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Long range weather outlook for upcoming winter season
wgrz ^ | 9-18-2015

Posted on 09/18/2015 7:04:15 PM PDT by Citizen Zed

The Climate Prediction Center Thursday released its late fall / early winter forecast for the United States.  This forecast includes the months of October, November and December.

Graphics show Western New York is forecast to have a warmer, and drier than normal, period during these three months.  This seems to follow what can be typically expected during an El Nino event.

During strong El Nino events like this year, warm waters in the tropical Pacific ocean cause a strengthening of the Pacific jet stream which tends keep cold air bottled up in Canada and an active strorm track across the Southern US. Such a pattern is a warm one for Western New York during the winter and diminishes the lake effect snow process which keeps our seasonal snow totals down.

There are reasons to believe, however that this is not a typical strong El Nino. There have been many comparisons of this event to the past strong El Ninos of 1997 and 1982. The winters of those years were a bit warmer and drier than average here, but the El Nino we are watching develop this year is different.

First, the pool of warm water is much father west than what is typical, and the entire Northern Pacific ocean is also running much warmer than normal. This is in contrast to the set-ups of 1997 and 1982. This can have a dramatic effect on how the jet stream eventually sets up resulting in the possibility of more cold air intrusions than one would typically expect in an El Nino winter.

On the other side of the US, the Atlantic ocean is running cooler than normal, again in opposition to the set-up of those two previous strong El Nino winters.  2 On Your Side Meteorologist Patrick Hammer says he believes we can not yet lock into a warm and dry winter just yet.

There are many local effects we need to look at as well. A warmer winter could keep Lake Erie from freezing over, which could imply more snow as any lake effect season would last longer into the winter. ( A frozen Lake Erie shuts that process down). Also, even if we do not have an active lake effect snow season, a strong Pacific jet stream can lead to larger winter storm development across the East Coast that could stretch into Western NY.

It is growing more and more likely our upcoming winter will not be as hash as our past two winters, but it will be very interesting to see how this winter will unfold given how different the lead-in to the season is looking compared to past El Nino events.  Hammer says there is one year that does look similar to this year in terms of how ocean temperature distribution is set up during the fall. That year was 1958, and that winter brought heaps of snow.


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Weather
KEYWORDS: 1958; 2016
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October, November and most of December are still Autumn, right?
1 posted on 09/18/2015 7:04:15 PM PDT by Citizen Zed
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To: Citizen Zed

They can’t accurately predict the weather 10 days out and now they are predicting it months in advance?


2 posted on 09/18/2015 7:07:08 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (There's a right to gay marriage in the Constitution but there is no right of an unborn baby to life.)
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To: Citizen Zed

They still can’t correctly predict tomorrow’s weather. Why does anyone pay attention to these “long range weather outlooks”?


3 posted on 09/18/2015 7:07:28 PM PDT by laweeks
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To: Citizen Zed

They are part of the next Water Year.


4 posted on 09/18/2015 7:09:57 PM PDT by Paladin2 (Ive given up on aphostrophys and spell chek on my current devices...one uses Brit spel now.)
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To: Citizen Zed

I predict that G_d’s sense of humor will kick in and make all these predictions null and void. Much like all the snowstorms that seem to occur in any city the global warming crowd throws a shindig.


5 posted on 09/18/2015 7:11:37 PM PDT by doc1019 (Out of my mind ... back in 5)
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To: Citizen Zed

Pointless prognosticating for the Finger Lakes Region...


6 posted on 09/18/2015 7:12:31 PM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks ("If he were working for the other side, what would he be doing differently ?")
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To: Citizen Zed

Yes. Winter begins on Dec. 21. As to what kind of winter we’re going to have..... I venture a guess and say.. cold!.


7 posted on 09/18/2015 7:15:38 PM PDT by jmacusa
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To: doc1019

Name me, ping me...


8 posted on 09/18/2015 7:16:42 PM PDT by null and void (Liberals: 2002, Bring the war home!/2015, bring 100,000 musim 'refugees' here NOW!)
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To: Citizen Zed

what does the Farmer’s Almanac say?


9 posted on 09/18/2015 7:17:38 PM PDT by huldah1776
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To: Blood of Tyrants
They can’t accurately predict the weather 10 days out and now they are predicting it months in advance?

Hell here in SoCal they can't even get the next day right. For the last ten days every prediction has been off temp wise, always predicting 5-10 degrees cooler than what we get.

10 posted on 09/18/2015 7:17:56 PM PDT by Mastador1 (I'll take a bad dog over a good politician any day!)
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To: huldah1776
Redux


11 posted on 09/18/2015 7:21:16 PM PDT by Daffynition (*We are not descended from fearful men*)
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To: Citizen Zed

This guy must listen to Joe Bastardi who will be posted here tomorrow. Joe has been saying this is more like the 57-58 El Nino versus the 97 El Nino everyone else has been pushing. Joe is way ahead of the curve.


12 posted on 09/18/2015 7:46:08 PM PDT by Parley Baer
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To: Blood of Tyrants

We go by the Farmer’s Almanac which is predicting another cold winter just like last year. I think they are supposed to be right about 80% of the time. :-)


13 posted on 09/18/2015 7:47:00 PM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped)
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To: Citizen Zed; Steely Tom; AFPhys; The Mayor; neverdem; Behind Liberal Lines; lysie

IOW, they just don’t know and they’re using a lot of words to say so and yet sound intelligent and like they know what they’re talking about.


14 posted on 09/18/2015 7:59:50 PM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: Citizen Zed

I’d love to see a nice Indian summer through Nov this year, we’re due. Been pretty nice so far. I’d rather not blow through 14 cord of wood again this year, last winter sucked.


15 posted on 09/18/2015 8:15:08 PM PDT by VTenigma (The Democratic party is the party of the mathematically challenged)
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To: laweeks

It is sometimes easier to predict a general seasonal trend in certain geographic areas (like the Pacific Northwest where I am) than a given day next week. The developing El Nino is a good example of that.


16 posted on 09/18/2015 8:22:51 PM PDT by steve86 (Prophecies of Maelmhaedhoc OÂ’Morgair (Latin form: Malachy))
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To: metmom

As I read it, they’re covered whichever way it turns out.


17 posted on 09/18/2015 8:34:27 PM PDT by Steely Tom (Vote GOP: A Slower Handbasket)
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To: Steely Tom

That’s what I read, too. Either warmer than normal or colder than normal; either wetter than normal or drier than normal. Maybe all the two-handed economists got tired of being wrong all the time and switched to meteorology.


18 posted on 09/18/2015 9:18:15 PM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom (For those who understand, no explanation is needed. For those who do not, no explanation is possible)
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To: Citizen Zed

Bookmark - we’ll see...


19 posted on 09/18/2015 11:15:13 PM PDT by jonno (Having an opinion is not the same as having the answer...)
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To: Georgia Girl 2
We go by the Farmer’s Almanac which is predicting another cold winter just like last year. I think they are supposed to be right about 80% of the time. :-)

If they do so say themselves, but accuracy should presuppose a degree of precision, http://news.psu.edu/story/141165/2007/09/24/research/probing-question-farmers-almanac-accurate >

John Walsh, University of Illinois Atmospheric Sciences professor emeritus, reviewed the accuracy of five years of monthly forecasts from 32 weather stations around the county and found 50.7% of the monthly temperature forecasts and 51.9% of precipitation forecasts to correctly predict a deviation from averages.[32][33] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Farmer's_Almanac#Accuracy

20 posted on 09/19/2015 1:35:08 AM PDT by daniel1212 (Turn to the Lord Jesus as a damned and destitute sinner+ trust Him to save you, then follow Him!)
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