Gun raffle fails to raise eyebrows in US

ABC Online (AU) ^ | 22 February , 2004 | HAMISH ROBERTSON/Lisa Millar

[TERMINATTOR]

HAMISH ROBERTSON: Well staying in the United States, Anti-gun campaigners are concerned about a worrying trend in which charity groups and fundraisers are using guns as prizes in raffles.

A volunteer fire brigade has set a new benchmark with its raffle, giving away a gun every day for the entire year.

It says it needs the cash to continue operating, but many are wondering whether America, a nation already saturated with guns, needs anymore.

Lisa Millar compiled this report.

(sound of cars passing by)

LISA MILLAR: A few hours drive west of Washington DC lies Emmitsburg, Maryland, which gets its share of tourists. A small country town, it's part of America's civil war history, Gettysburg is just a few kilometres away.

But it's attracting national attention now because of the way in which the local fire brigade is raising money.

It's holding a gun raffle, not just any gun raffle, but one that gives away a weapon for every day of the year.

One of the brigade's volunteers, Chris Stahley, admits some people were initially anxious.

CHRIS STAHLEY: You had your mixed feelings. I mean, you had people who were totally for it, they knew the good cause it was going for, they knew they were hunting guns, they're guns that everybody that's buying these calendars already have and then you also had the ones that wondered why a fire department would want to give guns away and make this a more dangerous place than it already is.

LISA MILLAR: The brigade sells a 2004 calendar for $30. Each day's prize is clearly marked.

CHRIS STAHLEY: That's another good hunting gun. Of course, as I said, they're all hunting guns that we give away. There's some normal, regular guns and then there's also some collectors items like the Dale Earnhardt 12-gauge shotgun, that's more than likely will not be used for hunting, if somebody wins it they’ll probably keep it as a collector's item because of the name.

LISA MILLAR: John Hollinger shows me one of the prizes, assembling it fresh from the box.

(sound of a rifle being assembled)

It's a Winchester rifle due to be given away in a few days.

He's volunteered for this brigade for 58 years and he can't understand the fuss about the raffle.

JOHN HOLLINGER: It's not really unusual I don't really think in this part of the country. There's a lot of organisations, sportsman's clubs and fire departments, they hold these types of raffles.

LISA MILLAR: Chris Stahley is adamant the guns are for hunting and nothing else.

CHRIS STAHLEY: They're not out to put weapons in bad people's hands, I mean everybody’s got to… they just can't just win a gun and get it, they need to go through a background check.

(sound of siren)

LISA MILLAR: This small town fire brigade says the raffle is the difference between being able to help people or not.

CHRIS STAHLEY: It's the only way we succeed. We have to do these fundraisers to get the equipment that you see here in this fire department. Without that we'd be a little bit of nothing.

LISA MILLAR: But anti-gun campaigner Leah Barrett says the popularity of gun raffles is frightening. Even more frightening, that they’re so common many Americans no longer raise an eyebrow.

LEAH BARRETT: I think that Americans are adequately armed. A UN survey on small arms released over the summer showed that Americans are the most heavily armed civilian population in the world. We have between 86 and 92 guns per 100 people, approaching one gun per person, and the next most heavily armed country is Yemen, they have 40 weapons per 100 hundred people.

So I think raffling guns in a culture that’s already totally saturated with guns, hand guns, assault weapons, rifles, is irresponsible, publicly irresponsible. It's a public health menace and does nothing to alleviate the horrible gun carnage that we have here every year.

LISA MILLAR: But the Emmitsburg Fire Brigade rejects any suggestion it's contributing to America's gun culture. It's going to make $60,000 from this raffle, and it's been such a success, they're already working on next year's calendar.

This is Lisa Millar in Emmitsburg, Maryland, for Correspondents Report.

[TERMINATTOR]

"A UN survey on small arms released over the summer showed that Americans are the most heavily armed civilian population in the world. We have between 86 and 92 guns per 100 people, approaching one gun per person"

It's a beautiful thing, but there's room for improvment. We need to get up to at least one gun and 1,000 rounds per person. Buy more guns and BLOAT! God bless America!

[coloradan]

and the next most heavily armed country is Yemen, they have 40 weapons per 100 hundred people.

[Samwise]

Oh forcryignoutloud! One of the biggest grins I ever saw on my dad's face was the night he won a shotgun at the county fair raffle.

[coloradan]

Abortion industry fails to raise eyebrows in US.

For some conservative-biased counterpoint.

[Dan from Michigan]

Gun raffles are great. :)

[Dr. Frank fan]

Yup.

Writing a news story saying that something "fails to raise eyebrows" is almost de facto evidence of bias.

Why the hell should it raise eyebrows?, one wants to ask these "reporters".

[TERMINATTOR]

We don't want those towelheads catching up to us, now do we?

[Viking2002]

Hey, raffles are a good thing. A couple of years ago, by buddy entered a raffle at a local turkey shoot, and won a nice Remington 12-gauge pump. I was so jealous - he always has that kind of luck. LOL :-)

[Oberon]

Leah Barrett: So I think raffling guns in a culture that’s already totally saturated with guns, hand guns, assault weapons, rifles, is irresponsible, publicly irresponsible. It's a public health menace and does nothing to alleviate the horrible gun carnage that we have here every year.

MOLON LABE, BABY, MOLON LABE!

[prion]

A UN survey on small arms released over the summer showed that Americans are the most heavily armed civilian population in the world.

...and, as a result, a thoroughly crappy place to live, where foreigners fear to visit and its own citizens are fleeing the country in droves...

Oh, no, wait. It doesn't say that. Hm.

[NorseWood]

Where can I buy a raffle ticket?

[tacticalogic]

Gun raffles aren't supposed to raise eyebrows, they're supposed to raise money.

[Monty22]

WHO CARES WHAT THE PRIZE IS?!?!?!!?

I've done many raffles like this. My only regret is I haven't won!

[quantim]

Could you imagine a "legal" homosexual marriage license for a charity raffle that went along with the gun? LOL.

[I got the rope]

Hey we should do that here...all proceeds to FreeRepublic of course! We should have each chapter have a raffle and whoever comes up with the most gets bragging rights for the year.

[CarolAnn]

Gun raffles ARE great. My husband is from western PA, and his brothers buy raffle tickets for Christmas presents. There are only a few raffles like that around here in Kansas.

[mountaineer]

It's a public health menace and does nothing to alleviate the horrible gun carnage that we have here every year.

Owning only two guns, I admit I haven't really done my part to contribute to the gun carnage in my neck of the woods. With a new .357, I hope to do better.

By the way, I find it interesting that in that very same neck of the woods, where just about everyone has a hunting rifle or some sort of weaponry, the murder rate is practically nil. I wonder how that could be!

[Bogey78O]

yea, it's saying. "wow, you guys aren't outraged?"

It's the classic push poll equivilant in the media.

[Dr. Frank fan]

A UN survey on small arms released over the summer showed that Americans are the most heavily armed civilian population in the world. We have between 86 and 92 guns per 100 people, approaching one gun per person

Interestingly, Ms. Barrett needs to re-study her talking points, if this is the report she's referring to. The real numbers are "83 to 96", according to the chapter entitled "Fewer Blanks". Yemen has "33 to 50" and Finland has "39" per 100.

Surprisingly, reading from this report, it seems to be more sober and careful than the typical "more guns = bad" fearmongering you get from the likes of Mrs. Barrett. Here's an excerpt:

While it is tempting to contract peace-loving Europe against gun-wielding America, careful analysis shows that this is not confirmed by facts. Contrary to assumptions that Europeans are virtually disarmed, the 15 countries of the European Union alone have an estimated 84 million firearms.

Here's another:

The chapter [shows]...how misleading it can be to assume that the greatest dangers come exclusively from the most numerous and advanced small arms.

Ms. Barrett should more carefully read her own propaganda sources. They do not support what she is saying.

[Celtjew Libertarian]

If the U.S. is "saturated" with guns, then one more gun, given away via a raffle isn't going to make much of a difference.

It's where guns are rare that it would standout.

[mountaineer]

The chapter [shows]...how misleading it can be to assume that the greatest dangers come exclusively from the most numerous and advanced small arms.

Nineteen guys with four airplanes killed a lot more people within a single two-hour period than 270 million Americans, some of whom own those terrible firearms, ever would.

[TroutStalker]

You're right, there aren't many gun raffles here. In central PA there were raffles everywhere, all the time. Volunteer fire companies were only one of many orgs that had them. My best friend's dad won a .308, it was a beautiful rifle.

[cavtrooper21]

...but notice we haven't banned box cutters and pocket knives...

[CarolAnn]

I think the American Legion here has a gun raffle once a year, but that's the only one I can think of. You are exactly right about the fire houses in PA. Those are the raffles my brothers in law enter.

One of the coolest things about that part of the country is the hunting seasons. On opening day of deer season, the biggest thing to do is to go to the firehouses for breadfast. I had a ball hunting out there. Kansas has better deer though.

[Eastbound]

"LEAH BARRETT: ???

Hey, that reminds me. I've got to go downstate and look at one of those this weekend. Thanks for the reminder, Leah, baby.

[Oztrich Boy]

Actually raffling guns in a culture that’s already totally saturated with guns, hand guns, assault weapons, rifles, is very foolish














because you won't sell any tickets

[BykrBayb]

I'm going to hold a raffle, and give away a prize every day for a year. You don't have to pay money to get a raffle ticket. You just have to do one of the following, your choice.

A) Recite The Pledge Of Allegiance. (The correct version. Not the politically-correct version.)
B) Sing The National Anthem (Cannot be done in the style of rap, alternative, reggae or jazz.)
C) Publicly renounce terrorism. (Without redefining any words.)

The prize each day will be the winner's choice between...

A) A hunting rifle.
B) A "legal" homosexual marriage license (I shamelessly stole the idea from quantim in post #14)
C) A hand gun.
D) A lifetime supply of Kool-Ade.

I admit, this raffle is skewed. Anybody capable of qualifying probably isn't going to want B or D.

[TroutStalker]

I really don't know about the Kansas deer being better (haven't hunted here), but it is a big deal in PA. Schools close on the first day of deer season, pancake breakfasts at firehalls and churches, and one million hunters head into the forests. It's a truly momentious occasion when you turn twelve and get to participate for the first time.

[mountaineer]

we haven't banned box cutters and pocket knives

Not yet - we're still trying to get nail clippers out of the hands of airline passengers and school children.

[GeronL]

OMG!!! There are people without guns out there!! This is a perfect opportunity for Compassionate Conservatives to show they care about these deprived people.

Armless Americans (haha) should be given arms! Its the only government give-away that conservatives can support!!

[GeronL]

Gun raffles aren't supposed to raise eyebrows, they're supposed to raise money.

Right on, my capitalist comrade!!!

[GeronL]

Free Republic has certain limitations on fund-raising because of its tax-status. You'd have to ask JimRob if he could accept the money from such a raffle.

[tet68]

Dang, and to think I'm carrying the load for 25 defenseless
liberals......Ought to be a TAX deduction for each weapon in a home. The American Milita/Tax Act of 2004!

[GeronL]

Texas apparently has 3 million white-tail... come and get some!

[GeronL]

You are giving a good home to those firearms, you do indeed need a tax deduction.

An Adopt-A-Gun Program is an idea...

[Johnny Crab]

"Where can I buy a raffle ticket?

Try your local 4-H rifle team! I'm buying a few this year because 1st prize is a Benelli autoloading shotgun and not their lowest cost one!

Then there's the "hunting" rifle and the compound bow and the....no cheap prizes here....

[erinjohn]

I won the basket of chear when I was 16 at my local Vol FD. I was not able to enjoy it.

That the only thing I have ever won and I couldnt even keep it. Wah

I would love to sign up for this raffle.

[Johnny Crab]

"Where can I buy a raffle ticket?"

Try your local 4-H rifle team! I'm buying a few this year because 1st prize is a Benelli autoloading shotgun and not their lowest cost one!

Then there's the "hunting" rifle and the compound bow and the....no cheap prizes here....

[El Gato]

many are wondering whether America, a nation already saturated with guns, needs anymore.

You can never have too many guns, at least up to the point where any beyond a couple needed to defend your family starts taking food from the table, clothes off your kids back, etc. But as many as you can afford is not too many.

[cavtrooper21]

You forgot strip-searching grandma after she forgot to tell the security goons about the knitting needles in her bag!!!


This is just a taste of things to come.
I'm waiting for the sobriety/weapon checkpoints.

[El Gato]

We have between 86 and 92 guns per 100

We definitely need to work harder.. Hmm, I have been wanting an AR-15 type, I guess I should, pardon the expression, bite the bullet and go get one. OTOH, I'd rather wait until the AWB expires and I can get one propertly equiped, with bayonet lug, flash hider, pistol grip, and good supply of full capacity magazines. And if the ban doesn't expire.. well I do have this ugly black semi-auto, sans lug and with muzzle brake, in 7.62x51, mounted with a nice, if old, scope.

[jscd3]

but many are wondering whether America, a nation already saturated with guns, needs anymore.

I'll handle this one...

The answer is YES

Ok Alex, I'll stay with the same category; I'll take "Obvious Answers" for $200...

[stands2reason]

Anti-gunners "stretching" the truth about reports they refer to?



I'm shocked, I tells ya, shocked!

[Springman]

Sorry, I only got a .357 w/2 boxes of ammo. The wife won't let me get the shotgun I want. I always wanted to get a double barrel shotgun.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

Actually raffling guns in a culture that’s already totally saturated with guns, hand guns, assault weapons, rifles, is very foolish because you won't sell any tickets

Oh I think I could find room for a couple more, I only own the bare minimum, Two shotguns, rifle, and my dainty Lady Smith.

[An Old Man]

"We have between 86 and 92 guns per 100 people, approaching one gun per person..."

Well nobody's perfect. It is somewhat disturbing though when you realize that a few of us are skewing those numbers to the high side.

Semper Fi

[El Gato]

Armless Americans (haha) should be given arms! Its the only government give-away that conservatives can support!!

It would even be Constitutional, for state, local or national governments to do. The Constitution gives Congress the power to provide for arming the militia. In times past those who couldn't afford a gun were issued one, although usualy by their town or state, not by the feds.

[El Gato]

The wife won't let me get the shotgun I want

Cost or the ickness of a shotgun. She should be made aware that shotguns are actually safer than handguns, at least you don't have to worry about what's a few hundred yards beyond your target. With a .357, or even a .22 rimfire, you must.

[GeronL]

The Constitution gives Congress the power to provide for arming the militia

and the militia is made up of all able-bodied men between 18 and 45.

[PAR35]

but there's room for improvment.

Instead of a bunch of little prizes, have one grand prize. Who wouldn't buy a chance to win 365 guns.