Israeli Navy eyes 2 new Dolphin submarines from Germany

Ha'aretz Daily ^

[finnman69]

I was on a Dutch sub subs years ago in the Caribbean after a NATO exercise. 2nd in the Zwaardvis class, the Tijgerhaai (Tigershark) Pretty cool. Even looked through the periscope and had a Heineken on board....beer everywhere and I the guy who invited me on board was a huge Dolph Lundgren type of guy. They bragged about nailing one of our carriers in an exercise. The next night I scuba dived underneath it during a night dive off the pier.


Last I hear they are trying to sell it and others to Malaysia after a deal to sell them to the Egyptians fell through.

[Pharmboy]

I did not know that...thx.

[Long Cut]

"Israel's sea-based part of its nuclear triad."

These subs would not carry nuclear ordinance. They are SSK's...attack boats.

[Long Cut]

Believe it or not, most German-designed boats are built right here in the good 'ol USA, at Ingalls Shipbuilding, which has the license.

German subs are quite popular around the world. Efficient, quiet, advanced...and available with any optional gear like electronics, sonar, and engines the buyer wants.

[rmlew]

That isn't really fair.
The German navy acquited itself quite well in both world wars, considering that they were outnumber by more than 3 to 1.

[rmlew]

These subs would not carry nuclear ordinance. They are SSK's...attack boats.

They may not be able to carry SLBM's, but they can carry 21-inch cruise missles. SLNCM's.
The US navy used to have a nuclear Tomahawk. the IDF has a Popeye derivative. The Russians have the Sampson cruise missle which can be launched from the 650mm tubes. Of course no nation OFFICIALLY has these sub lancuhed nuclear cruise missles. Just like Israel is officiall not a nuclear power.

[rmlew]

Israel should look into the new 212 class with Air independent power systems. http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/type_212/

Here is an interesting take on the Dolphin: http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/dolphin/

[Rain-maker]

Israel Acquires First Nuclear-Capable Sub

August 1999 

Israel's new submarine arriving in port

The arrival at Haifa Naval Base last month of the Dolphin, the first of Israel's three new German-built submarines, is being heralded as the dawn of a new era for the Israeli navy. "The Dolphin is the first of three submarines," said Prime Minister Ehud Barak at the arrival ceremony. "Afterwards will come Levyatan and the Tekuma, and they will change the entire face of the navy and the long arm of Israel." Israel Defense Force (IDF) chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Shaul Mofaz, called the Dolphin the "submarine of the millennium."¹

The Dolphin and its two sisters ships (due to arrive over the next year) were constructed in Germany by Howaldtswerke-Deutsche Werft AG (HDW) and Thyssen Nordseewerke (TNSW) and will replace three 23-year old Gal-class submarines currently in use by the Israeli navy. The new ships are said to be among the most advanced diesal-electric submarines in the world. The 1,550-ton submarines have a top speed of 20 knots and can dive to a maximum depth of only 200 meters, but are extremely quiet and maneuverable. They have a maximum range of 3,000 miles, allowing them to move undetected into areas as far away as the Persian Gulf. Moreover, each sub and its 35-member crew can stay underwater for up to a month without resupply. They are armed with advanced Harpoon sea-to-sea missiles. Defense analysts consider the Israeli subs to be far superior to those in Arab navies.²

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The arrival of the Dolphin essentially transforms the Israeli navy from an auxiliary service operating primarily in support of land and air forces to an instrument of strategic deterrence.

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Far and away the most important feature of the new subs, however, is that they can be outfitted to launch small cruise missiles carrying nuclear weapons. This would give Israel a second-strike capability--if the country was attacked with nuclear weapons, cruise missiles aboard the Dolphin would remain intact and ready for retaliation. The arrival of the Dolphin essentially transforms the Israeli navy from an auxiliary service operating primarily in support of land and air forces to an instrument of strategic deterrence.

Assistant Defense Minister Yisrael Tal, well-known in Israel as the "father" of the Merkava tank, has long been one of the most prominent voices in the IDF pushing for this transformation. "Israel must turn the sea into a part of its defense depth," wrote Tal, a retired major-general, in a book published earlier this year. "The designation of the Navy must change - no longer an assistance branch, but a branch of strategic deterrence." When the Navy's armament plans met opposition from the top brass in the late 1980's, Tal chaired a committee which examined the issue and submitted an unequivocal recommendation to then defense minister Yitzhak Rabin for the purchase of advanced submarines.³

The contract with Germany was briefly canceled due to its hefty price tag ($300 million per submarine), but was reinstated after Iraq demonstrated Israel's vulnerability to missile strikes by firing 39 Scud missiles at Tel Aviv during the 1991 Gulf War. Two thirds of the $900 million bill is now being paid by Germany (Israeli military sources said that Germany decided to do this as compensation for the role of German companies in developing Iraqi chemical weapons).

Over the last eighteen months the Israeli navy has also purchased new Sa'ar V missile corvettes and upgraded its Sa'ar 4.5 NIRIT-class fast attack craft.⁴

  ¹ "State-of-the-Art Submarines Added to Israel's Naval Arsenal," Jewish Telegraphic Agency, 28 July 1999.
  ² Although Egypt has recently upgraded its R-class Romeos and purchased two former Royal Dutch Navy Zwaardvis-class submarines, both are outclassed by the high-tech equipment of Israel's new ships.
  ³ "The Defense Ministry's Elder Statesman," Ha'aretz, 3 August 1999 .
  ⁴ "Navy Force: Vital Future," Janes Defense Weekly, 3 February 1999.

http://www.meib.org/issues/9908.htm

[12B]

Babcock Borsig sold the HDW shipyards to Bank One last year. It's an American operation now. We pulled the move so we could wash sales of subs to the Taiwanese.

[Rain-maker]

 

[Non-Sequitur]

In light of the high cost of the deal - some $850 million - Israel is looking for outside funding for the project.

Translation: Just forward the bill on to my Uncle Samuel. He'll pay it.

[Happy2BMe]

"Far and away the most important feature of the new subs, however, is that they can be outfitted to launch small cruise missiles carrying nuclear weapons."

How many years till Armageddon would you say?

[Happy2BMe]

"Given that Germany really should have been broken up by the allies after the war and her people scattered to the four winds she has gotten off very lightly."

It is coming back to haunt us - - Schroeder's nationalism would have fit in nicely with Hitler's ideaologies.

[AppyPappy]

Geez, chill out. He just posted an article.

[AppyPappy]

Try Taiwan.

[Non-Sequitur]

How come that you people only ever complain about money given to Israel?

Why should Israel have open access to the U.S. checkbook, or any other countries for that matter? They are already the single largest recipient of U.S. aid, and the most consistent requester for additional U.S. funds. So I think Israel should be questioned in this case and I would be complaining just as loud if Egypt or the Palestinians made the request.

Never do we hear a peep out of you about the countless billions given to other nations, not to mention the blood that has been spilled in their defence.

I assure you that if the French or Germans were making the request I'd be making a heck of a ruckus about it, given their recent actions.