stronger stand might get religious tax policy stripped. And some are very much in approval of rendering up to Caesar his first.
19 posted on 06/12/2013 10:52:27 PM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: Just mythoughts
IMHO, churches need to be tax exempt but they don't need to be a 501(c) corporation.

The current wave of “tax the churches” for the good of the churches stuff is the same sort of "ground swell" twisted propaganda that got the 17th Amendment passed “for the good of the people” when in reality that Amendment eliminates the Senate as the Constitution created it by installing a new, unconstitutional, “Senator” who represents national interests rather than the voters who the Senator.

There seems to be a lot of the old turn of the century progressive agenda being repackaged and spread around in ways that make it sound conservative unless you think through what the consequences will really be once the changes are in effect.

JMHO

20 posted on 06/12/2013 11:09:28 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin

They do not have the authority to mandate.

They set a clear path.

First, call for the removal of the perverts at the top. Ie. fight back

Second, wrap up your dealings witg the scouts and move to anotherprogram.

It find the resolution clear and firm.


21 posted on 06/12/2013 11:14:50 PM PDT by Pikachu_Dad (Impeach Sen Quinn)
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To: Pikachu_Dad
I know they don't have that authority and I see what you're saying. I do, however, recall things from the SBC that were worded something like, "strongly recommends" and even if I remember correctly, "expects member churches" although that was years ago.

That's what I was thinking about which is exactly why I asked SBC folks how they see this.

22 posted on 06/12/2013 11:26:25 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin
IMHO, churches need to be tax exempt but they don't need to be a 501(c) corporation. The current wave of “tax the churches” for the good of the churches stuff is the same sort of "ground swell" twisted propaganda that got the 17th Amendment passed “for the good of the people” when in reality that Amendment eliminates the Senate as the Constitution created it by installing a new, unconstitutional, “Senator” who represents national interests rather than the voters who the Senator. There seems to be a lot of the old turn of the century progressive agenda being repackaged and spread around in ways that make it sound conservative unless you think through what the consequences will really be once the changes are in effect. JMHO

My post was not a call to tax churches. Christians are instructed to follow the civil law, unless or until said law requires the Christian to disobey the Creator. Civil authorities have pushed their way to the point that to keep 'tax exempt' status allowance and inclusion of perversion is nearly required by civil law.

It is one thing to have perversion all around, but it is quite another to invite perversion into God's House, by any church claiming to be Christian. We are forewarned what would be again even to the point of Christ warning us to 'Remember Lot's wife.' She was not a participant in the perversion, but she sure was not bothered by the activity. Her acceptance did not end well for her.

23 posted on 06/12/2013 11:33:47 PM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: Just mythoughts
Gotcha. My mistake.

True, staying with the Boy Scouts or the Girl Scouts for that matter, is implicit acceptance of premeditated perversion and whether adults can split the hair or not, kids are going to see it as total acceptance of perversion.

After all, when will there be a lecture about perversion being a sin that's an affront to God when perverts are accepted members of the gang?

24 posted on 06/12/2013 11:46:55 PM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Rashputin
After all, when will there be a lecture about perversion being a sin that's an affront to God when perverts are accepted members of the gang?

For the time being I am expecting very few. I am reminded of Amos 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD:

Based upon what is happening today it sure appears the famine is well underway.

25 posted on 06/13/2013 12:14:39 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: narses

Im sorry,I thought we were discussing Boy Scouts and why churchs should or shouldnt support them.Why did you feel the need to praise Mary?


26 posted on 06/13/2013 2:54:17 AM PDT by Craftmore
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To: Rashputin

They’re a convention not a rigid hierarchy. They called for the entire leadership of the BSA to resign, not exactly weak tea there. They strongly encouraged any of their membership who didn’t separate themselves to work from within to change this.


27 posted on 06/13/2013 3:08:40 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry
I understand how they're organized. I emailed the same thing and the same question to a friend who is Southern Baptist and he said he hadn't seen this particular item but had seen a stronger one with what you mention in it.

I expected the SBC to tell everyone to leave the BSA and stop supporting them that's why I was asking how people understood this message.

28 posted on 06/13/2013 3:47:22 AM PDT by Rashputin (Jesus Christ doesn't evacuate His troops, He leads them to victory.)
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To: Nemoque
10 ... I am a member of the LC-MS, which is a conservative Lutheran denomination. It is struggling with this matter, and I fear that it, too, will come out with a lame statement similar to the one issued by the SBC. ...

In 2000, the Commission on United Methodist Men filed an amicus brief that argued that the Boy Scouts, as a nonprofit, should have the right to set its own course without interference from the government. (An amicus brief or "Friend of the Court Brief" is typically filed by those who are not a party in the case but to offer the court information which may have bearing. SCOTUS Rule 37 states that it must contain relevant material which may be of considerable help to the court.) Joining the brief were the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod.

3/27/2013 – The Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod President, Rev. Dr. Matthew C. Harrison, sent a letter to the BSA explaining the seriousness of the potential membership policy change and described the “crisis of conscience” that may force congregations to reconsider their support of the organization. Excerpt below …

“… (A) “challenge for our churches in allowing the decision to remain local rather than national lays in the fact that some communities have larger and more politically active gay and lesbian groups. In these communities, the local Boy Scout Council may impose the acceptance of homosexual scouts and scout leaders upon troops sponsored by the local congregation. Should this occur, the Boy Scouts effectively will have superseded the authority of our church teaching, of the local pastor and of the congregation — perhaps even placing us in legal jeopardy.” In the letter, Harrison also pointed out that this policy change could mean that “scouts from troops sponsored by congregations of The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod potentially would be interacting with openly homosexual scouts and scout leaders at regional and national scouting activities….”

“The Boy Scouts have been open to our feedback, but we continue to watch the process closely,” said the Rev. Mark Kiessling, associate director of LCMS Youth Ministry, who serves as the LCMS representative to the BSA Religious Relationship Task Force.

5/17/2013 – The President of the Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod released a statement regarding the upcoming vote on the membership standards resolution to permit open homosexual youth to be members of BSA.

From Pastor Matthew C. Harrison
President, The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod

Western culture is at a crucial moment in history. After 103 years of existence, the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) may vote to change drastically its membership policy. For those who may be unaware, the BSA, in recent months, has discussed allowing both gay Scouts and Scout leaders into its organization. Recently, however, the BSA has changed its course. Now the vote will determine only whether to include openly homosexual Scouts as members.

LCMS leaders have been carefully monitoring the proposed BSA policy changes. When news of the proposed change was made public, I sent a letter to BSA, imploring its leadership not to make the proposed policy change. And even though the initial proposal to focus on Scout leaders has been shelved, I believe the current proposal still has unknown implications for the future of BSA as well as LCMS support and involvement. The proposed change will highlight sexuality, which has not been and should not be a matter of focus for Scouts. I suspect it will make it more challenging to care for young people struggling with same-sex attraction and perhaps open our churches to legal action.

This vote matters to the LCMS. The proposed change in BSA policy on values and membership to include openly homosexual Scouts adversely affects, even supersedes, the authority of the local pastor and congregation by allowing and promoting a moral position that we as LCMS Lutherans believe is against the will of God and in opposition to Holy Scripture.

This vote matters because, if enacted, the proposed change to BSA policy on values and membership will cause a crisis of conscience for our church leaders, pastors, parents and congregations. Even if the decision of values and membership remains at the local level, Scouts from troops sponsored by congregations of the LCMS will be affected because, as part of the scouting program, they also participate at regional and national scouting activities.

This vote matters because, for more than a century, scouting has sought to uphold moral values at a level greater than that of general society. The capitulation now to societal pressures would mar the long and honorable history of the Boy Scouts to honor the natural law of God, which at least for now, is still reflected in the current scouting membership policy.

For these reasons, I and some 25 other Protestant church leaders have signed onto a statement, copied below, that implores BSA not to change its policy, noting that, “In our current culture, it’s more important than ever for our churches to protect and provide moral nurture for young people and for the Scouts.” The statement will be released in conjunction with its delivery to the BSA office and before the organization’s vote, which will take place May 24.

I share this with you today because it is difficult to know which of our LCMS BSA members will be part of the 1,400 members who will vote on the policy change later this month. I am hopeful that all of you will share this information with those in your congregation who are involved with BSA and even those in your community who will cast votes later this month.

As the church awaits the BSA vote, we still have much to do. We repent, and we pray. We confess Christ and elevate marriage among us. We do what the church does best: We bear witness to Christ, show mercy to those in our midst — including those challenged by same-sex attraction — and care for all in our life together.”

Pastor Matthew C. Harrison
President, The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod

Prior to the vote Vicki Biggs, director of LCMS (Lutheran Church – Missouri Synod) Integrated Communications, said in an email, "We desire to maintain a relationship with BSA, but cannot compromise integrity to our religious beliefs. We will make a determination about our support and relationship with the organization after we've had time to review whatever final determination BSA arrives at regarding a change in its policies."

29 posted on 06/13/2013 9:01:37 AM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: Pikachu_Dad
13 It was an even better resolution. They asked for the top leadership of the Boy Scouts to resign. Time to fight back.

A motion was put on the floor at the 5/23/2013 annual (BSA) National Council business meeting to fire the chief scout executive and remove the president and national commissioner. It went no where.

If by "fight back" you mean move your male youth to another organization or join in the formation of a new Scouting organization apart from BSA, then I support your view. If you mean "fight the good fight" from within the BSA, then you are tilting at windmills. Cultural Marxism has taken firm root within the corporate members of the 1,400 member National Council. BSA, which has been on a negative growth slope for 40 years. BSA will continue to decline in membership, perhaps at an accelerated rate now due to the new membership standard.

30 posted on 06/13/2013 9:40:04 AM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: Pikachu_Dad
15 Read the resolution. They pretty much urged members to cut ties and move to Royal Rangers.

An easy mistake to make. The SBC male youth organization is the Royal Ambassadors (RAs). RR is the male youth organization of the Assembly of God.

31 posted on 06/13/2013 9:44:04 AM PDT by MacNaughton
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To: MacNaughton

Thanks.


32 posted on 06/13/2013 9:44:58 PM PDT by Pikachu_Dad (Impeach Sen Quinn)
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To: Rashputin
I grew up in a Southern Baptist Church. Besides all the current issues, I've witnessed the SBC growing weak in other areas over decades. They have remained steadfast in doctrine, while compromising in practice. The latest discussion to change their title is just one instance of trying to "market" themselves to the world. Churches under this affiliation are already doing this, removing "baptist" from their names to seem more palatable. I also believe that their election of the first black convention president, although qualified, was also motivated by the "me too" marketing attitude.

While they've disfellowshipped a few churches for compromising on homosexuality (University Baptist, Austin, TX and Broadway Baptist, Fort Worth, TX) I don't see this happening as much in the future. Meeting with rabid, unrepentant homosexual activists at last year's convention was a horrible mistake, and marks a softening in their stance on the issue.

33 posted on 06/20/2013 12:56:20 PM PDT by fwdude ( You cannot compromise with that which you must defeat.)
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