Posted on 03/08/2003 9:29:27 AM PST by forest
Shazzam. Not that OrthodoxPresbyterian believes simulated child pornography is a good thing. It is a most horrible thing he zealously defends that he does not support. 267 -KC- __________________________________
It galls me to see pitiful little cowards lie. 280 posted on 03/10/2003 2:23 PM PST by tpaine
Beyond HumanaeVitae's (rather impolite) habit of failing to flag me to a Post in which my position is represented (or rather, misrepresented)...
You know what really galls me?
It galls me that a God-forsaking Atheist like "tpaine" has more concern for basic Honesty than so-called "professing Christians".
"HumanaeVitae" of course knows my position on actual child pornography. My position on Child Pornography, like my position on "snuff films" or bloody knives found in OJ's garbage, is that it constitutes evidence of a crime and so must be surrendered to the Magistrate for Prosecution.
So, "HumanaeVitae" instead raises the red herring of "simulated child pornography" -- in other words, fabricating imaginary dirty pictures.
As far as that is concerned, "HumanaeVitae" knows my position as well -- if you are so intent on fabricating dirty pictures, "HumanaeVitae", you can draw all the dirty pictures you want... your Private Property is your Own. At the same time, however, the Community has the right to assert Control over Public Commons... in other words, you cannot breed unruly Oxen, or rabid Attack Dogs, which rampage throughout the Public Commons; and neither may you broadcast your fascination for "simulated Child Pornography" (i.e., artifical dirty pictures) into the Public Commons.
In short, your Private license to fabricate your own imaginary dirty pictures ("simulated child pornography") amounts to a Private right to display them facing a solid brick wall.
You do not enjoy the Right to rampage the Public Commons.
But it would not serve "HumanaeVitae"s purpose to assert, "OrthodoxPresbyterian believes that the State should not apply the Threat of the Death Penalty if you display imaginary dirty pictures towards a solid brick wall!!"
That would not serve his purpose -- it would only make him look foolish. "The State should not apply the Threat of the Death Penalty if you display imaginary dirty pictures towards a solid brick wall!!" Well, yeah, Beavis; no kidding.
Instead, he must resort to implied falsehoods.
It's all he has.
It's all he's ever had.
He's basically just another Decalogue-hating Moral Relativist.
But of course he can't.
I've asked him FIVE times now.
The truth is, he HATES the idea of a Morally-Absolute standard applied to the Power of Caesar. He despises the notion of Biblical Law as a constraint upon the Power of the State.
Like any Moral Relativist, his only Law is the Law of Self-Will.
Well, you may perhaps believe that "in following that Golden Rule, others will do the same, unto me", but it's obviously not a guaranteed thing -- as I have myself just violated the Golden Rule in your Regard.
I apologize for calling you a "God-forsaking Atheist". That was presumptuous of me, no excuses.
I'll leave you with this thought:
This is NOT what you would expect from some nondescript, martyred provincial Rabbi whose followers thought He was just a Great Guy. At least Mohammed has a better claim to Fame... he butchered tens of thousands and enslaved an entire sub-Continent before he went to meet his "reward" (be that as it may). That's history-making, baby!!
So who is this Jesus Freak, and who made him God? What's so great about walking around for a coupla years saying "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life", and getting nailed to a two-by-four for His troubles? And what's this business about leaving His Grave behind, empty? Didn't the Man have the good sense to stay dead when He showed He wasn't wanted?
And yet....
There is a gaping black hole in the average Atheist's historiography labelled, 33AD. None of the proposed "explanations" cut the mustard. The proposed rationalizations are altogether insufficient to rationally explain the resultant 2000 years of Human history.
And I ain't preaching this to win the "kudos" of so-called "christians" like "KevinCurry" or "HumanaeVitae". These so-called "christians" wouldn't bother to stop by the wayside and preach Christ and Him Crucified anyway. I couldn't care less for their opinions; I already regard your ETHICS to be more "Christ-like" than theirs, one Neighbor to Another. I wouldn't break down your door and put a gun to your head, and I know that neither would you. Let the Caesar-worshippers do as they will, I respect that whole "Love thy Neighbor as thyself" thang.
I'm just talking about that Jesus guy himself.
I'm preaching this as a simple Appeal to your Rationality.
What the heck happened? What say you?
After 66 years, I urge you... leave no stone unturned.
Even the "fantastic" ones... like the idea of a Man getting up from His grave, and walking out. Just because he actually happened to be the Son of God... and who woulda thunk it, after walking around for a coupla years saying "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life", and getting nailed to a two-by-four for His troubles.
At least if Multiple, Juridically-examined Eyewitness testimony and vastly superior documentation to Julius Caesar's "Gallic Wars" counts for jackety-squat.
Because after 2,000 years, His grave is still empty.
One good-faith Neighbor to another.
God bless and keep you, Tpaine.
And make His face to shine upon you.
In the next breathe / post, they'll scream, in unison, that man is inherently good, everyone should just mind their own business, and there shouldn't be any laws, prohibitions, rules ... but the ones THEY think are " okay ".
Only children and adolescents " think " this way.
Good response, OP.
Are you the one who (last year?) posted the chart with the various documents of antiquity, number of extant copies, etc., compared with that for the NT?
If so, would you post again? Thanks.
Wouldn't want "KevinCurry" and "HumanaeVitae" to think I was talking about them behind their backs.
Did you get kicked out of bed for snoring again? ;>
The " code word " statist is much overused ( much like racist ), and is therefore meaningless; especially when you use it.
For someone, who has loudly and long, proclaimed here, that he is delighted to take the people's money, who disagree with him,in Social Security benefits, you are the LAST person, dear, who should attempt to call others " socialists ". :-)
BTW, I am neither a manic-depressive, nor delusional; unlike you. LOL
It's just the Gospel, man. It's my moral duty to preach it. The Grave is still empty.
But when you shut your door -- I won't barge in to your Private Property to preach it.
Posted by xzins to OrthodoxPresbyterian
Good response, OP. Are you the one who (last year?) posted the chart with the various documents of antiquity, number of extant copies, etc., compared with that for the NT? If so, would you post again? Thanks.
Well, being a Presbyterian, it was either that or post a critical run-down of my favorite German Lagers. (grin)
Yeah, that was me. Here you go.
In considering the New Testament we have tens of thousands of manuscripts of the New Testament in part or in whole dating from the second century A.D. to the late fifteenth century when the printing press was invented. These manuscripts have been found in Egypt, Palestine, Syria, Turkey, Greece, and Italy, making collusion unlikely. The oldest manuscript, the John Rylands manuscript has been dated to 125 A.D. and was found in Egypt, some distance from where the New Testament was originally composed (Asia Minor). Many early Christian papyri were discovered in 1935, which have been dated to 150 A.D., and include the four gospels. The Papyrus Bodmer II, discovered in 1956, has been dated to 200 A.D. and contains 14 chapters and portions of the last seven chapters of the gospel of John. The Chester Beatty biblical papyri, discovered in 1931, has been dated to 200-250 A.D. and contains the Gospels, Acts, Paul's Epistles, and Revelation. The number of manuscripts is extensive compared to other ancient historical writings, such as Caesar's "Gallic Wars" (10 Greek manuscripts, the earliest 950 years after the original), the "Annals" of Tacitus (2 manuscripts, the earliest 950 years after the original), Livy (20 manuscripts, the earliest 350 years after the original), and Plato (7 manuscripts).
|
Author |
Written |
Earliest Copy |
Time Span |
# Mss. |
| Caesar |
100-44 B.C. |
900 A.D. |
1,000 yrs |
10 |
| Plato |
427-347 B.C. |
900 A.D. |
1,200 yrs |
7 |
| Thucydides |
460-400 B.C. |
900 A.D. |
1,300 yrs |
8 |
| Tacitus |
100 A.D. |
1100 A.D. |
1,000 yrs |
20 |
| Suetonius |
75-160 A.D. |
950 A.D. |
800 yrs |
8 |
| Homer (Iliad) |
900 B.C. |
400 B.C. |
500 yrs |
643 |
| New Testament |
40-100 A.D. |
125 A.D. |
25-50 yrs |
24,000 |
Can you freep me the html on the write-up and chart? I'd appreciate it. X.
Tacitus in particular is an incredible Writer.
John Adams personally considered Tacitus to be the strongest writer in the History of the World. This is not necessarily idolatry. If God could grace Solomon with Logic, it is certainly within His power to grace Tacitus with Rhetoric. And the Bible is not intended as a display of raw rhetorical Power (though it is, in places).
At any rate, John Adams is entitled to his opinion. Personally -- I confess that I am not entirely unsympathetic to Adams' review.
And yet I have never heard a single Classicist dispute one word of Tacitus as "fabricated" and "interpolated" -- despite having only 20 manuscripts, fully 1,000 years after the fact.
So it goes...
I am not dishonest; you just don't like it when facts are posted. How is it " dishonest " to say what is fact ? How can you say that " every FR libertarian posting on this thread supports our constitutional rule of law ? I realize that you modified that by adding imo; however, it IS C-O-N-S-T-U-T-I-O-N-A-L to have the death penalty, fight war ( and Jefferson dod NOT get a Congressional declaration of war against the Barbary Pirates ! ), and many other things, which FR's L/libertarians rail against and you know it !
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