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Djindjic & His Serbia- The Man and the Country He Left Behind
NRO ^ | 3/12/03 | Damjan de Krnjevic-Miskovic

Posted on 03/13/2003 8:05:11 AM PST by William McKinley

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To: joan
This version of the story is strange too.

Correct. That's why I posted it. They are making things up as they go along -- hoping to find the "most plausable" concoction, rgeradless if it has any truth in it. <p. You have to understand that you are dealing with a government on the loose -- and it doesn't matter if it's a Miloshevich Socialists government or Djindjich's "Democrats." The idea of what the government is all about (to rule, not to serve) transcends all political though in Serbia. The only thing that is different is the label, not the substance.

41 posted on 03/14/2003 2:06:41 PM PST by kosta50
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To: Tamodaleko; joan; kosta50; downunder; DTA; FireWall
This is not Legiya`s house!

This building belongs to his best friend and the leader and finacier of the Zemun group,Dragan Spasojevich.It is a business centre,built without permission!

"I am Legiya,I am a God!" Legiya was shouting while he was disarming the police patrol tyhat arrived to interviene during his last escapade in one of the elite Belgrade`s restaurants!

The event was a birthday party of Ceca Raznjatovich,late Arkan`s wife.

And,we all know that Gods and their friends don`t need building permissions for their "temples"!;

42 posted on 03/14/2003 2:15:29 PM PST by branicap
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To: kosta50; joan; Tamodaleko; downunder; FireWall; vooch
Del Ponte to attend funeral against Svilanovic’s advice | 10:33 | B92

BELGRADE -- Friday – The Hague’s chief prosecutor, Carla Del Ponte, has made a personal decision to fly to Belgrade to attend Prime Minister Djindjic’s funeral.

Federal Foreign Minister Goran Svilanovic yesterday told B92 that he had tried to discourage The Hague official from making the trip.

Svilanovic said: "We remain resolute in carrying out the duties we have towards the victims, and to the highest ethical values, as well as fulfil our international obligations. However, it is her decision after all. I told her my opinion the way I did, but I think that anything more than that would go beyond good taste".

Now,if anyone has accelerated Djindjic`s execution,that was this horrible inconsiderate sorry excuse for a jurist!

And,she has no sense of decency!She is imposing herself on a private grief of Djindjic family and wants to attend a funeral,against the advice of Foreign Minister!?

And,Svilanovich,that spineless p***k,didn`t have a guts to tell her that for this occasion, she is "persona non grata"!

I only hope that Zoran`s wife or mother would give her a slapp on the face if she comes!That would be the day!

Where is that sniper now???

43 posted on 03/14/2003 2:23:49 PM PST by branicap
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To: Tamodaleko; joan; branicap; downunder
Currently watching on B92-TV LIVE demolition of Legiya's house in Zemun

Serbia's "Democrats" at their best -- no doubt! Finally they have an excuse to dispense with nicities and shed that fake "we are Europe" and "rule of law" cloak. After all, they are homo balcanicus, except that some of these apes pretend to be human.

Dushan Mihailovich says that the state will "liquidate all those who resist arrest."

Djindjich's assassination has shown that it makes no difference what label the government there carries -- it's all the same, regardless if it is communist, or not.

In the West, the ideal they pretend to emulate, illegal buildings are handled through courts, and resisting arrest carries a harsher penalty, but resisting arrest is not an excsue for execution.

I think this is actually good for Serbia. The collaborationist scum is in terror, and is overreacting to their detriment. It won't be long before the people get sick of these emergency measures and panick-stricken Djindjich cronies executing people on the spot for minor offenses, and turn on the rest of the dung he left behind.

44 posted on 03/14/2003 2:24:49 PM PST by kosta50
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To: branicap; joan; Tamodaleko; downunder; FireWall; vooch
To me this only means that they had a "special relationship," and that Djindjich's worth was in it -- despite Carla's superficial displeasure with his lack of cooperation. There is every reason to believe that, once he rid himself of Koshtunitsa, Carla did her part in helping him get rid of Sheshel' by indicting him -- thereby leaving no real political rival for Djindjich to worry about. The connection is glaringly obvious to anyone except the dumb and the naive; a typical symbiotic relationship.

I don't share the view that there is anyting to pitty about Djindjich. To me his was only one thing: collaborationist scum, another Nedich, another Milosh Obrenovich, ready to deliver anyone's head on the platter.

One more thing: don't be naive and assume that Carla is coming to pay "respect" to some small-time lackey. She is coming to remind his successor of his obligations to the Empire lest he forget. She is coming to lay down the law for Zharko Korach and the rest of the DOS dung, just in case some of them are wavering while paying lip service to Zoran's legacy and the Imperial Court. They will be on mega doses of imodium to halt those lose bowell mass movements, while making sure the eyes are fixed on the roofs and not on Djindjich.

45 posted on 03/14/2003 2:43:14 PM PST by kosta50
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To: kosta50
The biggest difference between this government and the Milosevic government is that this government has control of the entire media. They have also gone the western approach to news conferences, smooth and slick but no substance, compared with Milosevic's crude low-tech method.

Do you laugh every time you see the DOS news conference and the set up is an identical copy of the white house backdrop.
46 posted on 03/14/2003 2:53:40 PM PST by downunder
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To: kosta50; branicap; downunder
She is coming to remind his successor of his obligations to the Empire lest he forget

DOS candidates for Djindjic's successor right now are all in the
I hear the Gov. is pushing Zhivkovich, thinking he's got the most balls to take over?

47 posted on 03/14/2003 3:20:35 PM PST by Tamodaleko
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To: Tamodaleko; branicap; joan; downunder; Voronin; DTA; Destro; wonders; smokegenerator
Cute! Can you get that thing to flush?

Korach has the most balls? Doubt it. He is probably the most collabroationist of them all, judging from his previous affiliations. He was one of the strongest supporters of sending Miloshevich to the Hague right after October 2000, when everyone was still pretending that it was "uncertain," so I am sure the Empire's All Seeing Eye caught glimpse of this nerdy creature as a useful potetial servant. I would not be surprized if the choice for Korach had actually been made in Washington.

48 posted on 03/14/2003 3:36:32 PM PST by kosta50
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To: downunder; Tamodaleko; branicap
...the DOS news conference and the set up is an identical copy of the white house backdrop...

Like I said before, they are not just imitators, they are bad imitators. Fools is the proper term. The are playing sharades. Pretending to be something they are not. Make believe. Like little kids playing cowboys and Indians and expecting the world to take them seriously. If they only knew how little the world pays attention to what they do, unless they genuflex and send someome to the Imperial Court in the Hague.

49 posted on 03/14/2003 3:42:18 PM PST by kosta50
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To: Destro
the damage now being done by paras once trained by NATO to do their dirty work against Slobo.

What paras trained by NATO??

Explain,please,Des.

50 posted on 03/14/2003 4:03:51 PM PST by branicap
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To: branicap; Tamodaleko; joan
A personal note...

As of late, Djindjich had taken a turn in his political direction. He was beginning to sound more like a "nationalist" than ever before and certainly than any of his DOS buddies. Clearly, he realized that eliminating competition (Koshtunitsa, Sheshel', even Miloshevich) was not enough to win the hearts and minds of Serbs.

He was keenly aware that when he turned over Miloshevich to the Hague his popularity was barely 5.5% in 2001. With nationalist competition eliminated, sold out and tricked, the road to becoming a great Serb leader was clearly in his vision. So, his politics turned natioanlist -- demanding a resolution of the Kosovo status and threatening to undermine the Dayton Agreement if Kosovo is granted independence. He started to visit the construction of the St. Sava's Temple, the largest Eastern Orthodox Cathedral in the world in the final stages of completion that took almost a century to build, over many political and other obstacles.

He began to call on the Serb tradition, the only true Serb identity, which is plenty rich in culture and art to be a fertile inspiration for the genrations to come and the spiritual food for the rebirth of the genuine Serb national identity.

All one has to do is listen to this Opelo (Requiem) and realize that barbarism of modern Serbia is not at the root of my noble roots. This Requiem is like the most beautiful opera, and it compliments the works of Serbs in literary as well as other arts and archiechture, medicine, scholastics, law...

Djindich, who was a very intelligent man (unfortunately lacking a matching character befitting his intellect), realized that the only way Serbs will ever be a nation again, as I hitend earlier in this post (#16), is to look at themelves. Unfortunately, most don't know even where to look.

Ironically, and for his own political gain, only a few weeks ago he visited the construction site at St. Sava's Temple and said the following words (Vechernye novosti, March 14, 2003):

"...a great deal of our national work remains unfinished...Our status as a state is unclear, our internal order incomplete, our borders uncharted. Again we are a society at a crossroads, but every time when we don't know where to go, we need to turn to our roots..."[my emphasis]

Add to that the last paragraph of my post #16. Amen.

51 posted on 03/14/2003 4:28:49 PM PST by kosta50
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To: *balkans; branicap; Tamodaleko; joan
An interesting view by a well-known writer.
52 posted on 03/14/2003 4:35:46 PM PST by kosta50
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To: kosta50
Kosta, could you post that link again?
53 posted on 03/14/2003 5:22:14 PM PST by Tamodaleko
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To: Tamodaleko
Sorry, extra pair of quotes snuck in...here's the the source. Tried and tested.
54 posted on 03/14/2003 5:57:22 PM PST by kosta50
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To: kosta50; Banat
Thanks Kosta.

Btw re: #47, Zharko Korach is from "Social Democratic Union" party. The agreement within DOS is that "Democratic" Party (DS) will have the "Premier" position. DS will announce Dj.'s replacement Sunday.

Banat, where are you???
55 posted on 03/14/2003 7:00:08 PM PST by Tamodaleko
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To: kosta50; Tamodaleko; joan; DTA
But,in the other hand,Djindjich had put himself between the rock and a hard place:the moment he sold Milosevich to Hague,he was doomed!Hague demanded more and more,and more....remember the rebellion of the Red Berets last year

I believe that Djindjich is a colateral damage of the brutal Western policy against Serbia.It is beyond belief thast some people in the West thought that some people,so deeply involved in organized crime and state politics,and so well armed and with so much to lose,will go peacefully to jail???>p>

Sam Vaknin is a very clever man and his column in Central Europe Online is something I read with pleasure!

But,as you can see from the quote above,I was the first who accused West for Djindjich`s assassination!!!

(Ovations in the background!!!!)LOL!

Should I sue???Any lawers on the site?LOL

56 posted on 03/14/2003 7:23:09 PM PST by branicap
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To: joan; kosta50; DTA; FireWall; Tamodaleko; Destro; vooch; Voronin; DestroyEraseImprove; Gael
No 35

Joan,you`re right when you point out some inconsistencies in various descriptions of this assassination.

I am,for various reasons,well informed/trained in this subject (weapons,ammo,sniping,bulett wounds) so,from the very beggining some reports were very,very strange and,outright stupid!

I didn`t want to post about them before I find out some first hand informations.

I had that misfortune to see some people being shot by the same caliber buletts,and,also to treat many of them after being wounded!So,the first information that Djindjich was shot by two buletts of "large caliber"and,especially,the drawing that was supplied was uterly impossible,and here is why:

7,9x53 Mauser was a standard Yugo Army caliber.It is a very powerfull catrige with very good balistics for the long range sniping(up to 700-800m).When I heard "two shots" I immediately thought that, eather the shooter used Yugoslav semiautomatic(selfloading) M-76 rifle or,there were two shooters!But,knowing the behiaviour of the human body hit with that bullet(you go down like sack of potatoes!!)to achieve a "double tap" and hit a falling target twice is ...a miracle!?No way!

That means ,two shooters,shooting at the exactly same time!Highly improbbable!

And,we have a bodyguard wounded,also?So,two shots,two targets hit,but ..3 wounds????

Doesn`t add up,does it?

Some other "experts" suggested that Djindjich was "shot with a 50 (12,7mm) caliber sniping rifle with armour pearcing bullets(!) in order to "penetrate his Kevlar west!"God,save us all from such experts!

I loughed at this because:

Yugo Army has in her arsenal and Legia`s unit to,3 different kinds of this rifle that I know of:US Barret rifle;French McMillan and Yugoslav "Black Arrow".Thes e weapons are not used for close sniping(!) because they are not accurate under distances shorter of 400m!Therefore,for this range(85-90m)is not exactly the first choice,unless they wanted to kill Djindjich in his car!So,that theory was rubish!

When I read that the rifle was good old Zastava M-69 ,the things became ,even more complicated and official statement(first one) more implausible/

I happen to own this particular rifle,inheritance from my father,and use to shoot with her many times(target shooting,OK,no wrong ideas)!Wonderfull rifle but,it is a bolt action rifle,and,if it was a single shooter,there was no way that he could shoot Djindjich TWICE so quickly!Remember JFK movie and Kevin Costner trying to reload as fast as he could to test the theory of Osvald being the sole shooter??!

Never mind,something was very wrong with the first statements!

Second;the police had reported that in the room they found"a chair and a blanket".Both things make sense if the shooters had entered the building a night before and were waiting for Djindjich to come in the morning.Blanket on the sill,Joan,is an old trick to stabilise the weapon on the hard surface.Reduces recoil.That`s why shooters in the open often use rolled blanket or a small sandbag as a rifle support.

So,everything ,so far is professional,appart from one odd thing:three guys left the building carrying openly guns and rifle,and,attracting attention???Usualy,you leave the weapon and escape(slowly!).

About the ropes:it was a hoax!The reporters had picked up on the histerycal statements of some people who had mistaken a coil of telephone cable that one of the shooters,allegedly,had in his hands!

There is ,also,one more strange thing:three men,allegedly,were seen entering the building,dressed in dark boiler suits(builders/telephone engeniers...)but,no weapons were seen?So many inaccuracies!

Medical part:

I was pissed off by inaccurate reports and silly descriptions of the wounds,so I called a colleague from The Belgrade Klinical Centre.I managed to talk to him,briefly,but he didn`t want to talk,so I suggested to make my own version of report and e-mail him for confirmation.Done!

So,this is what happened:Djindjich was shot ONCE bellow the left shoulder blade(in the back)from the hight of app. 20 m.That means that the trajectory of the bullet was about 50-60 degrees downwards.The bullet was traveling from left shoulder blade towards right hip!Penetrated middle of the left lung,right ventricle of the heart,diaphragm and medial part(inner) of the liver.Spleen was ruptured to,because of the massive kinetic shock caused by a bullet.Each one of these injuries was fatal in its own right!

But,Djindjich had diet because of the cardiac tamponade(sudden,massive bleeding in tha pericardial sack).He was dead within 20-30 seconds!

He was DOA and,if it wasn`t him,no doctor would venture further than a reanimation.No point!But,because it was a Prime Minister,they had to try.Very understandible but futile.So,he wasnt shot "between the chest and abdomen" that kind of injury doesn`t egzist.

The bodyguard was shot much lower above the pubic bone,sustained ruptured bladder and pelvis fracture,which is,also,very dangerous and very often ,fatal injury!He is stable,but,with his kind of wound and ruptured bladder(urin all over the abdomen) he can still die from complications!I prey for him!

The return e-mail from Belgrade was "Bingo!",so,this description is,more or less,accurate!

And,finally,why are these people demolishing this building!!They should have siezed all their assets,and open a library/health center/nursery/,you name it there!Instead,what?

What`s the use?They gained nothing.That bulding was worth $1,5-2 million.They could have sold it and put the money to the good cause.

Now,it`s a pile of bricks!

Sorry for taking so much of your time!

57 posted on 03/14/2003 8:52:24 PM PST by branicap
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To: branicap; Tamodaleko; joan
Yes, Sam is a worthy writer, which is not something one can say for B92 sources. Take for instance this one.

The first paragraph screams stuuupid! "There he was, Serbia's first democratically elected prime minister." My God, where did this dame come from? First democratically elected...???? The lady is cluless, but useful. She represents a big newspaper (whose motto is "All the News that's fit to print"), and therby of the big establishment. But then B92 owes its graces to the willingness to serve just as Djindjich and his rot were/are because they have no choice.

Right now the DOS has thrown Serbia into a police state, whose top policeman cleary says "those who resist arrest will be liquidated. This is unbelieveable! The US suffered a 9/11 attack, with over 3,000 people killed and no one dared initiate repressive police state where citizens can be jailed without charges, political parties prevented from activity, and people "liquidated" if they "resist" arrest. This is Fascism. Serbia is now a fascist state.

Why are Serbs not int he streets demanding that DOS pack up and leave? Do you know how stupid the DOS is? Let me tell you. This is what they called "legitimization" for demolishing of the "Mafia Palace:" "According to the Law Belgrade City Assembly informed that the illegitimate commerical center in Schiller Street occupies 2,087.42 square meters. The object [i.e the building I suppose] was removed (sic) on the basis of the Resolution of Execution [??] and the Conclusion about the permission for execution of the City Secretariat for the Property Jurisprudence and Architectural Affairs [goodnes!]. All the decision were made also in agreement with the Law of Construction of Objects as well as the Law on General Regulatory Proceedures." Does that make the "legitimization" any clearer? Next time, bring really deep boots -- it looks like the DOS sewers are backing up and all of Serbia is begining to stink to high heaven!

58 posted on 03/14/2003 8:52:46 PM PST by kosta50
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To: kosta50
There he was, Serbia's first democratically elected prime minister, talking away, telephone in one hand and remote control in the other.

Jesus!This is a proof that Djindjich was a DEMOCRAT!Mobile in one hand and remote control in another!How modern!How cool!How pro-Western!!!

Unlike that Commie thug,Miloshevich,Cuban cigar in one hand and glass of Chivass in another!

LOOL

I need a rest from all this crap!

One JD is in order!

Cheers!

BTW,laptop in my lap,and John Daniels in the hand...what am I then?

59 posted on 03/14/2003 9:02:29 PM PST by branicap
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To: kosta50; branicap; joan
re: post#51

"He was beginning to sound more like a "nationalist" than ever before and certainly than any of his DOS buddies. Clearly, he realized that eliminating competition (Koshtunitsa, Sheshel', even Miloshevich) was not enough to win the hearts and minds of Serbs."

Kosta you have nailed my thoughts exactly. It was a political trick the way Djindjic "suddenly" turned "Nationalist". I wonder whether he was actually thinking about running in the next election for prime minister in May? Thanks for the great posts and it applies to Branicap and Joan.

60 posted on 03/15/2003 3:22:26 AM PST by downunder
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