When have millions of Europeans ever been wrong?

TownHall.com ^ | 2/18/03 | Dennis Prager

[AmericaUnited]

There were five beaches on D-Day the American contingent alone did NOT out number the rest fo the allies.

Well for you to try to minimize the role of the US in WWII makes you into a fool and an ignorant idiot.

[MadIvan]

If you knew your history you would be aware that Hitler came to power in a democracy.

Yes, and those millions who voted for him were wrong. That was my point, in case it escaped you.

Might I also point out that Roosevelt until Pearl Harbour had a policy of appeasement towards Hitler as well, the intention was to let Britain fall, let him march across Europe and then sign a peace deal with him.

I think you mean Joseph Kennedy. Roosevelt did sign the Lend Lease Act, to his credit.

So to use the twisted logic of lumping all poeple on a continent together, I would say millions mof American's were wrong to.

There is wrong, as in having a barmy fool like Joseph Kennedy as Ambassador to Britain. And there is wrong in which millions of people vote Nazi. Huge difference of wrong in both degree and kind.

Regards, Ivan

[kabar]

Check out this article by Robert Kagan: http://www.policyreview.org/JUN02/kagan.html

It is more on the mark. Agree Prager's analysis is a bit simplistic and off base.

[AmericaUnited]

Yea right, Europe is not Socialist. Gross ignorant post #2. Are you a comedian?

[tm22721]

doesn't really explain the Catholic Church's strong objection.

The Catholic Church is 'old Europe' and is dying in the US.

Millions of boomers were indoctrinated with Catholic propaganada in their youth. They now reject that hierarchy.

BUMP

[kabar]

And America practices laissez-faire capitalism. Yeah right. America is becoming more and more a social democracy along the lines of Europe. Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, a graduated, regressive tax system that redistributes wealth, government intervention in the marketplace to prevent monopolies, government welfare, unemployment compenstation, etc. On the horizon are prescription drug coverage and a host of other government programs regardless of who is in power.

In America we have creeping socialism. We will wind up at the same place as Europe, just get there a little slower.

[The Wizard]

do you really want the whole list

[MadIvan]

This is typical retrospective hindsight historical analysis. If you place yourself as a german in an historical context you would see that voting for Hitler was not seen as being wrong at the time. Nor was it seen as being wrong by anyone else in the world.

Piffle. There were plenty of people in Germany and elsewhere who knew Hitler was evil just on sight. No rational human being could accept the thesis that the Jews were the source of all evil. And that is the end of the discussion.

If one removes historical context then one can make all sorts of claims about a nation. You could do the same thing with America about the issue fo segreation and racism. It would be like me saying 'Because the Americans were racist in the past century and that was wrong they must therfore always be wrong'.

We're back to degrees and kind. Segregation meant people lived apart. Nazism meant liquidating anyone but the "master race". This is a huge stain on the history of Germany, far more indelible than segregation is on America. Nazism is also a phenomenon that could not occur in America. Or Britain for that matter. We had just as desperate economic problems as Germany in the 1930's, but the Fascists and Communists were confined to the docks of East London.

This is not to say that Germany are right in their current stance towards the US, but more to say that to use the argument 'they were wrong in the past therfore it stands to reason they would be wrong now' is nothing more than an example of intellectual laziness.

Get off your high horse, professor. The Germans and French are preaching, with insufferable arrogance, about their moral superiority. It would do well to remind them that their claims to it are a joke.

The reason that I escaped the point incidently was because I thought you were making the populist link with the whole 'appeasement' argument which everyone in the 1930s was guilty of, America included. However your actual reasoning is just as weak because it is making large retrospective judgement in order to make a present judgement.

Taking everything "in context" is a leftist view of history. Hitler freaked out even some Germans - it was very clear to thoughtful people like Winston Churchill that Hitler should be made dead immediately. Your thesis that people couldn't have known bettter because of the times in which they lived is the worst sort of nonsense, an excuse for something which should not have occured.

Ivan

[AmericaUnited]

You must an ivory tower academic or a closet comedian.

Here's a question for you...

Many European countries take 60-70% of their citizens wages as taxes. If they do not have/exert the big socialist control you claim, 1) What the hell are they doing with all of the money, and 2) Why are the citizens giving it to them? DUH!

[kabar]

Get off your high horse, professor. The Germans and French are preaching, with insufferable arrogance, about their moral superiority. It would do well to remind them that their claims to it are a joke.

Using your logic, let's just hope that no one reminds America about slavery when we preach human rights and the dignity of man.

[UncleSamUSA]

Excellent analysis by Prager. His focus in the short piece was on the opposition of Europe as a geo-political entity to the US, not on the Catholic Church as a religious entity to the idea of war. That is an entirely separate issue which is not addressed here.

But his analysis is very interesting. It appears that major anti-American feeling in the recent demonstrations in Europe (though not all) came from labor unions, the communist and left wing parties, and those socialists who fear America's huge economic and military power more than they fear Islamic terrorism. To them, Islam is just a bunch of terrorists, but America is the land of the Big Mac. And they fear the Big Mac more than they do suicide bombers. What a bunch.

[kabar]

The tax burden on Americans from federal, state, and local taxes (including FICA)is approaching 50 percent. If the Dems have their way, we will be getting to the 60 to 70 percent range soon enough. Just wait until Social Security goes bust in 2017 when we pay out more than we take in. We will either have to reduce benefits or raise taxes.

[PGalt]

Interesting discussion bump.