Posted on 02/28/2005 5:27:26 PM PST by TheTruthess
Imagine for a moment a person who believes George Armstrong Custer won the Battle of Little Bighorn. Somehow this person has come to believe all kinds of wrong information about Custer. He says Custer fought for the Confederacy, had red hair, and defeated Crazy Horse at Little Bighorn. Despite all these factual gaps he then announces “I believe in Custer.” What do we make of this?
It would be true that this individual shares some things in common with those who believe in the real George Custer. However, this person does not believe in the real Custer. If he were to talk with a historian his announcement of “I believe in Custer too” would be absurd, if not almost offensive.
It has become quite common since 9-11 for Muslims to stress points of similarity and contact between Islam and Christianity. Many Muslims want to confuse Allah with the God of the Bible, Jehovah. Muslims want to say they believe in the Bible, just like Christians. We’ll leave those points for future consideration, choosing here instead to discuss what it means when a Muslim says “We believe in Jesus too.” Do Muslims really believe in the Christ of the Bible?
In an article in the Dallas Morning News titled “Among Muslims Jesus is a Prophet with Honor” Musammil H. Siddiqi wants to say “Yes.” He is clear that Muslims do not do not believe all the same things about Jesus but he still wants Christians to know that Muslims believe in Jesus. Is this true?
Absolutely not. The person Muslims respect and honor is the Quran’s Jesus, a Jesus that is only a shadow of the Christ of the New Testament. In the Quran Jesus does miracles and is a prophet. However, and significantly, He is not deity, He is not God’s Son, and He does not die for the sins of the world. The Quran teaches Jesus was not even actually crucified.
With these disparities how then can Muslims say they believe in Jesus? To say such is to terribly misunderstand what Christians believe Jesus taught and whom Christians believe Jesus is. Siddiqi’s article even goes so far as to say that Jesus’ message “was basically the same as the message of other prophets” Again, this is simply wrong. Jesus’ message was that He was the divine Son of God, and that if people did not accept Him as such they would be lost (John 8:24). Jesus was not content to be labeled just another prophet but demanded recognition as deity (Matthew 16:13ff), and even accepted worship (see Luke 24:52; John 9:38). Jesus saw His death as an atoning sacrifice for the sins of all humanity (Matthew 26:28) and predicted His resurrection from the dead as the ultimate sign that He is God’s Son (John 2:18-21; Matt. 12:39-40; Luke 11:32). This is the Jesus of the New Testament and this is the Jesus of Christianity. He is so different from Islam’s Jesus that about all the two figures have in common is the name “Jesus.” Muslims simply do not believe in Jesus the Christ.
There are two sad ramifications of Muslim’s attempt to pretend they believes in the same Jesus as Christians do. First, it results in a complete misunderstanding of Islamic-Christian relations. Siddiqi’s article says “As we both love Jesus, let us love and care for one another.” Siddiqi, like many today, seem to think that Muslims and Christians can only treat each other with decency and respect if we see how similar our beliefs are. Yet the truth is there is an unbridgeable chasm between Christianity and Islam, a gulf that centers on the identity of Jesus. It is crucial, however, to realize that such does not mean Christians cannot treat Muslims kindly. The basis of Christian ethics is not “Your beliefs are kind of like mine so I’ll be nice to you.” The basis of Christianity is the commands of the Christ to love even our enemies (Matt. 5:44), and to treat all men as we wish to be treated (Matthew 7:12). Thus, even if I encounter someone with a belief system radically different from mine, one that I find even offensive and blasphemous, I must treat that person with dignity and respect because the Son of God commands me to do so. If we teach people that we only have to be nice to those who believe like we do then we are all headed for trouble when Christians and Muslims (correctly) realize their respective faiths are not anything alike!
The other terrible result of this “mash all religions together into one pot” kind of thinking is that it quashes discussions of faith and differences in faith. Several years ago I met a Muslim teacher in a formal debate on the subject of Jesus’ deity. I was thankful that he did not buy into this “let’s all pretend that we mostly agree on Jesus” line. Instead, he boldly, kindly and forcefully advanced the evidences for Islam’s conclusions about Jesus. I did the same in the name of Christianity and the New Testament. The evening was not caustic or abusive, but thought-provoking and challenging. The many Muslims I talked with afterward thanked me for having the courage of my convictions, asked me good questions and talked of how they would have to think further about what I had taught. It was a delightful experience that showed people can disagree without being disagreeable. Instead of pretending we agreed about Jesus we focused on the differences and presented our cases, leaving the audience to consider and think further about what is surely a crucial issue: who is Jesus? Pretending Muslims believe in Jesus may be politically correct and it certainly pays homage to the god of toleration, but it destroys the imperative for real religious discussion. Instead of watering down our convictions let us have the courage to kindly and in an appropriate way and time speak of what we really believe. True faith demands no less.
George Armstrong Custer lost the Battle of the Little Bighorn. To pretend otherwise is foolish. Likewise, I could say that I believe in Mohammed, for I do believe he is a historical person. Yet my statement about Mohammed is not anything akin to what Muslims mean when they say they believe in Mohammed, is it? Similarly Muslims can say they believe in Jesus, but they do not believe in the Christ of the New Testament. There’s no cross for Islam’s Jesus. Simply put, that means Muslims do not believe in Jesus Christ.
1. They say that Jesus was a prophet sent from God.
2. Prophets sent from God speak the Word of God, and speak it Truthfully.
3. Jesus said He was God (IS God).
So...either Jesus is not a prophet (invalidating their religion), or He was a prophet, AND Messiah, AND God in the Flesh, which also invalidates their religion.
Hmmm.
However disconcerting this statement may be to those who foster the notion of irenicism at all costs, it cannot be refuted. No amount of wishful thinking, ecumania or “Assisi-ing” will make it so.
To Islam, the Koran is, literally, the word of their god; not a discussion document, non-interpretative and certainly not up for negotiation. For a Christian, to indulge in self-delusion to the contrary is madness. The sole possibility for rapprochment between Christianity and Islam is for the latter to renounce the Koran, the Hadith and the Sira.
If there really is only one God, how can a false God exist?
The Muslim(s) would probably say that the New Testament accounts of Jesus are not accurate, having been corrupted over the years.
If that one God has given you free will, then you are able with it to create in your mind all the gods you wish and give them any history or character as you wish.
Just because thinks something, doesn't make it true, that would just be a figment of their imagination, wouldn't it? How can there be a false God? I don't believe there can be.
Unless the definition of "false god" = the figment of someone's (or some group's) imagination
Thor, for example.
Several possibilities exist:
1) A person could worship nothing at all.
2) A person could worship God, the creator of all that is, and have a correct understanding of His nature.
3) A person could worship God, the creator of all that is, and be (grossly) mistaken about one or more aspects of His nature. I would consider this worshipping God falsely, rather than worshipping a false god.
4) A person could worship some entity or entities which are not God, but are posing (falsely) as god(s). This would constitute worship of a false god.
5) A person could worship a total figment of his own or someone else's imagination, which has no referent in reality. This, also, would constitute worship of a false god.
Note that in 4) above, the false god actually exists; in case 5) above it does not. The term "false god" refers to some thing, entity, or idea which men may put in the place of God, but which is not God.
That's just our definition, that wouldn't make Thor God. I still don't understand the concept of a false god, it seems there can only be one God. It that what is meant in the 10 Commandments...no figments of your imaginations?
Excellent breakdown, AB. Thanks.
Before me could me "considered to be of higher status/stature than me." Or it could mean "in my presence."
I would subscribe to the second, but either will suffice.
Now, that was an era where other peoples and the Israelites had a plethora (whole pantheons) of gods. As arrogant bustard points out, these could be (1) entities treated as gods which really weren't, or (2) imaginary figments.
If someone prays to God, and someone else prays to Thor, (thinking he is God), what does God hear, what is His reaction?
Since God knows everything, he hears someone talking to a figment.
Very well put.
So God must hear the prayers of all, regardless of what religion they are....
God knows everything.
That doesn't mean He approves of everything.
There is a very simple rejoinder to Mr. Siddiqi, which is an extension of the last paragraph of the piece:
I believe in Mohammed as a historical figure, but I don't believe he was a prophet. In fact I believe that he was a madman and a child molester who rose to power through corruption, dishonor and murder.
In fact, it IS possible he was a prophet, but not a prophet of God. There is another power who has sent prophets into this world and will do so again, in an attempt to decieve and destroy men's souls. I reject him and all his works.
Admin Moderator: if you consider this post out of bounds, please remove it - however, I know for a fact (having been married to a Baha'i for 28 years) that this is a mirror of how Muslims preach their revisionist Jesus
Only according to the New Testament, which the Muslims say was deliberately distorted.
They also say that Jesus survived the crucifixion and ended up in Arabia.
Not the same Jesus at all.
No, but it seems that it would be safe to say that when a non-Christian prays to God, and what they pray for comes to fruition, then they can feel that God has answered their prayers.
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