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Why are Texas gun carry laws so bad?
Texas Concealed Handgun Association ^ | 9-14-13 | Vanity

Posted on 09/14/2013 6:53:10 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat

I like Texas. Nice people, good state. But one thing that continues to puzzle me is why Texas handgun carry laws are so, well, pathetic. Here is a summary of the requirements for getting a concealed handgun permit: (IANAL so don't take this as legal advice):

Fee: $140 for 5 yrs. Training: In person, at least 4-6 hours, with shooting exam, by TX certified instructor. Fingerprints: required. Photo: required. Open carry: prohibited.

Let's contrast that with some "liberal" states:

Pennsylvania: Fee: $19 Training: Not required. Fingerprints: None required. Photo: Passport photo required in some places. Open carry: legal, except you'll be harassed in Philly.

Vermont: No permit required to carry openly or concealed.

Wisconsin: Fee: $40 Training: Required, but can be obtained for free. Fingerprints: None required. Photo: Not required. Open carry: legal.

So what's with Texas? Its laws for carry of firearms are becoming more comparable with those of Illinois. And it's not an idle question for those of us in VA, since the nonresident permit issued by VA is being used as an alternative to the TX resident permit.


TOPICS: Politics
KEYWORDS: bang; banglist; guncontrol; secondamendment; tx
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1 posted on 09/14/2013 6:53:10 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat
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To: RKBA Democrat

This Texan is wondering the same thing.........


2 posted on 09/14/2013 6:54:17 AM PDT by basil (2ASisters.org)
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To: RKBA Democrat
Yeah, they are suck, but most of the other laws are peachy-keen.

I like me some big ol' Texas.

3 posted on 09/14/2013 6:54:23 AM PDT by Lazamataz (Early 2009 to 7/21/2013 - RIP my little girl Cathy. You were the best cat ever. You will be missed.)
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To: Lazamataz

Compared to California, Texas law is cheap;

Initial application. $100
Livescan and background check $165
16 hour class $200
Ammo to qualify $30 to $100

That’s for a 2 year permit.

Renewal. $75
4 hour refresher class $75

So, for 5 years it comes out to about $750


4 posted on 09/14/2013 7:01:32 AM PDT by CarmichaelPatriot
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To: RKBA Democrat

I agree completely. There should be no fee, no mandatory training, nothing. We get the right to carry through the 2nd amendment not some asshole in Austin!!


5 posted on 09/14/2013 7:03:45 AM PDT by ontap (***)
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To: RKBA Democrat
Getting rid of Dewhurst is a good first step to constitutional carry in Texas.

/johnny

6 posted on 09/14/2013 7:06:14 AM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: Lazamataz

“Yeah, they are suck, but most of the other laws are peachy-keen.”

Some are, some aren’t. Their lack of a state income tax is muy bueno, but it’s so good other states are thinking about emulating it (NC and LA).

Their castle doctrine laws are very good. Some crony capitalism laws. But their gun carry laws are terrible.


7 posted on 09/14/2013 7:20:26 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: JRandomFreeper

Who is Dewhurst, and has he/she been already gotten rid of (politically, I assume you mean) or is that the next order of business in next election? Thanks. Interested neighbors here in Oklahoma want to know!


8 posted on 09/14/2013 7:24:19 AM PDT by TEXOKIE (We must surrender only to our Holy God and never to the evil that has befallen us.)
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To: RKBA Democrat

And, don’t even get me started on the Texas property taxes @ 2.5%!

My California property taxes are 1.25%


9 posted on 09/14/2013 7:24:26 AM PDT by CalTexan
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To: RKBA Democrat

We’ve got a bill to eliminate the state income tax sitting in the Michigan legislature’s tax policy committee now.


10 posted on 09/14/2013 7:24:31 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: RKBA Democrat
In florida, it was about $115 for a 7 year license. The mandatory class has you fire 1 bullet. You pay $40 and mostly learn how to fill out the paperwork.

I can't imagine what texas will be like after they're done drawing in the millions of workers from liberal places around the country like california and illinois.
11 posted on 09/14/2013 7:25:23 AM PDT by jjw
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To: Lazamataz

Those are the laws, but the reality is a bit different.

Open carry is common when going to & from hunting, a local thing. Am told it is legal then. No one ever thinks anything about it.

BUT, I don’t live in the city.

Where I live, there are very few rules.


12 posted on 09/14/2013 7:25:25 AM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: RKBA Democrat
Why are Texas gun carry laws so bad?

Because the Republicans, who completely dominate Texas state government, suck.

13 posted on 09/14/2013 7:27:19 AM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: CalTexan

BUT a house that costs 100,000 in a Texas City Costs 1,000,000 in CA.

Do the math.

And no state income tax.

TX is not like CA and never will be.


14 posted on 09/14/2013 7:27:37 AM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: CalTexan

In Michigan we can even open carry in the state capitol building.


15 posted on 09/14/2013 7:28:29 AM PDT by cripplecreek (REMEMBER THE RIVER RAISIN!)
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To: Texas Fossil; RKBA Democrat
Hey guys, I have a great new idea.

Firearms vending machines.


16 posted on 09/14/2013 7:29:45 AM PDT by Lazamataz (Early 2009 to 7/21/2013 - RIP my little girl Cathy. You were the best cat ever. You will be missed.)
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To: CalTexan

“And, don’t even get me started on the Texas property taxes @ 2.5%!”

Ouch. In the more expensive cities in VA, it works out to a little over 1%. Significantly less in the rural areas.


17 posted on 09/14/2013 7:30:07 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: EternalVigilance

Wrong, the Texas GOP is pretty good.

Look at any state where the ComDems run it. Total disaster.

Yes, we have a few bad GOP public office holders, but we are working on that.


18 posted on 09/14/2013 7:30:14 AM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: Texas Fossil

If they were so great, the abortion clinics would be shuttered and the Second Amendment would be the rule when it comes to bearing arms.


19 posted on 09/14/2013 7:33:31 AM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: Lazamataz

“Firearms vending machines.”

Don’t say that too loudly in VA. Some gun dealer might try to give it a go.

Hmmmm. It could be done.....you’d need a camera...

:-)


20 posted on 09/14/2013 7:33:46 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: basil; All

This article gives some of the reasons.

http://gunwatch.blogspot.com/2013/08/txcome-and-take-it-means-to-restore.html

Primarily it is because Texas has not fully recovered from the tyranny imposed on it by the reconstruction government.

After the carpetbaggers were thrown out, the Democrats found that they liked a certain ammount of tyranny, especially when applied to former slaves and other groups not in political favor.


21 posted on 09/14/2013 7:35:49 AM PDT by marktwain (The MSM must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: Texas Fossil

“Wrong, the Texas GOP is pretty good.”

Then with respect, why do the gun laws suck? It’s no exaggeration to say that the gun laws in PA, VT, DE, ME, NH, and WI are significantly better.


22 posted on 09/14/2013 7:36:00 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: RKBA Democrat

I live in Illinois. Go cry on someone elses shoulder.


23 posted on 09/14/2013 7:38:26 AM PDT by CrazyIvan (Obama phones= Bread and circuits.)
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To: RKBA Democrat; All

“Wrong, the Texas GOP is pretty good.”

“Then with respect, why do the gun laws suck? It’s no exaggeration to say that the gun laws in PA, VT, DE, ME, NH, and WI are significantly better.”

Because reform is hard and takes time. The laws put in place during reconstruction were found to be useful by Democrats later.

There are many large liberal urban centers in Texas. It is much easier to derail reforms than it is to pass them.


24 posted on 09/14/2013 7:40:01 AM PDT by marktwain (The MSM must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: RKBA Democrat
A bit of history:

Texas gun laws were originally enacted to deprive blacks of the right to keep and bear arms. They were intentionally written in a way to allow the law to be enforced on a discretionary basis, which means that certain races would be arrested and prosecuted, while others would be allowed to go on their way, because they were "traveling".

Fast forward to the latter part of the 20th century: police in large metropolitan cities started to enforce the law against almost everyone. But, the state government was still controlled by Democrats, and attempts to enact a CHL law were rebuffed. Even when the House got enough votes for a bill, the Senate wouldn't even consider it because the governor said she would veto it.

Combining the disgust of gun owners with a wave of anti-Clinton sentiment, a long-shot Republican candidate defeated an incumbent Democrat governor in 1994, much to the surprise of many. You might have heard of him -- he went on to higher political office.

That same year, the Republicans took control of the Texas Senate for the first time in decades, if not since Reconstruction. But, the Texas House was still controlled by Democrats until 2002. So, the CHL law was written by a coalition of Republicans and conservative Democrats (yes, there was still such a thing in Texas back then).

The authors made a lot of concessions in committee and on the floor to get the bill passed. Over the years, it has been improved, especially for renewals. But, one benefit of a photo ID for a CHL: it's accepted as a state-issued ID for everything.

25 posted on 09/14/2013 7:40:44 AM PDT by justlurking (tagline removed, as demanded by Admin Moderator)
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To: marktwain

It was a good article and thanks for posting, but it still begs the question: the gop has been in control in TX for the last 19-20 years. And the gun laws still suck. I realize that rome wasn’t built in a day, but 20 years?


26 posted on 09/14/2013 7:41:09 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: EternalVigilance

“Because the Republicans, who completely dominate Texas state government, suck.”

So......Should we vote in Democrats for better gun laws? Really?


27 posted on 09/14/2013 7:41:36 AM PDT by Dudoight
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To: EternalVigilance
Because the Republicans, who completely dominate Texas state government, suck.

See my post #25 in this thread. It might surprise you to find out who controlled the Texas House when the original law was passed.

28 posted on 09/14/2013 7:42:30 AM PDT by justlurking (tagline removed, as demanded by Admin Moderator)
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To: RKBA Democrat

“And, don’t even get me started on the Texas property taxes @ 2.5%!”

Texas has no state income tax...that might count for something.


29 posted on 09/14/2013 7:43:01 AM PDT by Dudoight
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To: EternalVigilance

TX did defund Planned Parenthood. (don’t see how that is related to the CC laws)

I live 4 miles from the farm. It is perfectly legal to carry a hand gun in the glove box of my pickup.

It is perfectly legal to have a handgun on my hip on the way to and from hunting. Or in my case checking on livestock at the farm.

I can assure you that I will not be arrested for either.

At this point I do not feel threatened by my neighbors.


30 posted on 09/14/2013 7:43:13 AM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: CrazyIvan

“I live in Illinois. Go cry on someone elses shoulder.”

And whose fault would that be? Last I checked U-Haul still serviced IL.

The point being that even in Illinois the gun laws are getting better. So what’s the excuse for Texas?


31 posted on 09/14/2013 7:43:36 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: TEXOKIE; Reddon; Ditter; Jane Long; DirtyHarryY2K; Clay Moore; Bigun; hadaclueonce; Brandybux; ...
Dewhurst is the Lt. Governor of Texas. That is THE most powerful position in Texas government, even more powerful than Governor.

Dewhurst is still there, and up for re-election in 2014.

I aim to retire him back to his ranch.

Give Dewhurst the Boot in 2014 (((Ping List)))

To be added or removed from this list, freepmail me.
This is a low volume ping list at this time.

/johnny

32 posted on 09/14/2013 7:43:43 AM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: RKBA Democrat

‘Then with respect, why do the gun laws suck? It’s no exaggeration to say that the gun laws in PA, VT, DE, ME, NH, and WI are significantly better.’

Well, I guess...there are more important things in the consideration which keep people leaving other states and moving to Texas. LOL!

The gun laws in Texas are not at all ‘prohibitive’.


33 posted on 09/14/2013 7:47:06 AM PDT by Dudoight
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To: RKBA Democrat
the gop has been in control in TX for the last 19-20 years.

In the Governor's office and the State Senate, yes.

But, the House wasn't controlled by the Republicans until 2002.

34 posted on 09/14/2013 7:47:51 AM PDT by justlurking (tagline removed, as demanded by Admin Moderator)
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To: marktwain

Bump


35 posted on 09/14/2013 7:48:09 AM PDT by Texas Fossil
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To: Dudoight
So......Should we vote in Democrats for better gun laws? Really?

No. You should stop electing Democrats and Republicans and start electing actual republicans.

36 posted on 09/14/2013 7:49:44 AM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: Dudoight
Yes, they are prohibitive. And lots of folks want that to change. If you are in Texas, vote against Dewhurst in the primary, if you want to make a difference.

I want constitutional carry in Texas. Having spent time in AZ and NM, Texas firearms laws, many left over from reconstruction, suck.

/johnny

37 posted on 09/14/2013 7:50:03 AM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: EternalVigilance
I'd settle for electing conservatives.

/johnny

38 posted on 09/14/2013 7:50:43 AM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: Texas Fossil

“It is perfectly legal to have a handgun on my hip on the way to and from hunting. Or in my case checking on livestock at the farm.”

That’s great, and I’m glad you’re able to do that. But what about the majority of Texans who presumably live in the cities?

By way of comparison, I live in an urban area of VA. And I open carry frequently. Sounds like that sort of thing would land me in the clink if I did so in say Dallas or Waco. Unless I could convince them I was on my way to go hunting. Maybe pigeons?


39 posted on 09/14/2013 7:54:51 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: JRandomFreeper

Same thing.

Principled people who actually understand the obligations of their oaths, and who are committed to fulfilling those obligations.

If any state should have Constitutional Carry, it should be Texas.


40 posted on 09/14/2013 7:55:31 AM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: Texas Fossil

And Texas has a balanced budget—law requires it.

And the Texas legislatures meet once every two-years for about 140 days. . .enough time to do important stuff but not enough time to really get into mischief and meddle.


41 posted on 09/14/2013 7:58:42 AM PDT by Hulka
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To: CarmichaelPatriot
So, for 5 years it comes out to about $750

Then they arbitrarily deny your permit, if you are not in a rural county, or connected.

42 posted on 09/14/2013 7:59:34 AM PDT by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: RKBA Democrat; All

“It was a good article and thanks for posting, but it still begs the question: the gop has been in control in TX for the last 19-20 years. And the gun laws still suck. I realize that rome wasn’t built in a day, but 20 years?”

It has really only been about 11 years. Quite a few incremental improvements have been made during that period.


43 posted on 09/14/2013 8:01:53 AM PDT by marktwain (The MSM must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: JRandomFreeper

Thanks for the information, Johnny. I hope you and Texas are able to accomplish this great work.


44 posted on 09/14/2013 8:03:56 AM PDT by TEXOKIE (We must surrender only to our Holy God and never to the evil that has befallen us.)
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To: RKBA Democrat

I looked at the cost for the Texas CHL and got Florida’s instead. No training rqmt for Vets.


45 posted on 09/14/2013 8:23:28 AM PDT by Elderberry
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To: RKBA Democrat
I am a military guy stationed in Texas and I tell you, I am ready to get out of this state. It is very expensive when it comes to taxes for me. I pay almost $500 a month in taxes on my $217,000 house (family of six, moderate house for Corpus Christi). Utilities are expensive. The cops are very overzealous (pulled over all the time for no reason). I often feel like I am a Mexican national (when I visit Walmart in Corpus-Cal Allen area, I am pretty much the only White-English speaker in the store). The demographics are rapidly changing in Texas and I think this state will go full stupid within the next 5 years.
46 posted on 09/14/2013 8:27:46 AM PDT by ThunderStruck94
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To: ThunderStruck94

Thanks for the insight. I’ve actually given some thought of relocating there in the future, but there are a few things like the gun laws that make it something of a nonstarter.

I wish VA would ditch it’s income tax, but I don’t see it happening.


47 posted on 09/14/2013 8:35:59 AM PDT by RKBA Democrat (Power disintegrates when people withdraw their obedience and support)
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To: ThunderStruck94
Corpus isn't how the rest of Texas is. Sorry you wound up there instead of NAS/JRB in Ft. Worth. It's much nicer here.

/johnny

48 posted on 09/14/2013 8:40:16 AM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: RKBA Democrat

South Dakota (not liberal) $10 for 4 yr permit, basic background check - and you don’t pay the $10 if you don’t pass the background check.

No training. No range requirement.

However, last year they did pass a requirement that if you have to take a hunter safety course for a hunting permit, but still nothing for a CCW.


49 posted on 09/14/2013 8:48:31 AM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian. I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see.)
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To: CalTexan

But you don’t have to pay personal income tax in TX. CA personal income tax is very high as is sales tax.


50 posted on 09/14/2013 8:49:56 AM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian. I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see.)
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