Posted on 12/11/2002 3:15:37 AM PST by WhiskeyPapa
Wow. Great stuff. Thanks.
Walt
President Lincoln wanted all men, everywhere, to be free.
That rankles the neo-rebs.
Walt
Anyway, it's just Wednesday, a little early for church.
Preach on, Walt, the choir appears to have been summoned.
I'd like to stay for church, but I have to get back to work, I've only got three more weeks of working for my own money, then after Jan 1, it's 5 months of giving it all to Uncle Sam!
Free at last, free at last...
Simply priceless. I see we have rdf's latest work of fiction up
Sure, Jefferson Davis said blacks were indespensible -- well he used the term "african slaves", but you know what he meant.
Walt
Wouldn't consideration of Lincoln as a preacher of the Holy Gospel be a step down from membership in the Holy Trinity?
Unlike 'some' people we know
With his background as one of eleven managers of the Illinois State Colonization Society elected in 1857, Lincoln brought with him ideas about colonization. He supported the separation of the races for several reasons. He believed that blacks were inferior to whites and therefore not entitled to live in the same society as whites. He also rationalized that the removal of the black laborers would create a market for white laborers. "Reduce the supply of black labor by colonizing the black laborer out of the country and by precisely so much you increase the demand for and wages of white labor." His basic motive, however, for his extensive efforts was to once again have a purely white America.Lincoln's Colonization Efforts
It's a magazine apparently written by young people in Illinois for young people in Illinois so you should be able to understand all the words Walt. I'm just suprised that they actually let some of the truth out in the land of lincoln. Documentation provided at the bottom of the articles
It's exactly how liberals act today. Act on the injustice as long as that action doesn't effect them. Your hero could do that considering the Black Codes in the north already in place banning blacks from living there. They would have to stay in the South, or if he had his way, be forced back onto boats and shipped somewhere. And probably not first class either. Sounds like a real humanitarian to me. Too bad Nobel wasn't around to give him a medal
As I've said a couple of times, I feel certain that if Lincoln could have ended sectional strife in the 1850's by colonizing blacks, he would gladly have done it. He was willing to do it as president also. He -never- suggested that anyone be forced out of the country.
I don't think you'll find a statement from Lincoln that indicates that blacks were inferior. That is Nazi-like disinformation. The most you will show in the record is Lincoln saying he desn't -know- if blacks are inferior. On the other hand, in a message to Congress in 1863, he said, "So far as tested, it is difficult to say they are not as good soldiers as any."
I wonder whether the blacks in 1860 (when Davis made the statement I quoted) would rather be slaves on Davis' plantation or transported to Central America to be free, as Lincoln posited? I feel certain they would have chosen the latter.
But Lincoln as white supremacist:
"For the newly freed and the newly enlisted black men who served in the Union army--in the end more than 179,000 of them---perhaps the greatest moment was when they they too, shared the experience of paying their respects, of marching past their presidents in their new uniforms, looking as smart and martial as any. On April 23, 1864, and again two days later, newly mustered black regiments in a division attached to the IX corps passed through Washington on their way to the Virginia front. They marched proudly down Pennsylvania Avenue, past Willard's Hotel, where Lincoln and their commander, Burnside stood on a balcony watching. When the six black regiments came in sight of the president they went wild, singing, cheering, dancing in the street while marching. As each unit passed they saluted, and he took off his hat in return, the same modest yet meaningful acknowledgement he gave his white soldiers. He looked old and worn to the men in the street, but they could not see the cheer in his breast as he witnessed the culmination of their long journey from slavery, and pondered, perhaps, what it had cost him to be part of it. Even when rain began to fall and Burnside suggested they step inside while the parade continued, Lincoln decided to stay outdoors. "If they can stand it," he said, "I guess I can."
--"Lincoln's Men" pp 163-64 by William C. Davis
Those six black regiments couldn't see it either.
Now, what I've shown in the past -- I guess you just skim my posts-- is President Lincoln, after his genuine efforts to colonize blacks failed, began to clear the way for equal rights for them.
On the former:
"When in March, and May and July 1862 I made earnest, and succcessive appeals to the border states...I suggested compensated emancipation; to which you replied you wished not to be taxed to buy negroes. But I had not asked you to be taxed to buy negroes, except in such way, as to save you from greater expense, to save the Union exclusively by other means. You dislike the emancipation proclamation; and perhaps, would have it retracted. You say it is unconstitutional--I think differently. I think the Constitution invests the commander in chief with the law of war, in time of war. "
And on the latter:
Private
General Hunter
Executive Mansion
Washington D.C. April 1, 1863
My dear Sir:
I am glad to see the accounts of your colored force at Jacksonville, Florida. I see the enemy are driving at them fiercely, as is to be expected. It is mportant to the enemy that such a force shall not take shape, and grow, and thrive, in the south; and in precisely the same proportion, it is important to us that it shall. Hence the utmost caution and viglilance is necessary on our part. The enemy will make extra efforts to destroy them; and we should do the same to perserve and increase them.
Yours truly
A. Lincoln
_________________________________________________________
Hon. Andrew Johnson
Executive Mansion,
My dear Sir:
Washington, March 26. 1863.
I am told you have at least thought of raising a negro military force. In my opinion the country now needs no specific thing so much as some man of your ability, and position, to go to this work. When I speak of your position, I mean that of an eminent citizen of a slave-state, and himself a slave- holder. The colored population is the great available and yet unavailed of, force for restoring the Union. The bare sight of fifty thousand armed, and drilled black soldiers on the banks of the Mississippi, would end the rebellion at once. And who doubts that we can present that sight, if we but take hold in earnest? If you have been thinking of it please do not dismiss the thought.
Yours truly --------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------
Hon Soc of War
Executive Mansion
Washington
July 21, 1863
My Dear Sir:
I desire that a renewed and vigorous effort be made to raise colored forces along the shores of the Missippi [sic]. Please consult the General-in-chief; and if it is perceived that any acceleration of the matter can be effected, let it be done. I think the evidence is nearly conclusive that Gen. Thomas is one of the best, if not the very best, instruments for this service.
Yours truly
[end]
If you --do-- read my posts I guess you walk into a lot of doors because you surely could anticipate seeing these letters again. They show clearly that President Lincoln, less than a year after being rebuffed in his attempts at colonization was seeking to expand equal rights to blacks.
It's no wonder, is it, that Frederick Douglass said:
"Viewed from the genuine abolition ground, Mr. Lincoln seemed tardy, cold, dull and indifferent; but measuring him by the sentiment of his country, a sentiment he was bound as a statesman to consult, he was swift, zealous, radical and determined."
You should try the original record and eschew white supremacist websites.
Walt
They would be caught between a rock and a hard place, wouldn't they bill? After all, every single southern state had laws forbidding free blacks from moving in. Most had laws restricting the manumission of blacks or forbidding it all together. One, Virginia, even had it in the state Constitution that a freed black had 12 months to leave the state or else they would be sold back into slavery. So I guess that in the unlikely event a black man was freed down south then they would have no place to go, except Michigan, New York, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Pennsylvania, Vermont...
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