Posted on 06/20/2010 5:14:46 PM PDT by Ken4TA
If you would eliminate all the prophecy that has already been fulfilled, you would eliminate about 90% of today’s prophetic preaching and writing!
A classic example of modern prophets predicting something which has already come to pass is the one concerning the “abomination of desolation,” an expression used by Jesus in Matthew 24. Perhaps you have heard this futuristic interpretation given by a pre-millennial preacher: “The Jews (having restored Herod’s Temple) will have a visit by the False Prophet who shall bring an image of the Anti-Christ into Jerusalem and set it in the temple…that will be the sign Jesus mentioned in Mt. 24, the Abomination of Desolation.” Or this: “This image will be placed in the Jewish temple in Jerusalem, and is the “abomination of desolation…” (DeHaan).
These same futurist preachers, who make up the majority of radio and TV preachers, and fill most of the religious magazines with their interpretations, succeed in keeping millions from a settled faith in Christ and an understanding of His words.
The setting for the prophecy is the Temple in Jerusalem, so rich and grand that the disciples openly admired its magnificence. Jesus said, “Varily I say unto you, there shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down” (Mt. 24:2).
This was a shocking statement, considering the huge size of the temple stones. The disciples requested, “Tell us, when shall these things be? And what shall be the sign of thy coming, and the end of the world?” (Mt. 24:3). First, Jesus pointed out that there would be false messiahs, earthquakes, wars, etc., and that in the face of these the saints were to endure and the gospel was to be preached. Then, He answered the question concerning the destruction of the temple which then stood. For a right interpretation, we need to read the account as given in Matthew, Mark and Luke.
Matthew: “When therefore you see the abomination of desolation, which spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let him that reads understand) then let them that are in Judea flee unto the mountains” (Mt. 24:15–16).
Mark: “But when you see the abomination of desolation standing where he ought not (let him that reads understand), then let them that are in Judea flee unto the mountains” (Mark 13:14).
Luke: “But when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand. Then let them that are in Judea flee unto the mountains…and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles” (Luke 21:20–21, 24).
While Matthew and Mark quote directly from Daniel, using Daniel’s expression, “abomination of desolation,” Dr. Luke plainly reveals that what they would see would be armies surrounding the city, about to bring about her desolation.
Reference to Daniel has to do with his “70 weeks” prediction, at the end of which he writes “and upon the wing of abomination shall come one that makes desolate; and even unto the full end, and that determined, shall wrath be poured out upon the desolate” (Dan. 9:27). The question of the disciples concerned the destruction of the temple, while the prophecy of Daniel predicted the complete desolation of both temple and city. According to Luke’s account the desolation was to be accomplished by armies.
To the residents of Jerusalem nothing was more “abominable” than the idolatrous Romans. As they looked out over the walls of the city and saw Roman legions advancing for the purpose of destroying them, they would easily understood the term “abomination of desolation” and realize that it was upon them.
The “abomination of desolation” was to be seen standing in the “holy place,” or “where he ought not.” Many have taken this to mean an object standing in the Holy of holies in the temple. But there are four things that disallow that interpretation. (1) Only the High Priests were allowed in the Holy of Holies, therefore the people would never see this object in order to be warned to flee. (2) The enemy would never be allowed to place an “abominable” object in the temple unless the city were already in enemy hands. By that time, it would be too late for the Christians to flee; therefore, this could be no sign to them to flee to the mountains. (3) Luke plainly says that what they are to see is “Jerusalem compassed with armies….” (4) The prophecy has to do with the destruction of the temple, not something placed inside it.
As for the “Holy Place,” this term was used not only for the temple, but for the surrounding court and for the entire city, which they often called the “Holy City.”
The prophecy is not nearly so cryptic as modern interpreters would have us believe. Jesus simply told the disciples that the great temple would be destroyed, along with the entire city. However, it was not to take place right away. These same disciples were told to remain in Jerusalem until they received power (the holy Spirit) and that they were to preach the gospel in Jerusalem first. Therefore they were told that there would be wars, rumors of war, famine and other great catastrophes, false Christs and persecution. When the destruction was imminent, they would know it in time to flee, and the clear sign would be the siege of Jerusalem by foreign armies. This was a sign that no one could mistake.
In 65 AD Florus was appointed Caesar’s procurator over Judea. Determined to put down the Jewish resistance to Rome and do away with radical rebels, he imposed such strong measures that thousands of Jews arose in violent rebellion. History records a period when all of Judea and Galilee were filled with violence. Roman armies would attack a village to smoke out the rebels; in retaliation, guerilla bands would attack Gentiles, slaughtering whole communities; the response would be an even greater blow by the Romans against Jews, followed by a massacre led by Jewish rebels.
When Florus couldn’t quell the rebels Cestius Gailus took over, and marched the Roman armies into Palestine, destroyed resistance in all the towns on his way toward Jerusalem, and laid siege to that city.
Here was the sign, the “abomination of desolation” standing in the place holy to all Israelites. But how could they flee? The city was under siege, and the armies of Cestius were easily winning the battle. Then for some unexplained reason, as the historian Josephus says, “without any reason in the world,” he withdrew all the troops. The Jews thought that God had given them the victory, and pursued the Roman army and inflicted heavy casualties. Soon a new General, Titus, would take command and return with greater forces, but in the meantime there was an interval during which all the Christians, following Christ’s warning, fled. According to Thomas Newton: “We learn from ecclesiastical histories, that at this juncture all who believed in Christ departed Jerusalem, and removed to Pella and other places beyond the river Jordan; so that they all marvelously escaped the general shipwreck of their countrymen; and we do not read anywhere that so much as one of them perished in the destruction of Jerusalem” (Disertations on the Prophecies, pg., 389, See “great Prophecies of the Bible,” Ralph Woodrow and “The Olivet Discourse” by Dallas Meserve).
After the Christians had fled, Titus besieged the city, and the woes that befell Jerusalem were what Jesus called “great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be” (Mt. 24:21). Josephus, a Jewish historian, was an eye-witness to the events and describes them in “Wars of the Jews,” published about 75 AD. He wrote of cities filled with the dead, houses plundered and burned. In one hour over 20,000 were killed in Caesarea, and Galilee was filled with fire and blood!
In Jerusalem the Zealots “fell upon the people (who disagreed with them) as upon a flock of profane animals, and cut their throats.” Over 12,000 prominent people died in this way. As the siege continued food became scarce, so that neighbor preyed upon neighbor to obtain food. When it was known that someone possessed food, he was tortured to make him reveal his source, and then usually killed by his greedy countrymen. Josephus relates horrendous systems of torture they used on each other to extract money, in order to buy food from the powerful ones, who had hopes of being delivered before themselves perishing. “The number of those that perished by famine in the city was prodigious, and their miseries were unspeakable. For it so much as the shadow or any kind of food did anywhere appear, a war was commenced presently, and the dearest friends fell fighting one another about it….” One prominent woman killed her infant son and roasted him. After eating half of the body, the other half was hidden. She was forced to uncover the remaining half of the little body, saying: ‘Come, eat of this food,’ for I have eaten of it myself…’.”
Titus had wanted to preserve the temple. But when he finally entered the city one of the enraged soldiers entered the temple with a torch and set it afire. The heat became so intense that it melted the gold inlay so that it ran down into the crevices of the building stones. Eager to extricate this valuable metal, the Romans pulled down one stone from off another, to fulfill Christ’s prophecy, “There shall not be left here one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down.”
The 70 weeks prophecy of Daniel (Dan. 9:25–27) was completed by the events during the ministry of Christ, His death, and the three and one half years following His resurrection during which time thousands turned from the Old Covenant and received the New Covenant of Christ. As in other times a grace period of 40 years was given before the final destruction and end of the nation. During that time the Jews fulfilled another of Christ’s predictions, that the disciples would endure great persecution from their countrymen and unbelieving members of their families, by which the Jews would “fill up the full measure of God’s wrath for them” (Mt. 23:32, 34–36). Jesus said, “Verily I say unto you, all these things shall come upon this generation” (Mt. 23:36), plainly indicating that the destruction of Jerusalem was the result of their rebellion against Christ and His people. At the end of that 40 years, God’s wrath was poured out upon the nation through Roman armies in 70 AD. It is History.
Although it was Titus and pagan armies that made up the abomination of desolation, they were merely carrying out the divine judgment of God, the sentence of destruction Jesus had pronounced upon the city over 40 years earlier.
As Ralph Woodrow comments, “This interpretation is solidly built on the Bible. With it, the gospel accounts are complementary, not contradictory. It is confirmed by history. It glorifies Christ, for it plainly demonstrates how his words were fulfilled and his warnings heeded — thus providing a great deliverance and blessing for the Christian people of that time!”
To place fulfilled prophecy yet into the future is to deny the word of Christ. To show His prophecies fulfilled establishes His words, exalts Him and gives great assurance to the believer.
1. The Promise to Abraham
2. The Millennial Syndrome
3. Daniel’s Prophecy
4. What About The Rapture?
5. The Abomination of Desolation
Then there are those troublesome passages like Isaiah 66, Zechariah 14, Ezekiel 36-38... man-o-man, why can’t we just have a nice neat package of supercessionism and get on with our lives as the “new Israel” - why does the Bible always mess up our nice little praeterist theology?
Ping for study
And just where is that affront to G_d built?
How many buildings have been built on that location now? Which one is this?
Why are you trying to change what Scripture plainly says?
Here are quotes from two different Bibles (first one is NIV):
“When you see ‘the abomination that causes desolation’ standing where it does not belong—let the reader understand—then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.
“The day is coming when you will see the sacrilegious object that causes desecration standing where he should not be.” (Reader, pay attention!) “Then those in Judea must flee to the hills.
How on earth you can interpret this as the general destruction is beyond me. I agree with the other poster. I don’t mind discussing our differences but when Scripture is very plain and people try to make it say something to fit in with their own belief, I guess I want to know why. I have no dog in the race. I believe in Jesus and that he died for me. Whether the fulfillment of certain prophecies happens in my lifetime or not does not change my status.
Therefore, I just want clarity on this for when I share the Gospel. Don’t want to argue here but I do think you are terribly mistaken.
Very good, and true to an extent. But what has that to do with the thread topic? There is nothing in it that would indicate that all prophecy is fulfilled - there is the book of Revelation to consider, I would think.
As for your other comment, well, I would disagree - and have already posted some thread (and will be posting more) that contradict what you said in your comment.
You tell me....
That is your perogative. Please read all the references in the 3 synoptic Gospels to understand what the phrase "abomination of desolation" means. I think it is very clear.
And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering ...
As I said before, the death of Christ did not literally end the sacrifice and grain offerings ... these literally ceased when the temple was destroyed 40 years later.
You can't really continue to seriously argue for the past fulfillment of Daniels 70 weeks until you address this issue.
How in the world do you get MAKE out of CONFIRM? The term "make" is not of part of that sentence in Daniel's prophecy. Jesus CONFIRMED the COVENANT that the Jews were under! And the apostles continued to CONFIRM that COVENANT for the next 3 1/2 years, "signs and wonder following them."
As I said before, the death of Christ did not literally end the sacrifice and grain offerings ... these literally ceased when the temple was destroyed 40 years later.
Literally, forgetting Christ's sacrifice, the ritual of the Jews sacrificing animals etcetera went on up to 70 AD, just as you say. However, in God's plan those sacrifices ceased with Jesus' sacrifice on the Cross - ALL sacrifices in the eyes of God were fulfilled with Jesus' sacrifice. What the Jews sacrificed after the sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross doesn't mean beans - the NT is explicit on that!
You can't really continue to seriously argue for the past fulfillment of Daniels 70 weeks until you address this issue.
Issue addressed and I will seriously stand by what Curtis wrote in this article of his, for it is the same as I have concluded from my independent study of the issue over the last 40 years.
Luke: “But when you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that her desolation is at hand. Then let them that are in Judea flee unto the mountains…and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles” (Luke 21:20–21, 24).
These are two separate occasions. Luke's account took place at the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD -- followed then by the Diaspora and times of the Gentiles just as Luke recorded that it would.
Matthew's account is yet future, occurring after the times of the Gentiles and the Diaspora.
The Josephus stuff was interesting though.
3rd times the charm
Hmmm...I disagree with that type of thinking for it's too unbelievable to think that Jesus' words meant two different time periods. Matthew wrote to the Jews, and Luke wrote to the Gentiles who weren't all that acquainted with the prophecies of the OT. In 70 AD there were many gentile Christians intermingled in the population of Jerusalem, and Lukes plain words gave them the warning of the prophecy. Notice that Luke didn't have to give a warning about the Sabbath day - Gentiles ignored particular days.
The abomination is the Obamanation
“Preterism doesn’t hold W.A.T.E.R.”
A short while ago, I realized that many people I know are holding to the ideas of preterism.
I wanted to re-read the gospel accounts of the Olivet discourse, since a frequent preterist poster on Freerepublic.com uses a verse to support his claims: “because these are the days of vengeance, so that all things which are written will be fulfilled” Luke 21:22.
I noticed that for preterism to be true, the following five events must have been fulfilled by now. Since they are NOT fulfilled, I find it difficult, if not impossible, to accept preterism.
I propose an acrostic to illustrate these events: W.A.T.E.R.
W = “worldwide total evangelism”, from Matt 24:14
A = “all tribes mourning the Son of Man”, from Matt 24:30
T = “times of the Gentiles fulfilled”, Luke 21:24
E = “elect gathered from the four winds”, Matt 24:31
R = “return of Jesus” - (how could this possibly have happened in 70 AD, as some preterists claim???) - from Matt 24:27.
This post is a brief introduction to this acrostic, as a reminder that “Preterism doesn’t hold W.A.T.E.R.”.
Too bad the author forgets to consider the meaning of temple.
I'm sure Curtis didn't forget the building of the temple :-)
In fact, one of the future posts concerns that very topic; it will be posted to a thread right after the next article is posted, which addresses "Armageddon". He actually wrote two articles on the temple; the second one an update to the first one: I have to consider if I want to post both of them, for they duplicate each other to an extent. Look for it in a couple of days. Thanks for your interest.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.