Posted on 06/28/2016 11:10:52 AM PDT by C19fan
The Soviet Union began the Cold War well behind the United States in submarine technology. Although the Soviets acquired several of the most advanced German submarine types towards the end of the war, the United States had amassed a wealth of experience in submarine and antisubmarine practice from the Pacific War and the Battle of the Atlantic.
(Excerpt) Read more at warisboring.com ...
I heard the German Type 21 was the basis for the Nautilus.
I heard they could also go incredibly deep. Deep thermoclines, get under that and its much harder to detect.
Yes but you also wonder if the Alpha’s sensors (passive sonar) were good enough to track a US/UK boomer from the other side of that deep thermocline over its own noisy machinery? While the Alpha might have been ‘safe’ it might not have been able to do its job without going shallow where the targets were.
They used a lead-cooled fast reactor. Submerged, they could travel at 41 knots (and could reach that speed with a startling degree of acceleration). They could dive to at least 2,200 feet, far deeper than any NATO submarine of the time, or today.
Two Alfa class submarines (the fictional V. K. Konovalov and E.S. Politovsky) are featured in Tom Clancy’s novel, The Hunt for Red October. The E.S. Politovsky sinks due to a catastrophic reactor meltdown via a loss-of-coolant emergency - Clancy assumed that the reactor used very high pressure water coolant - while Konovalov is rammed by Red October and subsequently sinks. In the film adaptation, only Konovalov appears, and she is sunk by one of her own torpedoes.
The power plant for the boat was a lead-bismuth cooled fast reactor. Such reactors have a number of advantages over older types:
* Due to higher coolant temperature, their energy efficiency is up to 1.5 times higher.
* Lifetime without refueling can be increased more easily, in part due to higher efficiency.
* Liquid lead-bismuth systems can’t cause an explosion and quickly solidify in case of a leak, greatly improving safety.
* LCFRs are much lighter and smaller than water-cooled reactors, which was the primary factor when considering power plant choice for Lira.
Designed burst speed in tests was 43–45 knots (80–83 km/h; 49–52 mph) for all vessels, and speeds of 41–42 knots (76–78 km/h; 47–48 mph) could be sustained. Acceleration to the top speed took one minute and reversing 180 degrees at full speed took just 40 seconds. This degree of maneuverability exceeds all other submarines and most torpedoes that were in service at the time. However, the price for this was a very high noise level at burst speed, as for any body moving through water at high speed. The tactical speed, where the noise would be similar to other submarines, is about 20–25 knots (37–46 km/h; 23–29 mph).
Propulsion was provided by the main screw with 30 MW steam turbines, and two 100 kW electric-powered screws served as an additional propulsion system for maneuvering, quieter ‘creeping’ (low speed tactical maneuvering), and for emergency propulsion in the event of reactor, turbine, or main screw problems.
Themoclines are not necessarily ‘deep’.....from an ex-Sonarman. ;-)
“far deeper than any NATO submarine of the time, or today.”
Shhh..... please to not tell anyone: “Test Depth” is classified information so that only people with ‘clearances’ know actual test depths of our boats. Advertised test depths are for the ignorant masses.
After the “Thresher” and “Scorpion” disasters advertised test depths were modified but that has gone by the wayside now. ;-)
BAck in the old days when I worked in a prison, I had a guy tell me a story of his days in the navy. He told me that once out in the Atlantic they had an Alfa go under the fleet at 40+ kts. Command was not happy.
I don’t know if it was true or not, but, other than being a serial killer, he was a nice guy.
The type XXI U-Boat was the basis of the US submarine fleet up until the nuclear subs replaced them. My high school chemistry/physics teacher was a retired submarine skipper. Right after WWII he participated in the English language refit and sea trials of the XXI U-Boats. He dearly loved those submarines, declaring them the first true submarine. They were the first that could stay submerged for a week, a little more if you didn’t mind discomfort.
Was just talking to my dad and he vaguely remembers the two of them down in Key West when he was stationed with SubRon 4 in 46-48 aboard the Howard W. Gilmore AS-16.
Truman visited him in sick bay when he had the presidential yacht down there. (dad has a great story attached to this.)
He told Truman he just had a bad cold. LOL
“Deep Thermoclines” is a term I’m not familiar with.
I know what “Thermoclines” are, but they are usually associated with rather shallow depths.
Could you help me here?
Thanks,
HLB
Just my opinion, I thought that it was a Sodium, not lead, reactor.
Regards,
HLB
Just pulled that info off the internets. There were 7 alphas and the K-27 with lead bismuth alloy coolant fast reactors. USS Seawolf (SSN-575) was the only U.S. submarine to have a sodium-cooled nuclear power plant. There are several Soviet sodium cooler fast reactors, but none, at least at least according to Google searches, were fitted out in submarines.
Thanks for keeping me straight.
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