btw, nice replies y'all ...
Posted on 02/19/2003 4:20:58 AM PST by Michael B
Edited on 02/19/2003 6:30:17 AM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
To: GeneDFor contexttime for ethnic cleansing. lock em up, all of em, or kill em. this is the only certain way to be secure.
13 posted on 5/18/02 10:52 AM Pacific by galt-jw
If I can hit the side of a battleship with a bb is up to the readers to decide. Thanks, AM
btw, nice replies y'all ...
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Is this the Astronomy Picture of the Day thread? |
Disagree. Destabilizing areas that support terrorists makes it more difficult for terror cells to operate. Keep in mind cells in the US draw upon support activities from areas in the Mideast.
The Iraqis, arabs and muslims around the world will see such a war not only as a war on Islam, but also for what it mostly is about - an imperialistic grab for oil. Anyone still doubting that oil is a motive behind the war need only consider the Bush Administration's deep ties with the oil industry...
If this is about oil, why has the Administration done nothing to end the general strike in Venezuela? That would have a more significant and immediate impact on oil prices than war with Iraq. What's more, the President's "oil buddies" would likely benefit more by drilling right here in America versus in Iraq. Your argument makes no sense.
There are no proven links between Saddam and the Al-Qaeda.
This is also somewhat problematic for me. However, reasonable inferences can be made about the WMD Saddam has pursued, and his willingness to supply terrorists with these weapons.
Before the UN sanctions Saddam had created a country with the one of the highest standards of living in the Middle East. At least for his own people he had thus done a better job than most other Middle Eastern leaders, and now we're supposed to be saving his people from him? Worth also noting is that the reason an estimated 5000-6000 children die due to starvation and lack of water and medication in Iraq every week is not Saddam or even the UN sanctions, but the fact that the US and UK have blocked the efforts of the oil-for-food program.
The more accurate reason is because Saddam has directed available funds away from building infrastructure to help Iraq's citizens, and toward building a military. Saddam himself to is blame for the deplorable conditions in his country.
The threat that Iraq poses to us is tiny. Iraq probably still has some 'weapons of mass destruction' of course, but an insignificant amount which pales in comparison to that of many other countries (including of course the US and Britain, but also less stable places such as Syria and the nuclear states of North Korea, Pakistan, India and Israel).
The difference is Saddam's willingness to use his WMD on civilians, even if it means delivering them through terrorist attacks.
And that's a beautiful thing......
Terror is not new.
When the consequences of using terror exceed the hoped for gains, the terror will stop.
When you look at what terrorists hoped to gain by summarily executing 3000 civilians working in our financial center, you have to conclude that THEY BELIEVED THEY COULD TAKE OUR ECONOMY DOWN, and thereby our country. The zeal of the suicide pilots would not have been possible without this belief. It has now become painfully obvious to potential suicide bombers that no such outcome is possible.
The rout in Afghanistan was the first in a series of psychological blows which will eliminate terror as a weapon to be used against the US. Remember, our enemy is terror, and the potential perpetrators reside in the entire Middle East, not just within al-Qaeda. When Iraq falls, the US will no longer need to beg (and pay billions) for a base in Saudi Arabia, as we will have one in Iraq.
When Iraq falls, ten percent of the world's oil will be under the control of the Great Satan, dealing a death blow to OPEC. No small consequence for the region's leaders who stood back and watched the celebrations in "the arab street" and did nothing. With the death of OPEC, the engine of the US economy becomes fuel injected, a deserved touche to the choice of targets on the part of our enemy.
The Arab world will wake up to a new dawn, as the presence of their new neighbor will bring humiliation and the knowledge that they have only the terror masters to blame.
Meanwhile Saddam has built himself 19 palaces? Meanwhile Saddam is buying high quality aluminum tubing for his weapons program?
Sorry, not buying the "it's not Saddam's fault children are starving" bit. He has taken hold of Iraqi wealth and is using for himself, like all good despots do.
Oh, BTW, here is how Saddam treats "his people"...
SADDAM HUSSEIN’S REPRESSION OF THE IRAQI PEOPLE
UNSCR 688 “condemns” Saddam Hussein’s repression of the Iraqi civilian population -- “the consequences of which threaten international peace and security.” UNSCR 688 also requires Saddam Hussein to end his repression of the Iraqi people and to allow immediate access to international humanitarian organizations to help those in need of assistance.
Saddam Hussein has repeatedly violated these provisions and has: expanded his violence against women and children; continued his horrific torture and execution of innocent Iraqis; continued to violate the basic human rights of the Iraqi people and has continued to control all sources of information (including killing more than 500 journalists and other opinion leaders in the past decade).
Saddam Hussein has also harassed humanitarian aid workers; expanded his crimes against Muslims; he has withheld food from families that fail to offer their children to his regime; and he has continued to subject Iraqis to unfair imprisonment.10
REFUSAL TO ADMIT HUMAN RIGHTS MONITORS
§ The UN Commission on Human Rights and the UN General Assembly issued a report that noted "with dismay" the lack of improvement in the situation of human rights in Iraq. The report strongly criticized the "systematic, widespread, and extremely grave violations of human rights" and of international humanitarian law by the Iraqi Government, which it stated resulted in "all-pervasive repression and oppression sustained by broad-based discrimination and widespread terror." The report called on the Iraqi Government to fulfill its obligations under international human rights treaties. § Saddam Hussein has repeatedly refused visits by human rights monitors and the establishment of independent human rights organizations.
From 1992 until 2002, Saddam prevented the UN Special Rapporteur from visiting Iraq.11 § In September 2001 the Government expelled six UN humanitarian relief workers without providing any explanation.12
VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN
§ Human rights organizations and opposition groups continued to receive reports of women who suffered from severe psychological trauma after being raped by Iraqi personnel while in custody.13 § Former Mukhabarat member Khalid Al-Janabi reported that a Mukhabarat unit, the Technical Operations Directorate, used rape and sexual assault in a systematic and institutionalized manner for political purposes. The unit reportedly also videotaped the rape of female relatives of suspected oppositionists and used the videotapes for blackmail purposes and to ensure their future cooperation.§ In June 2000, a former Iraqi general reportedly received a videotape of security forces raping a female family member. He subsequently received a telephone call from an intelligence agent who stated that another female relative was being held and warned him to stop speaking out against the Iraqi Government.15
§ Iraqi security forces allegedly raped women who were captured during the Anfal Campaign and during the occupation of Kuwait. 16
§ Amnesty International reported that, in October 2000, the Iraqi Government executed dozens of women accused of prostitution.17
§ In May, the Iraqi Government reportedly tortured to death the mother of three Iraqi defectors for her children’s opposition activities.18
§ Iraqi security agents reportedly decapitated numerous women and men in front of their family members. According to Amnesty International, the victims’ heads were displayed in front of their homes for several days.
19 TORTURE § Iraqi security services routinely and systematically torture detainees. According to former prisoners, torture techniques included branding, electric shocks administered to the genitals and other areas, beating, pulling out of fingernails, burning with hot irons and blowtorches, suspension from rotating ceiling fans, dripping acid on the skin, rape, breaking of limbs, denial of food and water, extended solitary confinement in dark and extremely small compartments, and threats to rape or otherwise harm family members and relatives. Evidence of such torture often was apparent when security forces returned the mutilated bodies of torture victims to their families.20
§ According to a report received by the UN Special Rapporteur in 1998, hundreds of Kurds and other detainees have been held without charge for close to two decades in extremely harsh conditions, and many of them have been used as subjects in Iraq’s illegal experimental chemical and biological weapons programs.21
§ In 2000, the authorities reportedly introduced tongue amputation as a punishment for persons who criticize Saddam Hussein or his family, and on July 17, government authorities reportedly amputated the tongue of a person who allegedly criticized Saddam Hussein. Authorities reportedly performed the amputation in front of a large crowd. Similar tongue amputations also reportedly occurred.22
Brings to mind the adage...
Those that do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
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