Posted on 09/11/2012 10:49:38 AM PDT by LonelyCon
My nephew has talked of wanting to join the Army for years, which is why I was especially personally angry when Obama ended DADT and let gays into the military. I knew my nephew would still want to join even though he'd be prey for all types of attacks and be in danger because men can't trust the others in their own units. He's now a senior and still intent on a military future. He has valid arguments: he wants to serve his country and he wants to follow his grandfather's example. I admire that. But some of us in the family (not his parents) are worried that an organization that normalizes and celebrates homosexuality is not an appropriate or safe place for impressionable young men. I want to warn him, but what should I tell him? (Or should I just keep my nose out of it?) Advice - especially from those actively serving now - about conditions would be welcome.
Get as much training(mechanical) as you can within the 4 years and then GET OUT!
“Don’t drop the soap.”
Show him The Leavenworth Ten.
Tell him to forget the Army and join the Marines.
By your reasoning, good and patriotic American young men and women should forego the military and just turn it over to the perverts.
How would that help the country?
Your family member is going to have to learn to live in the real world, whether military or civilian. He may be young and impressionable now, but he’s going to have to contend with all types no matter what path he takes.
Don’t let the noise fool you: our military is all business, and no more gay than it has ever been. The only difference is that they can now talk about it.
If he does his job and keeps his nose clean, he’ll be just fine. And he will make you proud.
News flash: gays have always been in the US military — the only change is that now they be “out” without consequence to their careers/jobs. My time in the US Army was a long time ago during the Cold War and I had one guy in my unit that I suspected but he never caused a problem in that regard. He did get caught smoking weed which caused him to lose his nuclear MOS but he turned out to be a really good unit clerk.
Do you really think the military is overrun with queers?
Drop down to Ft. Benning if you have a chance. Maybe check out the Infantry Museum. I think you’ll have your answer then.
Using the Nazis as an example, the most pro-gay units were also the most pro-Nazi such as the SS and SA.
My only other advice would be to go to college and go ROTC. Being an Officer is preferable. At least that's what my NCO's tell me.
The only problem with military life is on younger married folks. His super hottie wife had an affair while he was away deployed and they are now divorced....it was really rough on him.
What you're describing sounds more like a street gang than the Army. Is he not interested in college/ROTC and going in as an officer?
Not to often one worries about being sent some where to be shot at or blown up...
That kid sitting there? He is my nephew.
Show him how our military has been treated in the past decade. Show him how the politicians who send him over to whatever country they want will put him down back home, accusing him of war crimes with no proof, while at the same time defending the people he’s fighting against. Show him the ROEs our soldiers are saddled with that force them to fight with both hands tied behind their backs. Show him how the military is treated as far as benefits and voting rights.
Please understand that I have nothing but respect for the military, but I must be honest. From what I’m seeing nowadays, the military is viewed more as a political pawn and a social experiment, rather than the defenders of our nation. If your nephew is going in out of a desire to serve and protect his country, I fear he is going to be very disappointed.
Get used to it, Mitt Romney is much more radical on homosexualizing the military, he was against DADT almost 20 years ago, he found it anti-gay.
ROTC/Officer would be nice, but, unfortunately, he’s just not up to college level with grades and stuff.
But some of us in the family (not his parents) are worried that an organization that normalizes and celebrates homosexuality is not an appropriate or safe place for impressionable young men.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Look. The same argument can be made about going to College. Or joining the workforce.
Have him take the ASVAB (military) Test- find out the “careers” MOS he would be eligible for. Could help decide future
Gays should be the least of our worries about the US Military.
The biggest problem is that the Pentagon has become a cesspool for political hacks that operate in CYA mode full-time. They never hesitate to throw a good Airman/Salior/Soldier/Marine under the bus in order to appease the Muslim world.
I would hesitate to recommend military service to any family member under the current conditions, especially with a Marxist in charge. He and his advisers believe in a different mission for the military. Our service members are merely sacrificial lambs. And they use the military as a test lab for their social experiments. Phooey on them.
I work out at a university gym and gays work out there..they don't bother you. Never seen anyone hit upon or "attacked'. I suspect life in the military will be the same.
Automatic promotion to and placement as a general.
However, there are MOS's that will teach him skills that will translate very well to civilian careers, but he won't get to go to schools like the ones I named. Communications, mechanics, medical, and engineering jobs are highly desirable once you leave the Army.
The gay issue is not as big of a deal as some make it out to be. Like it or not, it is part of the Army now.
So, that aside...
Whatever training he is offered, get it in writing. If he wants training, make sure he gets training that can be transferred into civilian life. Not all military training can be.
Also, get into any leadership position he can. I hired a guy when he answered my interview question:
Q. Tell me about your greatest success.
A. I got my platoon through Desert Storm without anyone getting hurt.
Me: You are hired.
Really. 100% true story.
Leadership and maturity matter.
Just my two cents, but IMO our people should populate such organizations as much and as heavily as we can, just as FDR did with his people in the federal bureaucracy. Otherwise we are merely outsiders.
“even though he’d be prey for all types of attacks and be in danger”
Attacks? Danger? Why? Is he openly gay?
Tell him to join the Marine Corps. We have 3 sons (from prior marriages), who are 31, 28, and 28. They all did USMC service, 5 tours of Iraq, one Purple Heart among them.
It is an honor to serve one’s country.
I find your comments insulting to the men and women who wear the uniform. I’m sure you’ve never had the testicular fortitude to go down to the recruiter’s office and raise your right hand so perhaps you could show some respect for those of us who have?
Assclowns like you give FR a bad name.
Post #6 sums up my reply to you very well.
You belonged to a different era and you’re the assclown now.
The Army is a job, like any other. In some ways, more interesting, and in other ways, more dangerous (of course).
In Obama’s Army, he will learn all about politics - politically correct speech, bureaucracy, the nonsense of “diversity training,” how not to offend, when to speak and when to shut up. Its always existed in the Army to some extent, but Obama has really turned everything into politics now.
When I joined a huge Multinational Company from a very small firm - the best advice I got was: “you will meet lots of different people and gain skills - but you will also see how big bureaucracies work, and the behavior of people in them. You may not like it, or you may thrive in it, but it is a fact of life.”
Being aware of that really helps me a lot now, when I have to deal with The Government or other large organizations.
In that way, The Army is no different from any corporation, and certainly no different from any other Gov’t job. So I suggest he view that as a kind of experience as well, in addition to particular skills he may learn.
Honorably serving one’s country doesn’t come with an era.
Have you served?
Make what you will of the “gay issue,” the biggest problem for me (not that I'm happy about the recent changes in DADT) is that we have one political party that will deliberately and knowingly undermine it's own men and women in uniform after sending them to the battlefield.
It's bad enough to be asked to fight the enemy abroad. But it's a national disgrace for our bravest men and women to be sent into Harm's Way only to have one of our two major political parties attack them and their mission on the home front.
Quite frankly, I blame GWBush for not responding forcefully and repeatedly as the Left/Democrats repeatedly attacked and undermined our effort in Iraq and Afghanistan. I think this was one of Bush's greatest failures...probably THE greatest.
We find ourselves in a position, now, where the war on terror has been so politicized that the liberal media sees absolutely no reason to even bother reporting on the fact that the rules of engagement in Afghanistan have more than quadrupled the average annual combat death tolls under Obama (as compared to Bush).
If we were going to surrender the battlefield in Afghanistan, why wait until election time to bring the forces home, and instead leave them there for over aother year, each of them doing nothing but watching the clock spin while they wait to see if they'll be the next American to catch a bullet.
Why would we hope that the US could ever again be able to go to war under a Republican president without seeing an immediate and concerted effort to undermine that effort for the sake of political gain? Why would any loving parent advise their son or daughter to step into that position?
If my son had been old enough to ask me about getting a commission in the late 1980s or early 1990s I would have celebrated the request and wished him well in that pursuit. But a young man or woman considering taking the oath, today, is stepping into a cesspool of political correctness and party politics, where the uniformed soldier, sailor, airman, and marine, are nothing but fodder for political arguments by craven politicians who care nothing about the sacrifice of these patriots and their families...but only for themselves and their own gain.
With all my heart I wish this wasn't the case. But after 30 years in and working for the military I've lost friends, and sat with friends who lost friends. And while I could always credit the soldier with great praise for their patriotism and sacrifice, I could never tell myself or anyone I spoke to that they died for a noble purpose, and did it with the full support of the American people and the politicians who sent them to the battlefield.
And being sent to war without the support of your nation's leadership it too much to ask of anyone else. If someone must die to simply keep count on the ammunition and the MREs while our President waits for the best political moment to bring the troops home from Afghanistan, send me and old mossbacks like me to suffer and die so our politicians can manipulate the news for their own gain. We've lived our lives. We've raised our children. We have more too look back on than forward to. If lives are to be sacrificed needlessly, as they are in Afghanistan today, don't let it be our best and brightest...our most promising young men and women. We can take a bullet in the back from our "allies" just as well as some young kid who has his/her whole life to live.
If we must allow innocent American lives to be wasted for partisan party politics, waste the old...not the young. I'm tired of walking through airports watching some young man or woman be wheeled off an airplane, missing arms or legs, knowing they were wounded long after American stopped seriously fighting the war, when party politics trumped the mission, and the lives of our young.
“I got your back” really means something different these days.
Have him look into career fields with robust warrant officer programs. If he enlists and finds he really enjoys what he's doing, he can submit a warrant packet and have a career doing what he likes.
I spent 10 years on active duty as a Regular Army officer, and often times wish that was the route I'd taken.
Support him. If he makes it be proud, it is an honor and a privilege.
Bingo!
It’s not a sin to join.
But in order for him to advance at all it seems he’s going to have to toe the p.c. line. Is he willing to do that?
Otherwise, why enlist? If it’s just for the money/training, makes sense, but that doesn’t sound so patriotic.
“Look. The same argument can be made about going to College. Or joining the workforce.”
Not exactly. You don’t have live, sleep, shower and comingle 24/7 in college or in the workforce.
Also, in college or the workforce, you have freedoms of speech and association and etc. that you don’t get in the military.
Thank you for your service to our country.
During basic infantry in WWII I was in a barracks where a big show it all liked to parade through the top floor going to the shower with the towel over his shoulder. We being young and tender 18 year olds were warned that this guy was a pussy. One day at the hand grenade training station big pussy was mouthing off during a lecture and the Sgt. called him down from the bleachers to help demonstrate a phosphorous grenade. When the Sgt. handed the grenade to him and pulled the pin you could almost see the guy’s fatigues filling up. When the Sgt. yelled at him to throw the damned grenade the guy with his best girly toss let it slip and the grenade fell right in front of the bleachers. Any G.I. who went through training can imagine the the scene of trainees jumping off the bleachers in all directions. Luckily no one was hurt not even big Marvin who was a better runner than a thrower. Obama pitching a baseball to home plate reminded me of Marvin try to get rid of that grenade.
Gays are the LEAST of our worries when it comes to the military.
US Military people: Would you open fire on American citizens if ordered to do so?
Don’t do it for now. 10,000 military men got raped last year. Obama has rules of engagement favoring the enemy, his friends. Republicans are weak and stupid - going along to get along. It’s Viet Nam all over again.
Give him articles to read.
I call shenanigans.
http://couchtripper.com/rapedbysoldiers/?p=645
There are so many articles on this male on male rape wave, please research it so you can be a heads up in life. It’s harming a lot of American young men and most don’t report it happening for fear of rejection and shame.
Tell him to join the Air Force.
Army=tents vs AF=hotel
Army=march everywhere vs AF=air conditioned bus
Army=? vs AF=your own room (that’s a big one because no flamer roomy)
This issue was noted in the Gold Book Report put out by the Army.
Some soldiers were raped when the went to the outdoor showers in the combat zone.
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