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Christians should 'leave their beliefs at home or get another job'- cross not required by scripture
Telegraph - UK ^ | September 4, 2012 | Bruno Waterfield

Posted on 09/04/2012 7:08:29 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife

Landmark cases, brought by four British Christians, including two workers forced out of their jobs after visibly wearing crosses, have been heard today at the European Court of Human Rights

David Cameron, the Prime Minister, has previously pledged to change the law to protect religious expression at work but official legal submissions on Tuesday to Strasbourg human rights judges made a clear “difference between the professional and private sphere”.

James Eadie QC, acting for the government, told the European court that the refusal to allow an NHS nurse and a British Airways worker to visibly wear a crucifix at work “did not prevent either of them practicing religion in private”, which would be protected by human rights law.

He argued that that a Christian, or any other religious believer, “under difficulty” is not discriminated against if the choice of “resigning and moving to a different job” is not blocked.

“The option remains open to them,” he said.

Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship and is not required by scripture.....

(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government
KEYWORDS: antichristian; antitheism; atheismandstate; christianity; employment; eussr; faith; freedomofreligion; humanrights; jameseadie; religion
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1 posted on 09/04/2012 7:08:35 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

How is that European Court working out for you?


2 posted on 09/04/2012 7:11:46 AM PDT by stocksthatgoup (Wealth = Net Worth Income = Net Work)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Allahu Akbar!


3 posted on 09/04/2012 7:13:31 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the sociopath.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Actually, I would agree with this IF, and only IF, it applied all employers and all employees.

In other words, private companies should be free to hire and fire on whatever basis they chose. Governments are a little different, but they should be able to establish their dress codes, as long as it applied to all people equally.

In other words, if crosses could not be worn, neither could hajibs.


4 posted on 09/04/2012 7:14:32 AM PDT by chesley (God's chosen instrument - the trumpet)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

A lot of the customs that Muslims have come from tradition as well(Hadiths), not scripture!

Muslims are a protected class, so that doesn’t matter anyway. It’s evil White Christians that have to apologize for being horrible people. /s


5 posted on 09/04/2012 7:14:35 AM PDT by Shadow44
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Keep wearing them. It’s your stuff or your soul on which you place more value.


6 posted on 09/04/2012 7:14:49 AM PDT by Combat_Liberalism
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship...

These "government lawyers" don't seem very bright. I wonder who told them that nonsense.

7 posted on 09/04/2012 7:15:11 AM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Had enough of the freaks running the show yet?)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

So does this go equal for Muzzies who have to pray five times a day to Mecca?


8 posted on 09/04/2012 7:16:38 AM PDT by dfwgator (I'm voting for Ryan and that other guy.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Will that apply to wearing burkhas to work...that is strictly Islamic.


9 posted on 09/04/2012 7:17:02 AM PDT by Dudoight
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Well, if it’s requirements they want, Islam is the religion for England. The imams will tell you what your wife and daughter can wear and which hand to wipe your butt with.

Britain is going down the drain, after all the blood we shed on her behalf. What a waste.


10 posted on 09/04/2012 7:17:02 AM PDT by txrefugee
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Coming soon to a government near you.


11 posted on 09/04/2012 7:17:08 AM PDT by T Minus Four
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
How offensive to wear a gold or silver cross!!!

I know I'm living on the edge by doing this however...(gasp)....

Someone MUST show the totally offensive and horrendously in your face piece of metal!

Perhaps children should be removed from the room if anyone is reading this in the presence of minors.


12 posted on 09/04/2012 7:18:43 AM PDT by EGPWS (Trust in God, question everyone else)
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To: FlingWingFlyer
I wonder who told them that nonsense.

I would start with the 'Father of Lies' and work your way down from there.

13 posted on 09/04/2012 7:19:00 AM PDT by tbpiper
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

It’s not as if the cross is as important to Christianity as the Burka is to Islam.

/s


14 posted on 09/04/2012 7:22:18 AM PDT by Iron Munro ("In any compromise between good and evil, it is only evil that can profit." - Ayn Rand)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

And the “koranical” basis for the burqua in Eurabian society?

FUEUSSR.


15 posted on 09/04/2012 7:24:06 AM PDT by a fool in paradise (Only Obama put a dog on the roof of his mouth. Dogs are friends, not food.)
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To: Iron Munro

Assaults on Women Increase with Muslim Brotherhood Takeover of Egypt

16 posted on 09/04/2012 7:24:50 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: chesley
In other words, private companies should be free to hire and fire on whatever basis they chose. Governments are a little different, but they should be able to establish their dress codes, as long as it applied to all people equally.

That is, in fact, how it should work and how one would interpret a Constitutional reading of our system.

17 posted on 09/04/2012 7:26:22 AM PDT by C. Edmund Wright ("You Might Be a Liberal" (YMBAL) Coming out Sept 1 by C. Edmund Wright)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Does this mean the muslim women can leave their head scarves at home ... or find another job? /s


18 posted on 09/04/2012 7:28:20 AM PDT by MissMagnolia (Being powerful is like being a lady. If you have to tell people you are, you aren't. (M.Thatcher))
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To: FlingWingFlyer
Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship...and is not required by scripture.

These "government lawyers" don't seem very bright. I wonder who told them that nonsense.

EXACTLY!! We are told to 'carry' our cross daily. :) Let the godless idiots figure out that one!

19 posted on 09/04/2012 7:31:19 AM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
There are several passages of Scripture that clearly state that your Christianity is to be publicly displayed and not to be hidden under a bushel basket - for example:

“You are the light of the world. A town built on a hill cannot be hidden...” Matthew 5:14

20 posted on 09/04/2012 7:32:49 AM PDT by elpadre (AfganistaMr Obama said the goal was to "disrupt, dismantle and defeat al-hereQaeda" and its allies.)
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To: C. Edmund Wright

Unless, of course, you were an autocratic, unelected federal judge, or a progressive who sees no limit on the power of the state.


21 posted on 09/04/2012 7:34:01 AM PDT by chesley (God's chosen instrument - the trumpet)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

“Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship and is not required by scripture.”

I hate to tell you idiots this but the Koran requires Muslims to convert non-Muslims or put them to death.


22 posted on 09/04/2012 7:34:38 AM PDT by Psycho_Bunny (OWS = The Great American Snivel War)
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To: EGPWS
How offensive to wear a gold..

Not at all, a reminder that we will be walking on streets of gold!

23 posted on 09/04/2012 7:38:58 AM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: C. Edmund Wright

Unless, of course, you were an autocratic, unelected federal judge, or a progressive who sees no limit on the power of the state.


24 posted on 09/04/2012 7:41:15 AM PDT by chesley (God's chosen instrument - the trumpet)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

the same country that treats it as a crime to offend a Muslim


25 posted on 09/04/2012 7:42:06 AM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: FlingWingFlyer
Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship...

Some people consider it just a piece of jewelry. I have seen Madonna wearing a cross.
Although I think some anti religious wear it more to try to dilute it's meaning.

26 posted on 09/04/2012 7:43:22 AM PDT by oldbrowser (They are marxists, don't call them democrats)
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To: stocksthatgoup

This is what the meaning of freedom of worship vs freedom of religion can bring. Even the USSR had freedom of worship. The truly worrisome thing is that since Obama became POTUS and Hillary SecSt the term freedom of worship has been replacing freedom of religion in official State dept documents and Obamacare has codified that we enjoy freedom of worship not religion in the Dems America.


27 posted on 09/04/2012 7:46:10 AM PDT by xkaydet65
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To: FlingWingFlyer
Now comes the irreconcilable differences in European nation states. There are the Catholic states and the non-Catholic states.

So far they haven't done all that good a job of melding all cultural and religious traditions so that conflict is minimized and this sort of nonsense doesn't end up in court.

To the religious minded person it doesn't matter if the source of the opposition to his behavior or dress comes from non-Catholic, or Catholic, or self-described secular sources.

And that touches on a really big difference between European and American standards of law. There the focus is first on what happens nationally vis a vis the national legal system, and only secondly on what happens to the individual.

You see that so clearly in the legal submissions made in this case ~ in Europe the individual is still a piece of dirt who can be kicked around.

Obamugabe would like that in America which is why he should have been removed long ago. The Democrats had the majorities they needed in Congress to do it, but they didn't.

We must now remove the rest of the Democrats so we can return to our own values and expel the European-minded traitors in our midst ~ whether they come from Indonesia or Mexico ~ it's time for them to go!

28 posted on 09/04/2012 7:51:29 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Laying this just at the feet of Europe is a mistake.

The same thing is happening to an ever weakening Christianity here...

29 posted on 09/04/2012 7:51:39 AM PDT by ejonesie22 (8/30/10, the day Truth won.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you.

John 15:18-19

Seems to have been expected.

30 posted on 09/04/2012 7:55:16 AM PDT by throwback (The object of opening the mind, is as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Time for me to buy a cross and wear it every day. The global war on Christians (and Jews) continues.


31 posted on 09/04/2012 8:02:19 AM PDT by jpsb
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Ironically my Mennonite ancestors first gathered around Strasbourg Entzheim in the Alsace because of a lack of religious enforcement there that overlooked their reformed Anabaptist beliefs and practice. But the forces of religious dogma eventually returned and determined that not only were they free to work elsewhere, but since most were self employed farmers, eventually they were “freed” to live elsewhere too. So they fled to the Dutch low country while freedom of religion flourished there, then to the Vistula delta while freedom of religion flourished there, then to the USA... tick-tock.


32 posted on 09/04/2012 8:03:11 AM PDT by ME-262 (Ichabod)
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To: chesley

well, yes, perhaps I would have been better served to say “should” instead of “would” —


33 posted on 09/04/2012 8:07:14 AM PDT by C. Edmund Wright ("You Might Be a Liberal" (YMBAL) Coming out Sept 1 by C. Edmund Wright)
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To: chesley

And IF, I as a business owner could opt to hire only professing, born-again Christians.

The option of leaving for another job is ONLY viable IF there are jobs that this lunacy isn’t present in.


34 posted on 09/04/2012 8:07:24 AM PDT by RoadGumby (This is not where I belong, Take this world and give me Jesus.)
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To: presently no screen name

Mine is silver, is that okay? (sarc)


35 posted on 09/04/2012 8:07:44 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: RoadGumby

That’s pretty much what I said, business owners should be free to discriminate on whatever basis they choose. The ones that work on merit only will beat out the bigots.


36 posted on 09/04/2012 8:24:06 AM PDT by chesley (God's chosen instrument - the trumpet)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship

(Certainly, not recognized as such by the craven, atheists that permeate today's British government)

37 posted on 09/04/2012 8:28:28 AM PDT by Nevermore (...just a typical cracker, clinging to my Constitutional rights...)
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To: faucetman
Mine is silver, is that okay? (sarc)

" ... you shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold, ..."

A little historical context albeit totally off topic! [grin!]

38 posted on 09/04/2012 8:43:57 AM PDT by SES1066 (Government is NOT the reason for my existence!)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
If this rule is applied evenly, then I don't see a problem with it. Airline flight attendants have a uniform and if jewelry of any kind is not a part of the uniform, then the airline should be able to tell this woman to not wear a cross. That should apply to all religions — no yarmulke and no hijab. Nothing - just the uniform.
39 posted on 09/04/2012 8:47:09 AM PDT by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Government lawyers also told the Strasbourg court that wearing a cross is not a “generally recognised” act of Christian worship and is not required by scripture.....

Given that in the time the Scripture was being written, wearing a cross was asking for martyrdom, this is factually STUPID logic! Thus do we demonstrate once again that lawyers are trained to choke on gnats but to swallow camels, like the Pharisees Jesus was scolding in Matthew 23:24!

Once again we see a society being forced into transition by an intrusive and intransigent culture. Nobody would have raised an eyebrow if someone was wearing a cross in Britain before the Islamic Influx. Now, civil custom and laws derived from a common culture are used against that culture to assure active avoidance of offense to the hyper sensitive, both of the left and Islam.

40 posted on 09/04/2012 8:57:41 AM PDT by SES1066 (Government is NOT the reason for my existence!)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Why would the crosses even be seen? I never take my cross off and doubt few have ever even seen it.


41 posted on 09/04/2012 9:01:15 AM PDT by arrogantsob (Obama MUST Go. Sarah herself supports Romney.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

42 posted on 09/04/2012 9:06:11 AM PDT by KC_Lion ( Wherever I find myself standing, I forever stand with Israel.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Coming soon to America...Christianity is being outlawed.


43 posted on 09/04/2012 9:07:07 AM PDT by jacknhoo (Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

I bet this “judge” has NO problem with homosexuals wearing rainbox flag pins.


44 posted on 09/04/2012 9:07:53 AM PDT by Flavious_Maximus
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

IIRC, the hijab is not required by the Koran. So what is their point?
Or do muzzies get special dispensations from leftist dominated bureaucracies and judiciaries?


45 posted on 09/04/2012 9:14:31 AM PDT by Little Ray (AGAINST Obama in the General.)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

“did not prevent either of them practicing religion in private”

The words of liars and hypocrites, when Muslims can pray, PUBLICLY, in mass on PUBLIC streets!!!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2096263/The-Mecca-city-In-London-street-faithful-way-pray-mosque-overflows.html#ixzz1lQZBxH16


46 posted on 09/04/2012 9:15:35 AM PDT by Wuli
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Egypt: Kill a Christian, Collect a Reward

by Raymond Ibrahim
September 4, 2012
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3325/egypt-kill-christian-reward


47 posted on 09/04/2012 9:22:08 AM PDT by jacknhoo (Luke 12:51. Think ye, that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, no; but separation.)
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To: chesley
It serves no end to wear your religion on your sleeve.
48 posted on 09/04/2012 10:14:21 AM PDT by ANGGAPO (Layte Gulf Beach Club)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife

Just like the Muslims.


49 posted on 09/04/2012 10:17:12 AM PDT by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: ANGGAPO

Doesn’t it? Maybe; maybe not, but that’s not really the point, is it?


50 posted on 09/04/2012 10:31:32 AM PDT by chesley (God's chosen instrument - the trumpet)
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