Bye Ford, we'll miss you

UPI | The Bear's Lair ^ | 3/17/2003 | Martin Hutchinson

[Jorge]

I can't think of a Ford product I would buy.

I've had great luck with the Ford's I've bought..they've been excellent trouble-free vehicles.
The models I've bought have the highest rating in customer satisfaction possible.

I also like GM but my friends always seem to have constant trouble with their products.

In any case Ford has 6 of the 10 best selling vehicles which says a lot.

[Willie Green]

I cite Honda and BMW.

BMW falls within the Daimler-Chrysler sphere of influence.
Honda has a more mongrel pedigree, with ties that trace back to both Toyota and GM, both directly and through other companies.

Likewise Volvo

Ford owns Volvo.

[Willie Green]

Read the tagline idiot.

ROTFLMAO!!!

I'm "hostile" because I punctured your myth about the workaholic CEO????

That's a hoot!

I don't often give much credit to Dubya,
But even though I severely disagree with many of his policies, I gotta admit that he delegates authority well. (Unlike your poor overworked buddy.)

No, I don't have much sympathy for overworked CEOs.
In fact, I consider it a sign of their own incompetent managerial style.
Tough bananas for them.

[GGpaX4DumpedTea]

"For that reason, engineering salaries go up."

Engineering salaries go up (or not) based on supply and demand, to a great extent. It has been competition between companies in years past for available engineers that determined starting salaries. And it has been supply and demand in the market for experienced engineers that has affected salaries of engineers in later years, after graduation.

Another effect on engineering salaries is promotion and promotability. Engineers deemed promotable into management positions may fare better salary-wise prior to promotion.

It is not uncommon for engineers in industry to make less than union employees in the plant in which both work. One factor of course is overtime. Union employees receive overtime pay and engineers (exempt) generally do not, though they may put in much more than a 40 hour week.

[Radioactive]

What could be a blessing in disguise is that the FORD FOUNDATION, which was co-opted into a liberal golden egg layer, will hopefully be used to help out the company.

Then the liberals who have taken over the Ford foundation can go straight to the unemployment line

[meyer]

So who is responsible for the lowest bidder policy?

The customer if they accept it.

[RnMomof7]

Dat wrote: If it weren't for unions you wouldn't have $50 000 SUVs .

yea well how much has GM cut their car prices now that most of the car is assembled for a few pesos a day?

When the bottom falls out of real estate people are going to be left with huge morgages that have a market value that does not cover them..

[ffusco]

That's an artificial pressure on the wage structure. By Unions) setting a ceiling to a higher level they raise all other floors.

[ffusco]

"CEO be able to demand $1 million or more a year and it's okay but a union worker shouldn't ask for $30,000 a year?"

Salaries are based on their value added to a company, not the amount of effort put in.
OTOH a CEO's base pay should be more modest with bonuses tied to profitability.

[FITZ]

But if cars as as bad as they say and companies are not being run efficiently ---and costs are extremely high in spite of very low labor costs now, then you have to blame the CEO---they are way overpaid for what they're doing. Back when CEOs were doing their job at all well, you could buy and all-American made car for $5000. Now with half the parts made by workers making $0.30 an hour they're costing $30,000 ----something is wrong with that.

[FITZ]

I think people are being very easily fooled ---they think a $30,000-50,000 car is a great deal ---they're told that because labor costs are so much cheaper now they're coming out ahead ---they completely don't realize how cheap a car was not so long ago, all-American labor too.

Same with houses ---they've been convinced illegals are keeping housing prices way down ---but houses have never been more expensive. The exact same house my dad bought in the 50's for $15,000 now sells for over $100,000 ---the exact same house!!! It was all-American built so was built very well ---but still ---no important materials or work have been added and it costs many times more than it originally did.

[Rate_Determining_Step]

I've been worried about the big three for a while.

GM has HUGE issues with pensions. See Fortune article

Unfortunately, all automakers have suffered from an inability for the industry to negotiate with labor. They pick off automakers one at a time and now they're all very weak - to the point where they might not be able to meet obligations they unwisely made over the last few decades.

Couple that with customers who will not pay premiums, demand incentives and low interest rates and you don't have much left.

Call me selfish, but I won't spend an extra $3000 for a GM car for the workers who built Chevy Citations of the 80s. GMAC which was once the saving grace of GM is now being asked to subsidize purchases with non performing loans on new GM cars to move them out at sale prices. Who doesn't buy a GM or Ford on sale anymore? Doubt many other will as well. Ever wonder how car making died in England? For generations, the English were big players in cars. Not no more. Pensions and labor stife killed some of the most innovative car companies the world has seen. Don't think it can't happen here.

And that's just the numbers. Now on to the cars. GM - very little exciting.

Ford? The redesigned Taurus in 2000 really killed the car. It was a great car with the Yamaha engines (SHO), but was always a pedesterian car otherwise. Can't believe the Contour ever sold. I know two guys with nearly identical ones - they both hate them, call them "disposable" and don't give them much love.

Dodge has some of the best cars I'd buy. I love the 300M and the Sebring. But I've heard that DC has money problems as well.

Nissan has some great products but their Infinity brand (which has even better products) has a hard time in the market never fully recovered from that disasterous ad campaign that coincided with it's introduction. I don't know how they're doing money-wise, but they have some fine cars (350Z, Maxima, G35).

Toyota isn't called "Toyota Bank" for nothing. Hugely profitable and with a slew of reliable cars, this automaker is the envy of everyone. With piles of ready cash, great products and a brand reputation second to none, they seem poised to continue to go on to rule the world. Their Lexus brand is amazing.

BMW is still smarting from their Rover debacle. They will be able to sell every Mini that they can make and import however. They should take a page from Mazda's brilliant positioning of the Miata for over a decade.

Note, Peugeot is the #2 automaker in Europe. Rumors circulate every couple of years about them coming back to the US market, but they don't have anything like a dealer network. Watch Renault - they have a controlling (although minority) stake in Nissan - a trusted, competent dealer network. You might be able to buy a Renault in a couple of years at a Nissan or Infinity dealer.

Nobody will buy Fiat. The big players have already passed (Peugeot, Ford). GM has a stake, but probably not the cash. Toyota is probably too cautious. Some exquisite names will be up for sale: Ferrari, Maserati and Alfa Romeo.

None of this factors in Trucks/SUVs which make up a huge percentage of the US market. The Durangos, Blazers, Jeeps and Explorers have been a huge saving grace for Detroit with lots of profit and usually optioned up. Get rid of SUVs and you shut Detroit down - that's a fact.

If I were to buy a car tomorrow it would be: Lexus IS300

[RnMomof7]

My kids just bought a new house 200,000 + all the upgraqdes

15000 square feet , no dining room ,3 bedrooms ,no landscaping. It is a mid priced home

I am so concerned that when the market caves in they will be left holding a home that as you say 25 or 30 years ago would have been $25,000 tops..

As for cars..I have ben told by someone that knows the "labor" cost to a new car is less than 15% .......so lets figure out where the other 30,000 goes :>)

[al_c]

15000 sq feet for $200,000?! They got a bargain!!! ;o)

[FITZ]

I know someone who had to foreclose on a house ---I guess it isn't so bad ---the house was overpriced and they thought they could ask what they paid for it --but since they were in it less than 5 years, they hadn't really paid anything toward the house, their payments were only going toward the interest. They quickly got their credit back, apparently that's fairly easy to repair as long as you have a job. Maybe it's the investors who will be shafted.

[RnMomof7]

15000 sq feet for $200,000?! They got a bargain!!! ;o)

LOL If I had false teeth they would have fallen out..and get this we are not talking about California's bloated market ..we are talking about a small town in Michigan..

My son in Texas has 35000 sq feet and they paid in the 150's a few years ago..

The real estate market is going to bottom out at some point..I am very frightened for them..But I will be a good mom and smile and say it is "wonderful"

[RnMomof7]

imagine a market full of those houses..banks will be in real trouble

[al_c]

Are you sure about that sq footage? 15000 and 35000? If so, they both got major bargains. Those prices sound like 1500 and 3500 sq ft homes.

[ffusco]

My 2001 F-150 was a steal at $8995.00.

[newgeezer]

In the recession that began in 2000, and was delayed through 2002 in the automotive industry by aggressive "zero percent financing" deals and very low interest rates, the eventual sales downturn is likely to be severe, perhaps as severe as in 1978-82.

On the upside, this should give the used-car market a chance to rebound. Since the mfrs. have been selling their new ones so aggressively, used car prices have been weak.