I wonder if Obama will give GM more money to start building moon vehicles.
Posted on 02/07/2012 5:37:14 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
you just dont understand...while we were sleeping, a whole bunch of space stuff happened and we took exploratory samples of everything, AND even got 40+ MPG on the round trip to measure the distance to the sun...
i can look at an image in a funhouse mirror and be 11 feet tall and weigh 22 lbs...but somewhere, *science* decided that an accurate measurment of me was quite different than appearances...
Hmmm.. Put words in my mouth to make an argument? Bad form.
2012 is not 1961. See SpaceX, Scaled Composites, etc. There are private companies which could do amazing things given a goal. Hell, Boeing could probably put together something and make a tidy profit if they had the incentive. That’s why you do such a thing as a prize.
As to your second point, currently there’s no Prize. Until there is, what is there to declare for? A speech that all the other candidates are ridiculing? What company would risk the wrath of those other candidates should they win?
This is a statement on faith in American Exceptionalism. We can do so much that we do not know we can do. All it takes is leadership.
The fact that he apparently thinks his own involvement is the key to the private sector jumping all over this is honestly a bit frightening to me, because it suggests that he really doesn't understand the way the private sector operates and makes decisions. The people in the private sector capable of pulling something like this off are far more knowledgeable than Newt will ever be as to its feasability and a reasonable timeline.
If a President is going to get out in front of this issue, like Reagan did with the Space Shuttle, then it stands to reason it is going to be something in which government is heavily involved, both financially and otherwise. There's nothing wrong with that if you really support the idea, but Newt's claim that he is going to pull this off without any real government funds reveals someone who adjusts reality to his desires rather than vice-versa.
What you really mean is "given a goal by the government", and that's where we differ. I don't think Americans or American exceptionalism needs politicians to excel.
I have faith in Americans and American businesses that if this is truly a viable opportunity, they would be pursuing it regardless of whether there was some government "prize" or not. Frankly, the idea that Americans are just sitting around ignoring opportunities until their government points them out is offensive. The folks at Boeing and elsewhere in the private sector have forgotten more about the feasability of space exploration than Newt will ever know.
Believing otherwise is the same crock of big-government filth that leads to the belief that green energy is just sitting there waiting for us if only big corporations weren't stupid enough not to see it. For me, though, I suspect that such companies are much more informed about the economic realities of all this stuff than a candidate who has taken historical fiction writing a bit too seriously. I like Ray Forschten and all, and the Lost Regiment series was cool, but I know when reality ends, and fansasy begins.
If the truth about these ideas is as you say, then the fact that the private sector (apparently) is just sitting on its hand doing nothing about it until Newt offers a "prize" is a pathetically said commentary on the state of this nation and its people.
This is a statement on faith in American Exceptionalism.
No it isn't. It is a statement of faith in politicians, and the lack of faith in the ability of the American people to have the initiative and foresight to do things for themselves.
We are in agreement on that. It will need government funding as it is high risk but the national security and economic payoff is big — and the money will be spent here on Earth but the payoff will be big — and why the Chinese are moving forward.
A country in decline, is the country who must quickly realize why they are. That is where Newt is correct. He just needs to understand that the market won’t be there until the infrastructure is proven. Then watch out.
I support Santorum, but I am not for taking down Newt on this one. Remember Reagan? His space policies included SDI which was mocked at the time by calling it “Star Wars” We still use the phrase “Star Wars” to refer to revolutionary space based missle defence. The term is now a serious one, not a mockery, all the critics, either have gone away, or try to take credit for the programs and tech.
O.K. So, you hate Newt. Got it.
Sometimes, government actually has uses. You know how the airlines got their start? Hauling mail. From time to time, government can actually provide a spark that otherwise might not happen. Unfortunately, in most cases where a spark is needed, it is perverted into something like the example of “green energy.” Grants, loans and other politically motivated boondoggles like that are useless and only enrich the connected.
This is the essential difference in the Prize concept. No acheivement, no money. No grants to political donors. No taxpayer loans. It’s a put-up or shut-up deal.
I might add that this idea of space oriented prizes has been around for a long time. Jerry Pournelle had Newt and Dan Quayle talked into it as far back as ‘91. The idea is very simply based on getting government out of it until the task is accomplished.
You are good.
My earlier thought is that Newt would get private businesses to invest and build a warp drive Star-ship and just beam the materials back to earth to pay for investments. They will have to hire Lenard Nemoy as an technical adviser on the project. Too bad Scotty is dead. As Newt says, us 'establishment' guys just have no vision.
This was definitely the FUN thread of the day. Lost in Space!
I wonder if Obama will give GM more money to start building moon vehicles.
I saw that movie ‘the Moon’ on one of my digital cable channels last year: cloning workers on the Moon who send back the rocket payloads of energy to the earth, I really enjoyed it. This probably was the movie Newt saw that gave him this brainstorm.
Vision???
Santorum just took a bunch of votes away from both.
Santorum has one huge plus that wasn't as important a number of months back : HE'S NOT ROMNEY OR NEWT.
Primary voters had time to really imagine those two as nominees and it wasn't pretty.
Newt always said government would be involved. He said 10-20% of the funding would come from government and would not be new money, but reallocated funds from within NASA. If the private sector doesn’t jump on board, no gain, no loss. I like knowing that if the budget does turn around in future years or if funding does become available, Newt would be the most likely to pursue an aggressive space program. I think we all know that neither Newt nor Congress will increase deficit spending to pay for this program.
There are others.
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