The Art Education Problem

ART Renewal Center ^ | FR Post 3-7-03 | Don Gray

[u-89]

I am always kind of amazed at the peristent leftism of the art community. For a segment of society that should prize free expression, they rarely fail to embrace a political philosophy that demands authoritarianism and regulation.

To the left in general they seem to be in denile about the totalitarian aspects of socialism. In some cases it is lack of thought, they fail to think through actions to results, they just focus on good intentions. But more direct to your point one would think that artists by temperment would be libertarians and not socialists. But then some look to government for subsidy as the free market can be harsh on one's dreams and aspirations.

[u-89]

Your response was to my post #6 but look to my post #12 and you will see that we are of similar thought. The politicization of art led to the celebration of the deviant and the highlighting of societal "injustices" and pretty pictures to not convey the message hence harsh and shocking depictions. Of course the overall academic trouncing of standard's has led to technical deficiencies becoming acceptable.

[Betty Jane]

Slightly different perspective. I'm not an artist; I can't draw my way out of a paper bag. But I do know what I like.

My husband's large employer is selling several of its buildings and all of the property inside. This includes the artwork. There are many prints and about 75 original pieces. Prints are $35.00, originals are going for 10% over original buy price in 1998, from $150- $25,000.

I was looking over some of them and picked out 9 prints but don't know any of the original artists. The strange thing is the things that I hate had some very large price tags and I just don't get it. I liked several of the more modestly priced items. Is there any where on the web where you can info about new artists?

[u-89]

Rothko's work was not about technical skill, it is concept. That's the point is whether it's Rothko, Morris Louis, Pollack or any other abstract painter. The general public understands painting in the terms of photo realism i.e. the closer a painting looks like a photograph of a person, a basket of fruit, etc. the "better" the art. This one dimentional understanding leads to disapproval of abstraction. Look at it this way - people travel out of their way to see autumn landscapes but when the same mixing and spilling of color is on a canvas they are offended. Why? because they read the color as something tangible in a landscape - it's trees even though they are marveling at the colors. What is failed to be recognized is the appreciation of color interaction in its own right so when taken out of its natural environment they do not understand what they are seeing or rrealize how they loved it all along.

[vannrox]

If you want to determine the worth of "Fine Art" go to The Art Renewal Center.

Modern Art is another issue all together. I would suggest The Gagosian Gallery. They are famous for selling splatter art on canvis for $3 million.

[vannrox]

Examples of Nazi Art:



You might want to go HERE.

[tangerine]

It is expressive of our times. One has only to look at FR as an art form to see all the same, headline after headline, page after page, one statement after another when all taken as a whole. A different format, but the same.

Compare that to the journalism and discussion one might have heard in public 50 years ago - 200 years ago - 1000. And which the public or private sponsors may have felt honored to pay for too.

[Dianna]

bookmarking

[Sam Cree]

Thanks, although I am not too interested in Nazi art, or propaganda art particularly, was just making a comment on it.

I have been paying some attention recently to the old masters, as well as some 19th century folks that seem pretty good to me, like Eakins, Whistler, Sargent, Turner, etc.

I wonder how many freepers there are who paint, either as amateurs or professionals.

[woofie]

I agree with you...I have a BFA and 30 years in the artworld. Im sure this crowd might throw a few rocks at what I do,but then everyone is an art critic. My father used to rail against "modern Art" and I would remind him that Picasso was older than he was .

[John Felix]

The art world was led down the road of 'anti elitism' hand in hand with the rise of Marist thought. This proletarian approach was engendered back in the late 19th century.
Later in the 20th century, with Marchel Duchamp and the Da Daists, Russian minimalists, and other reductive thinkers, all talent and technicl skill was drained from visual art.

What many are realizing is that there has been a great loss of technical skill in the visual arts. Also a new strain of aesthtic elitism has risen - the very thing it was born to reject.

[u-89]

And Picasso said: "I used to draw like Raphael but it has taken me a whole lifetime to learn to draw like a child."

Are you in commercial or fine arts? I'm a painter myself.

[vannrox]

I am trying to break into painting. Check out my paintings at HERE. There are three pages of paintings. My latest are on the later pages.

[Darksheare]

I know.
I'm just venting about the views of those in power in the art world.
In my area, I'm listed as the 'lone conservative' among my 'peers' in the art world. Those in 'power' sneer at me while those on my level respect my choice of philosophy and redfusal to prostitute my views. They still disagree with me and consider me a step above Belial, but they respect me.
Ironic, in a way.

Wish there was a way to get more conservatives into the art world.
The more of us there are, the harder the usurping of standards will be.

[woofie]

And Picasso said: "I used to draw like Raphael but it has taken me a whole lifetime to learn to draw like a child."

Great quote...

I sent you freep mail

[Yardstick]

There is a body of 20th Century Art that will be long remembered and admired. That of the Commercial Illustrators.

I think you're on to something. I was in the bookstore the other day looking at a big book full of Norman Rockwell paintings, and I was fighting back tears. A lot of his work has a sentimental angle, but that's not what got me... it was the raw power of his technique and his ability to compose, and the fact that he used his talent to create art that is a pure pleasure to behold. You mentioned Maxfield Parish, and it's the same way with him. These guys are almost supernaturally talented, but they serve the fruits of their talent to you on a silver platter for your pleasure. Their paintings seem like a service to the viewer, somehow -- it's the viewer's pleasure that's important -- and I appreciate that. In a way, the nature of being a commercial illustrator harkens back to the days when artists were commisioned to paint or sculpt by wealthy patrons. I think that aspect of hiredness is less likely to lead to the sort of silly narcissism that we see in a lot of modern art. Instead, it leads to images that are unabashedly resonant and beautiful.

[u-89]

I live just outside of New York and most of my artist friends have a dim view of the leftist/PC politicized work in the NY galleries or at the Whitney. They might not all be politically right wingers but they have a high sense of art so they don't groove on the currently silliness that permeates the scene. As a rule I don't get into politics with the art scene people that I don't know well but if the subject comes up it is easier being a libertarian. Just the name republican or conservative sets these people off and they never get past that to listen to what you say. Since I became a libertarian I found it makes discussion with these types more civil even though they disagree.

[Sam Cree]

I also agree in admiring many illustrators.

NC Wyeth, for one, years ago I bought a print of his to hang in my daughter's room, even now I never fail to admire the thing.

And the Tolkien illustrators, Alan Lee and John Howe are fabulously talented, IMO.

[Sam Cree]

My prof, over at the community college, where I am taking some art classes (figure drawing and painting) considers herself to be a libertarian, as I myself do (small L). I kind of see most of our founding fathers that way, too.

But she also loves the Clintons and the Democrats, she was the first person I met that considered libertarianism and socialism to be compatible, though apparently there are many like her. Clearly any philosphy such as libertarianism, which is based on individual freedom, must necessarily be totally opposed to the leftist doctrines, but I guess many cannot see this.

I figure that these people are attracted to the egalitarianism within leftist philosophy, not realizing that it is exactly that which requires it to be so suffocatingly authoritarian.

[u-89]

I figure that these people are attracted to the egalitarianism within leftist philosophy, not realizing that it is exactly that which requires it to be so suffocatingly authoritarian.

That's the way I see it though looking for a free ride can not be discounted either. Some feel art is so important that it should be government subsidized - that is they be guarenteed a living at doing what they like doing and not subjected to market forces. Years back some artist friends of mine and I went to Italy for a while to hang out and look at art. There is something in Rome called the American Academy I had never heard till I stumbled across it there. Basically the government pays artists to live in Rome and do their thing for a full year. My friends thought it was great. I said it would be if a patron of the arts set it up on with his own money but being tax dollar funded I could not support it - they thought I was nuts. All they could see was a free year in Rome.