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Property Tax Revolution in North Dakota, Minnesota, Michigan
Townhall.com ^ | March 26, 2012 | Mike Shedlock

Posted on 03/26/2012 7:22:42 AM PDT by Kaslin

The granddaddy of property tax revolts is now underway in North Dakota.

The North Dakota group, Empower the Taxpayer writes "On June 12, 2012, the voters of North Dakota will have the opportunity to make North Dakota truly 'Legendary', as the first to pass a state constitutional amendment that will abolish the property tax, prioritize spending by the legislature, and finally give local governments something they never had: true local control over spending."

Public unions and proponents of big government are now involved in a major wave of fearmongering because North Dakota counties get about 60 percent of their revenue from property tax.

If the amendment passes, school districts will simply have to get funding from another source, or cut budgets.


Support Grows For Abolishing Property Taxes

Minnesota Public Radio discussed the setup in North Dakota in an article last November called Support grows for abolishing property tax in ND

Many Minnesota residents expect a bigger bill when their property tax statements arrive this month. But across the border, North Dakota residents are considering a proposal to make the state the first in the nation to abolish property taxes.

Supporters gathered more than 28,000 signatures to put that question on the ballot next June.

Backers of the measure say there's plenty of revenue to go around without property taxes. But local government officials say eliminating property tax would create chaos.

In the north central North Dakota small town of Carrington, population 2065, Mayor Don Frye wonders if businesses will build in his city if the snow isn't plowed, or the sewers don't work.

Those are just scare tactics, says Charles Tuttle. He's one of the organizers behind a measure to abolish property taxes.

Eliminating property taxes would put more than $800 million back in the pockets of property owners, stimulate the economy and create thousands of jobs, Tuttle said, referencing the study [
Eliminating Property Taxes in North Dakota] from a Massachusetts free-market think tank.Michigan Ponders Property Tax Repeal

Inquiring minds note that Michigan Ponders Property Tax Repeal

County governments across Michigan are keeping a close eye on Lansing as lawmakers zero in on the possible repeal of the personal property tax.

Personal property tax in Michigan is paid by businesses on property not permanently affixed to land, such as furniture, tools and computers. Michigan counties’ reliance on personal property tax has increased in recent years as revenue from other sources has plummeted. The state is one of 43 that implement some form of a personal property tax.

Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder’s (R) tax reform plan calls for eliminating personal property taxes. To ease the impact, alternatives have been rumored — including the state’s taking over court costs. These costs represent one of the largest expenditures for counties in Michigan. Snyder favors a “revenue-neutral” elimination of the tax, but hasn’t announced any proposal to replace the tax with another funding source.

Michigan is not the only state considering a possible repeal of the personal property tax. A constitutional amendment is being proposed by a citizen petition to abolish the North Dakota personal property tax. The measure will appear on the June 2012 election ballot. Illinois and Missouri are also looking into repealing their personal property taxes, but no legislation has been put forward.
Minnesota House Passes Legislation to Freeze then Phase Out Business Property Taxes

Please consider Minnesota House Passes Tax Relief and Job Creation Act

Saint Paul – (March 22, 2012) – The Minnesota House of Representatives today approved the Tax Relief and Job Creation Act by a vote of 72-62.

The Tax Relief and Job Creation Act freezes the statewide tax on business property for one year and phases out the statewide tax on business property over 12 years beginning in 2014. It also excludes 70 percent of the first $150,000 of value for all business property in 2013, benefitting small businesses throughout the state especially those in Greater Minnesota.

“Minnesota’s business property tax rate ranks among the highest in the United States. Our property tax relief package helps create a stronger, competitive business climate by freezing the statewide business property tax rate for one year and phasing out this burdensome regressive tax to allow for more investment in products, services and employees,” said Rep. Greg Davids (R-Preston), chief author of the bill.
That's a start but I have to ask, why should businesses own their homes free and clear without being subject to onerous taxation but not individual homeowners?

It's Our Home Not Theirs!

Please consider the following video Robert Hale Co-Author of Property Tax Revolution who says "It's Our Home Not Theirs!"



"The essence of freedom is property rights. It always has been. Yet, if you don't pay the government the tithe that they request, you lose your property."

Indeed!

You Never Own Your Own Home

Property taxes are an insidious form of taxation. They mean you never really own your home. Taxes even go up at the whim of local school boards and teachers unions who perpetually want more money, not for the kids, but for the school boards and teachers' unions.

Property taxes are particularly hard on senior citizens who can literally be taxed out of their own homes.

The public unions and local governments who have their hands in your pockets will be fighting hard with money and fearmongering ads. You can counter with donations to Empower the Taxpayer in North Dakota.

It's time to put an end to property taxes nationwide. The place to start is North Dakota.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Editorial; Government; US: Michigan; US: Minnesota; US: North Dakota
KEYWORDS: michigan; minnesota; northdakota

1 posted on 03/26/2012 7:22:45 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin
This is fabulous to see.

Property taxes evolved from the feud - the deal between the vassals and their estate lords. You defend us, we give you one third of the crops.

Or more.

This whole protection racket had an unspoken threat: don't pay the tax, and you'll need protection from the protector.

So it's just a perpetuation of feudalism, and the reign of the thugs over the productive.

Which brings up another point: property taxes were never meant to be a tax on principle residence. They were supposed to be a tax on production - and since pretty much everyone made their living off the land up till about 100 years ago, the only way you got income was from your property.

Most states have a homestead deduction on their property tax bill. This is a remnant of that concept: property tax didn't apply to the farmhouse, but rather the production of the farm.

The idea of losing your house to the tax man was anathema to free people. Thus the deduction.

So end the property tax. We have excise taxes and income taxes. We should end the latter of those too, but it's at least only exacted when you make money, not simply because you have a place to sleep.

2 posted on 03/26/2012 7:32:06 AM PDT by Regulator
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To: Kaslin

The place to start is privatizing education, elimination of public sector parasite unions as a result, and the abolishment of the Dept. of Ed.

Then we can worry about cutting property taxes starting, well everywhere.


3 posted on 03/26/2012 7:35:46 AM PDT by quantim (Obama = #theoccupier on twitter.)
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To: Kaslin
Generally, there are two theories for taxes: 1) ability to pay (e.g., federal income taxes) and 2) benefits received (e.g., gasoline tax). Property taxes don't fit into either one...it's a crappy tax based on wealth, not income. It impacts retired people heavily who often have reduced incomes (violates principle #1) and don't have kids in schools (violates principle #2) which is where a huge chunk of property taxes go.

Solution? I really don't see property taxes going away any time soon. However, I would like to see credits issued for property taxes paid that could be sold in the open market. For example, if I paid $2000 in property taxes, I'd have a piece of paper I could sell to someone who has kids in school which they could use to pay their kids “tuition” for public schooling. Further, the credit could be used for private schools, too. This would force public schools to get their act together or fade away.

4 posted on 03/26/2012 7:39:16 AM PDT by econjack
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To: Kaslin

In CA this would quickly be invalidated by the courts...even before it was voted on.


5 posted on 03/26/2012 7:40:49 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Kaslin

property taxes are a crime....i watch my wifes grandparents lose their little cottage on a lake (prior to michigans headlee amendment) people started buying up the little cottages and building very large mansion type homes on the lake.. their taxes shot up so much they could no longer afford to live in their PAID FOR retirement home... property taxes are a crime..


6 posted on 03/26/2012 7:41:33 AM PDT by joe fonebone (Project Gunwalker, this will make watergate look like the warm up band......)
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To: onedoug

PROP 13 !!! The last wall between me and my government destroying me... The Jarvis Group will be pleased to hear other states r finally getting it!


7 posted on 03/26/2012 7:55:28 AM PDT by Republic Rocker
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To: econjack
Over much of rural Alaska, no property taxes; and it's the one concept everybody here wants to preserve, no changes. It also forces communities to live on the what the state gives them from the oil profits.

Sure the urban areas such as Anchorage have property taxes and spend 1/3 to 1/2 more on education spending/student; but you don't see positive results in the test scores.

The state politicals go crazy thinking about us rural Alaskans not having property taxes; forever talking about head tax and other taxes that would capture the bucks slipping through their greedy hands.

8 posted on 03/26/2012 8:02:21 AM PDT by Eska
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To: Kaslin
Works for me. I'm all for paying no taxes. My problem is I'm not Timothy 'Franz' Geithner. When I owe tax I pay it. This is one instance where I am all for the liberal's "fairness doctrine" being applied. Why should I, a Conservative, be forced to pay taxes when they, the liberals, don't and worse, keep what I pay to pay for their perverted anti-American frills and entertainment? Or as the case is going to be this year... Why should I be paying for obomba's re-election?

Do away with all taxes or... if people can't handle not paying taxes let there be, at most, a 10-15% usury tax. Unions and government have put many small businesses out of business. I guarantee that business owners will have no problems finding non-union and non-government employees to plow snow.

9 posted on 03/26/2012 8:10:23 AM PDT by Whats-wrong-with-the-truth (Romney... Just put the (D) behind your name and be done with it.)
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To: Kaslin

YES! There are some 33 other major taxes the State gets revenue from (ND), and a Billion dollar surplus. Time to quit paying the government rent.


10 posted on 03/26/2012 8:18:14 AM PDT by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing)
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To: Kaslin

I recently read Benjamin Franklin’s autobiography. When he became involved in civic matters - by this time in Boston, I think - city-wide property tax was assessed per person or head-of-household, only to pay for firefighter services initially. Franklin argued that it wasn’t fair to charge the poor widow in a hovel the same amount of protection money as a wealthy landowner with extensive acreage - and so was born a system of property evaluation.

While it fixed the first problem, now the government got to snoop into what everybody owned and improvements thereto.

I’ll leave it to others to figure out how else a community is to fund emergency svcs like fire/police, but the government intrusion of property tax assessment is offensive on its face. The reason you seldom hear of assessors demanding entry into one’s home is that they know they’d be ridden out of town on a rail - if they’re lucky! - and the manner of their employment wouldn’t even exist. But by law, they can do so.


11 posted on 03/26/2012 8:28:02 AM PDT by Titan Magroyne (What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.)
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To: Regulator

You make an excellent point on the relationship of the vassals and the lords. The name we have for our homes and land, real estate, has the word royal (real) in it, again recognizing the approach that says everything belongs to the sovreign with the vassals/serfs being granted a small portion as long as they pay a tribute/tax (shades of the Hunger Games!!) to the sovreign.


12 posted on 03/26/2012 8:40:19 AM PDT by T-Bird45 (It feels like the seventies, and it shouldn't.)
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To: onedoug
If you could pay ten years of property taxes as a one time payment for permanent forgiveness of property taxation, a cash strapped state like CA would go for it.
13 posted on 03/26/2012 8:42:27 AM PDT by pterional
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To: Regulator
Correct. And, I'll add that 1/18th of the land in every survey township was set up to provide for the education of the citizens therein in perpetuity.

Traditionally, sections 16 and 36 of each 36 square mile township were designated to support education.

The township was to either rent out this land and use the income generated to support education or sell the land and put the proceeds in trust to generate income to do the same.

In addition, the educational dollars were stretched as one or more landowners would typically donate land for a school and often a building as well. This ensured not only that their kids would have a short walk, but that the increased traffic would give their land priority for road improvements.

Generations of American kids were educated in such schools and few were dysfunctional. You can Google a typical graduation exam for eighth graders in Kansas, circa 1900, and you would be lucky to get 20% of modern American high school kids to pass the test.

14 posted on 03/26/2012 8:42:33 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Springman; sergeantdave; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; ...
Image Hosted by ImageShack.us
15 posted on 03/26/2012 8:42:51 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: pterional
They sure would. And the "permancy" would end as soon as the bureaucracy decided they needed more money, though they might call it something else.

After all, if you are wealthy enough to pay ten years of property taxes up front, you can surely afford a modest increase in user fees.

16 posted on 03/26/2012 8:49:43 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Kaslin

sfl


17 posted on 03/26/2012 9:04:34 AM PDT by know-the-law
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To: Kaslin
You Never Own Your Own Home

PROPERTY TAXES ARE RENT TO THE GOVERNMENT!!!

WE ARE A NATION OF RENTERS! THE GOVERNMENT IS THE LANDLORD!!!!

Yes! Indeed! I am jumping up and down and shouting! I am exasperated that so few of my fellow citizens understand this basic concept.

The majority of property taxes go to pay for the GODLESS and SOCIALIST-ENTITLEMENT government schools that teach a godless cultural, political, and religious worldview that is a First Amendment and freedom of conscience ABOMINATION and in complete contradiction of every value that I hold.

Also....With business property taxes ( building, land, and personal property such as tools, equipment, and computers) these taxes are **hidden** and passed on to the taxpayer in the price of everything with use and buy.

18 posted on 03/26/2012 9:07:15 AM PDT by wintertime (Reforming a government K-12 school is like reforming an abortion center.)
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To: wintertime

Sucks to live in a house that’s paid off but I still have to pay for it or face losing it.


19 posted on 03/26/2012 9:32:03 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Kaslin
To ease the impact, alternatives have been rumored

The only alternative to be considered should be the cutting of spending. I wish the whole country would do away with property taxes, they are against freedom in every way possible. No one should have to pay the government for the right to live in homes they own or are buying.

20 posted on 03/26/2012 9:44:55 AM PDT by calex59
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To: cripplecreek
Sucks to live in a house that’s paid off but I still have to pay for it or face losing it.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Absolutely! Property taxes are never paid off. The government is always the landlord. And...Yeah! It sucks!

Personally, my husband and I, when we retired, sold our condo and moved to the county with the cheapest property taxes in the state (likely the nation) and bought much less house than we could afford. We live comfortably but modestly. The primary reason was so that we could avoid property taxes.

Two things just bug me about property taxes and I am exasperated that other conservative fail to “get it” :

1) The principle that one can never really be the owner of the property. The government is **always** the landlord.

2) Most property taxes go to support a socialist-entitlement of government schooling that is utterly godless in socialist cultural, political, and religious worldview. Children **will** learn to think and reason godlessly. They must just to cooperate in the classroom. How could it be otherwise. And...Children risk learning to be comfortable with socialism. Why? Because any government and voting mob that is powerful enough to give them tuition-free socialist schooling is powerful enough to give them **lots** of “free” stuff.

21 posted on 03/26/2012 9:55:19 AM PDT by wintertime (Reforming a government K-12 school is like reforming an abortion center.)
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To: Regulator

Bump to that!


22 posted on 03/26/2012 10:33:12 AM PDT by gibsosa
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To: T-Bird45; Vigilanteman
You both had interesting answers, certainly didn't know about the land reserved in townships for schools.

Sorta puts the lie to "the schools will collapse if we don't have huge property tax". It's really about cash for the overseer class...

I don't think that utopian thinkers in the 19th century really understood what they were unleashing with the Free Schools movement. It was all well intentioned.

But the looter class once again sensed an opportunity. Give us your money, or we take your land. And you can't get rid of us, because we ARE the government, the unelected part of it, and we OWN the elected guys.

People say it can't be stopped. Well, we can try.

23 posted on 03/26/2012 10:59:48 AM PDT by Regulator
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To: Kaslin

As said, as long as there are property taxes you never actually own what you have earned and acquired. It is clear that you can be taxed out of you home and “possessions”.

Here in Texas the assessment boards have lost touch and simply don’t care about right or wrong. It is all about generating revenue from on of the only sources they have since there is no state income tax.

How can it possibly be right, reasonable or good for a person with no income or diminished income to owe taxes on property that is bought and paid for that he can’t afford to pay? How is it right to say that he must sell and move down scale? Sounds like confiscation to me.

Oklahoma, think twice about eliminating state income tax.. the money for services has to come from somewhere. The real question should be what is really needed?

One of the real evils is baseline budgeting with automatic inflation increases. Bureaucrats forget that they don’t run their homes that way.


24 posted on 03/26/2012 11:18:16 AM PDT by Sequoyah101 (Half the people are below average.)
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To: Kaslin

I believe most property related taxes have an element of direct benefit supported by the property owner for services to be rendered and an element of feely-goody taxes promoted by citizen gad-flies who believe it is their societal if not God’s desire that all people no matter how deserving must be supported, in or out of government. Taxes are a creation of people.


25 posted on 03/26/2012 2:22:32 PM PDT by noinfringers2
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To: Kaslin
Michigan had better do something instead of harassing the taxpayers they do have.

In late February, I got a notice from Lansing that I owed $326 more for an error on my 2008 state income tax. Instead of spending more than that retrieving records, having the accountant fight it, etc., I sent the money. The next day, I got a demand for all the tax returns I supposedly hadn't filed for the years 2008 - 2010! So, I had made a mistake on a return that I didn't file!

This is on top of ludicrous demands the past several years that the state has made for tax deposits they didn't receive (until I gave receipts), etc.

My solution: dissolve the corporation and move, which I just completed. Loss of not many employees or taxes, but it's part of the death by 1,000 cuts.

To hell with Michigan.

26 posted on 03/26/2012 2:31:01 PM PDT by jammer
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To: Sequoyah101
You are correct that we never own land in property tax states; we only lease it from the state.

But it's not the TYPE of taxes that is necessarily the problem. It's the unlimited (and unfathomable) obligations the states have taken and the voracious appetite for revenue from any place they can find it that is the problem.

27 posted on 03/26/2012 2:34:20 PM PDT by jammer
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To: joe fonebone

“property taxes are a crime....i watch my wifes grandparents lose their little cottage on a lake (prior to michigans headlee amendment) people started buying up the little cottages and building very large mansion type homes on the lake...”

Yea, here in Texas we freeze property taxes when you turn 65. We figure it makes more sense to keep old people in houses that are much, much, bigger than they need (since the kids are gone), and make the young families live like crap, having to cover a growing portion of their (the old peoples’ reduced) property tax.

We call that ‘fairness’ here.


28 posted on 03/26/2012 5:57:06 PM PDT by BobL (I don't care about his past - Santorum will BRING THE FIGHT to Obama)
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To: Kaslin
the voters of North Dakota will have the opportunity to make North Dakota truly 'Legendary', as the first to pass a state constitutional amendment that will abolish the property tax, prioritize spending by the legislature, and finally give local governments something they never had: true local control over spending

I hadn't heard about this. This is completely awesome. I live in Vermont, where property taxes are 10x higher than most other states. The money goes to a million feel-good lib programs, and most of the roads are impassable and poorly maintained.

I fear for our nation in so many ways, but I'm always so happy to see that so many are trying to get things back under control.

29 posted on 03/26/2012 7:50:34 PM PDT by 101stAirborneVet
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To: calex59
The only alternative to be considered should be the cutting of spending.

BUMP!

DEFUND socialist collectives, foreign and domestic.

live - free - republic...VERY low-taxed, prosperous, free.

30 posted on 03/26/2012 7:53:41 PM PDT by PGalt
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To: onedoug
In CA this would quickly be invalidated by the courts...even before it was voted on.

Yes it would, and I was born and raised in North Dakota. The only reason I have never gone back, is because of the cold weather. Other than that, I would have left California already.

31 posted on 03/26/2012 9:59:22 PM PDT by Mark17 (California, where English is a foreign language)
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