Posted on 08/27/2015 5:43:27 AM PDT by don-o
Whatever happened to all those Waco bikers? You know, the 177 people arrested at the Twin Peaks restaurant in Waco, Texas after a motorcycle rally on May 17 ended with nine people shot dead?
Immediately following the shooting, I wrote about just how badly Waco authorities screwed up the arrests. Rather than trifle with technicalities like the rules for bail under the Texas Code of Criminal Procedure, Justice of the Peace Pete Peterson set bail at a staggering $1 million for each of the arrestees in order to “send a message.” Then I described how prosecuting nearly 200 bikers was crushing the criminal justice system in McLennan County and costing taxpayers a fortune.
Why did the story fade from public attention? What’s come out since the story broke?
As it turns out, it’s no accident that you haven’t heard more about the Waco biker debacle.
First, let’s look at two developments that seem like they would be informative, but actually aren’t.
(Excerpt) Read more at abovethelaw.com ...
“Gator, would it be your contention that medium/large caliber gunshot wounds were not caused by the police? “
Well, according to all my biker buddies here, from May 19 till the autopsies were released, it was gospel that the autopsies would show that all were shot with .223’s and that would prove the theory of a police massacre.
“How about .32 caliber...small or medium? “
I haven’t seen those categorized.
If I were to guess I would say that it would be called “SMALL/MEDIUM”.
Alaska Wolf had more integrity.
Do you support the theory that the bikers were totally innocent and were ambushed by the cops?
Would "Medium" include .308 (.30 caliber)--7.62 mm?--or is that "small"?
Lot’s of nice photos of nice family men you posted there.
Too bad they spend Sundays at breastaurants and in jail instead of home with the wife and kids ...
I'm guessing .308 fits into the small/medium category also.
The reason I asked about .32 caliber is because one of the Bandidos, identified as Dallas chapter President David Martinez, was using a .32 Beretta during the shootout.
Is it Small, medium, or large? or is it small, small/medium, medium, medium/large, large?
The more splits go in there, the more useless the terms.
If the coroner was using just three, then there should be some delineation as to where the cutoff points are.
"Small", "Medium", and "large" should have some specific designation as to size range.
I'm not trying to be argumentative, just to establish some meaning in the terms. Otherwise, it is a wait for the ballistics report, and anything short of that only means more speculation as to who shot whom, not facts.
Definitely presidential material. Probably class valedictorian. Yes. Caught on dashcam! He ditched the gun in a car with a broken window where cops later found a .32. Maybe he was a bad shot? The found a .40 in his motorcycle.
“If the coroner was using just three, then there should be some delineation as to where the cutoff points are.”
The coroner also used ‘medium/large’. His notations are descriptive but not exact, particularly as many bullets are deformed or have lost their jackets.
“Small”, “Medium”, and “large” should have some specific designation as to size range.
There was a whole thread on this when the autopsies came out. I posted a reference to the source earlier today. You can google it if you like. forensic autopsy
Small: .22 or similar
Medium: .38 or similar
Large: .44/.45 or similar
IIRC the Waco police chief himself identified the weapons used by police during the shootout as being .223 rifles back in early June, which caused quite a stir.
That would seem to preclude their causing some of the larger bullet wounds, and leads to an obvious question....:^)
My question remains, where would the coroner put a .30 caliber bullet in that scheme of things. That remains unanswered.
Your guess is as good as mine, although it seems logical that small caliber bullets make small entry wounds not big ones.
Agree about waiting for ballistics but I do think the autopsies have some compelling evidence in them
And it's been all downhill since, while you turn each and every Twin Peaks/ Waco thread into yet another "Princess" self-justification thread to ease the butthurt -- and "get even" with any who would dare call into question what law enforcement and prosecutors are up to, that have also called you out on your [unprintable] methodology of argumentation.
If you had paid fuller attention to comments which I have directed to you, then you wouldn't have cause for to be asking that question.
Take the leading question, false dichotomy & false equivalencies elsewhere.
The absence of GSR and stippling on wounds indicates distances greater than 3 ft. from the muzzle, not really the sort of close contact distance one would expect in a fistfight range, up close and personal melee as portrayed.
I need to review the autopsy data again, and see if any GSR tests were run on the hands of the deceased.
http://gritsforbreakfast.blogspot.com/2015/08/kangaroo-court-in-waco-no-reason-needed.html
Kangaroo court in Waco: No reason needed to arrest packing pastor with CCL
Gun ownership is on trial in Waco, so why aren’t the NRA and all the open-carry advocates going nuts over what’s happening regarding prosecutions from the the Twin Peaks biker massacre?
In McLennan County, visiting Judge James Morgan ruled after an examining trial that there was sufficient cause to have arrested a 65-year old concealed carry permit holder who wasn’t wearing a biker cut but a Christian t-shirt (he’s chaplain to the Bandidos and two veterans groups) because he was carrying legal personal weapons. The judge declared there was probable cause to support an arrest even though no police “officer could offer evidence that Yager conspired to commit murder, assault or any crime that day” Like everyone else arrested that day, Yager’s bail was initially set at $1 million.
An earlier examining trial found probable cause to arrest a Brenham couple even though police agreed they were “merely present at a murder” that there was no evidence they committed.
Legality aside, how is it that a Texas judge can declare police don’t need a reason to arrest legal Christian gun owners and there’s not immediately an army of Second Amendment protesters beating down the DA’s door? The silence from that wing of the political spectrum on this issue is deafening.
Regardless, the law doesn’t seem to matter in Waco anymore. These are kangaroo courts and a flat-out embarrassment to the state.
And what appears lost in these considerations, is question of what undercover LEO operatives were armed with that day, like before little mr. red boots got his hands on a rifle.
Even the battle-rattle outfitted LEO's who waded into the scene likely where carrying .40's or .45 acp's, in addition to M-4 sort of Stoner variant, although I'm not suggesting they used those instead of what possibly & most likely(?) were .223 Remington equivalent.
As you also noted, but not in the following so many words; the outwards appearance of M-4 look-alikes does not mean that those would absolutely be chambered 5.56 x 45 Nato, or else civilian near equivalency .223.
Those weapons can be chambered for a variety of rounds, including in that range, sub-range of frangibility.
Just .223 alone can be loaded with a variety of projectiles, which do not all share identical terminal ballistic performance characteristics when coupled with range of powder loading.
That leaves yet another small array of loose ends, of the sort which call for some examination, before one were to go too far in direction of assuming that their own initial assumptions should be safely taken as fact.
Those are not the only loose ends, yet are one of many that could be known of and identified, among potentially yet more than anyone here on this forum has openly pondered upon.
Re-read #19. The question “Could you show one instance where any Poster had stated that ALL BIKERS ARE CRIMINALS?”, is not so difficult is it?
If your answer is yes, please help all us see your examples by linking to those phantom posts?
“Motorcycle GANG members are not the same as Motorcycle riders. I have many Motorcycle rider friends and not a damn one of them belongs to a criminal gang like the bandidos or Cossacks.” ............ Either you agree with that assessment or are more simply trying to use good law abiding citizens that happen to ride motorcycles as some human shield to detract from the rightful focus on criminal groups (commonly called GANGS) that also ride motorcycles and engage in public gang shootouts that kill nine persons.
So are you and Texas gator the same person?
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