Ukrainian riot police charge protesters after nation's bloodiest day, death toll rises to 18

New York Daily News ^ | 02/18/2014

[Ivan Mazepa]

So Ukraine is eating a bowl of ice cream. Russia takes a spoonful, then Soros does it too (size of the spoon would differ between the two, but ok) Soros, being a trouble rouser, then calls attention to Russia taking he spoonful.

Question: has Ukraine been kicked in the head and didn’t see Russia taking it and it needed Soros to shed light on it? Also, can Ukraine ever be allowed to protest against Russia without being called a Soros tool

[Ivan Mazepa]

Option 3 is neither, but having Russia as the neighbour it’s difficult. Empire decease - thinking what others have is yours - is not easily curable and as long as Russia wants to take control of Ukraine, option 3 is not possible.

[cunning_fish]

>>As opposed to that bastion of Conservative Capitalist values, Vlad Putin? You realize that the protesters are pissed because the President of The Ukraine refused a trade deal that would have opened trade with The EU, which Vladdy ordered him to turn down. The people in the Ukraine want western currency and products, not rubles and cabbage<<

You might be right on some points, but what Ukraine has to sell for EU?

[Dead Corpse]

So... Is it fair now for the protestors to shoot at the police?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=843_1392762816

Police are shooting at them. Even if they are just standing there...

[AppyPappy]

Actually, they are shooting at them. Check the videos. Regardless, those stones are deadly as well.

[Ivan Mazepa]

In other new world order revolutions and protests, there are countless unpaid protestors who were emotionally swept up by what they heard from organizers, and they participate on their own.

Then the world you're suggesting doesn't allow for genuine grievances to exist at all.
Murder, corruption, Obamacare - you can't have an independent thought and disapprove these, because you're a puppet being controlled by advanced manipulation techniques. Is that it?

[jersey117]

The hot spots around the world are blowing up from Venezuela to Kiev to Syria and obama’s foreign policy consists of playing golf with a sheik and trying to turn Africa into a rainbow. Give us a break man.

[PapaBear3625]

I suspect they are hoping to avoid even more serious violence. Already a number of police officers have been killed as well as protesters. I doubt the rest of them want to be in a no holds barred firefight with thousands of their fellow countrymen. Particularly those that were or are presently in the army.

The problem with being a policeman in a civil war, is that the rebels will know where you and your family live. The police DO NOT want things to explode into a full-scale civil war.

[Dead Corpse]

Maybe they should stop enforcing tyranny and go home. Less chance of being hit with rocks that way...

[palmer]

Since you are a relatively weak country between two great powers it’s true that you might not have much choice. But I would suggest that the Euro option is not going to be good in the long run. For one thing, the Euros have decided on energy policy that means you will pay more to satisfy some sort of earth worship (although it is fake since Germany gets to use coal). Also Europe will push it’s “universal” human rights to supplant your God-granted rights. They might look like the lesser of two evils now, but when the party is over (fueled by borrowing and spending euros) it will not look good at all.

[cunning_fish]

>>Option 3 is neither, but having Russia as the neighbour it’s difficult. Empire decease - thinking what others have is yours - is not easily curable and as long as Russia wants to take control of Ukraine, option 3 is not possible<<

I’m really happy to see you alive and well, Mazepa and I also have a few questions. Who will be a leader of Ukraine after Yanukovitz? Who will be Ukraine’s major trading partners and an export/import structure? What has to be an economic base for a future government? Has Russia to continue it’s financial aid and keep subsidized gas flowing after it’s ‘puppet’ removed? What is your attitude towards NATO and how do you like EU regulations? Are Ukrainian businesses planning to comply or planning to close? Are they planning to keep trade with Russia after rejecting Russian trade deal and their product heavily taxed on Russian market? Is there finally any plan with the protestors or is it just hope and change with EU?

[PapaBear3625]

You might be right on some points, but what Ukraine has to sell for EU?

For one thing, people willing to take the low-wage jobs in EU that are currently held by Muslim immigrants.

[AppyPappy]

Maybe the protesters should just go home and stop committing violence.

Your logic keeps tying you up.

[Dead Corpse]

Gee... Government goes off it’s chain, imprisons former President on bogus charges, outlaws protesting, and tortures opposition political leaders to death.

When people try to protest anyway, the storm troopers try to beat the tar out of them and kill a bunch.

That’s where all this started.

Perspective, you lack it. Badly.

[PieterCasparzen]

So Ukraine is eating a bowl of ice cream. Russia takes a spoonful, then Soros does it too (size of the spoon would differ between the two, but ok) Soros, being a trouble rouser, then calls attention to Russia taking he spoonful.

Question: has Ukraine been kicked in the head and didn’t see Russia taking it and it needed Soros to shed light on it? Also, can Ukraine ever be allowed to protest against Russia without being called a Soros tool

International financial elites have always financed both the Communist countries and the West.

I'm sure many citizens of Ukraine could always "see" that they were a USSR satellite nation, but as ordinary citizens under a repressive regime, there wasn't much they could do about it.

It's easy to understand if one equates a Mafia example.

Say I'm paying protection money to the Bonanno family. They get real abusive, and really start squeezing me, so that I can't stay in business. I'm suffering, such agony.

A friendly soldier of the Gambino family stops buy; the Gambinos are working the neighborhood, offering to kick out the hated Bonannos. They say their Gambino machine will offer a much better rule over the neighborhood.

Should the neighborhood go with the Gambinos because they enlightened them to how bad the Bonannos were and promised them a better alternative ?

[cunning_fish]

>>>You might be right on some points, but what Ukraine has to sell for EU?
For one thing, people willing to take the low-wage jobs in EU that are currently held by Muslim immigrants.<<<

If you are to look into their community in NYC, it is more into scamming and other organized crime schemes than into low-wage jobs.

But let’s put it aside. What about the Ukraine itself, not people planning to run away from it?

[PieterCasparzen]

In other new world order revolutions and protests, there are countless unpaid protestors who were emotionally swept up by what they heard from organizers, and they participate on their own.

Then the world you're suggesting doesn't allow for genuine grievances to exist at all. Murder, corruption, Obamacare - you can't have an independent thought and disapprove these, because you're a puppet being controlled by advanced manipulation techniques. Is that it?

No, the only option for expressing my grievances is not to join a group where I do not know it's real leaders, purpose, funding, etc.

There are other options.

People can start their own groups. They can make a website, publish papers. They can have meetings and conferences. On their own, with no support from big-money outsiders. It doesn't take a lot of money.

And when the big-money backers come and want to "help", the smart thing is to PUSH THEM OUT. Call the cops, do whatever.

We have the disastrous United Nations educational changes called "Common Core" that the establishment is trying to shove down our throat; this would further destroy the integrity of government schools that many children are subjected to. They are already brainwashing operations and Common Core makes them even worse.

Independent, real, ordinary citizens are responding to this, opposing it vigorously. On their own, without asking a billionaire to help them.

Looking for an outsider to help is to make a deal with the devil, which never works in your favor.

[Ivan Mazepa]

Oh my goodness, that’s a boatload of questions

My hopie changie thing is that after all this violence there’s a transformation of Ukrainian minds, death of Sovok and realization that earlier ways of living cannot work any more. That’s the main requirement before the practical decisions can be made

As for Yanukovych replacement, a goat of an average intelligence is an improvement over this guy.

[little jeremiah]

The EU deal no doubt comes with strings which are diminished freedom. Now there are rumblings among EU countries since so many people are sick of the socialist crap.

So Ukraine is stuck in a hard place.

[cunning_fish]

>As for Yanukovych replacement, a goat of an average intelligence is an improvement over this guy.>My hopie changie thing is that after all this violence there’s a transformation of Ukrainian minds<<
>>before the practical decisions can be made<<

That is exactly what I was thinking about. And it seems like an idea of the majority protestors there.
I wonder will you riot as hard in a year or so, after you’ll have your wage halved or out of your job due to a new regulations and gas prices at EU level?

>>As for Yanukovych replacement, a goat of an average intelligence is an improvement over this guy.<<

It seems like a really cool plan! Good luck with it! Please, don’t blame the Jews after.