Judge blocks Grazing on "Endangered Owl" Lands

Associated Press | Nov. 25, 2002 | Arther Rotstein

[Chancellor Palpatine]

I have nothing against ranchers. I have everything, however, against whining about entitlements. Nobody has a right to undermarket rates for grazing on publicly owned land.

[.38sw]

Link? Please? I've been searching Google, AP, every way I can think of since my first post on this thread, and it isn't coming up. Maybe I don't know how to do an effective search, but I can't find the article. Thanks.

[daylate-dollarshort]

I thiink that what was meant to be expressed is that the land is worthless except for grazing. Just my interpetation.

[BOBTHENAILER]

Nobody has a right to undermarket rates for grazing on publicly owned land.

I think the ranchers who have naturally grazed these lands for decades should be deeded the acreage for "use and improvement".

That way you wouldn't have to waste your tax dollars on frivolous lawsuits brought by taxpayer funded, legally immune, enviro-nazis.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Free land to squatters, eh?

[saminfl]

Let the market for land decide what the price of grazing rights will be.

The market really has determined what the price will be. There is probably no other use for that land other than grazing. If the ranchers can't use it, no one else will pay the government for use of the land and the government loses out on that money. It isn't subsidizing the ranchers, it is the fact that the government is getting something for which there would be no other use. The public benefits from lower beef prices.

I absolutely despise all you green A@@holes.

[Consort]

Hoot Gibson
...I wonder what old Hoot would say about this.

[Centurion2000]

TUCSON, Ariz. (November 25, 2002 10:42 p.m. EST) - A federal judge has issued an injunction that could temporarily ban cattle grazing on huge swaths of national forest land identified as nesting and foraging sites for the endangered Mexican spotted owl

Owls nest in TREES ... how many cattle do you know that eat wood ?? Bunch of moron judges.

[VMI70]

"I agree. The market should determine the cost of grazing."

Correct but there are impediments to the market like this decision and the thousands like it. Furthermore, they change so often (read increasingly restrictive), that it is well nigh impossible to "determine the cost of grazing"

"Get the government out of it."

Amen, but you are in fantasy land if you think that will ever happen.


"Put the land in private hands and let the market determine the cost of grazing. It's that simple."

Again correct, but in reality, it won't happen. Even if the land were in private hands, the government rulings as cited in this thread, obviate a free market for beef. Ergo, we would all become vegetarians.

Your premise is spot on, but it won't happen until after the next revolution.

[VMI70]

See #36

[Chancellor Palpatine]

Oh? If a guy decided he didn't want to run his own cattle anymore, and just wanted to lease out grazing rights, you're telling me that he charges the same as BLM grazing rates? Riiiiiiiight.

And I ain't a green.

[.38sw]

I still can't find the story, as no link is provided. Can anybody help? I apologize if I'm an internet moron. but I'd really like a link to the story. Thanks.

[sasquatch]

Free land to squatters, eh?

On March 30, 1867, the two parties agreed
that the United States would pay Russia $7.2 million for the
territory of Alaska. For less than 2 cents an acre, the United
States acquired nearly 600,000 square miles.

So, there is no private property in Alaska?

[BOBTHENAILER]

Free land to squatters, eh?

Yeah, why not? Better them that uses it than those mother@@#$%$ that want it permanently off limits.

What you and those that support the enviro-nazi agenda don't realize, is that the cost of your way of life goes up every time one of these taxpayer funded lawsuits hits the courts.

Then again, you probably don't care.

[daylate-dollarshort]

Check Newsday, Tucson Citizen, ABC News, The Guardian or do a Google News search for grazing. The links are there.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

I'm talking about now, not then.

You won't get any argument from me that the BLM portfolio needs to be opened up and land sold, but so long as Uncle Sugar owns it, Congress, like any landlord, makes the rules. With the subsidy (which I disagree with in principle) comes the conditions.

[daylate-dollarshort]

If "a guy" doesn't run his cattle the rights are put out for bid. He can't sublet his grazing rights.

[Chancellor Palpatine]

I was talking about leasing out grazing rights on his own land, not subletting.

[freepersup]

ANWR caribou tastes like Mexican spotted owl- delicious !

[.38sw]

Thanks for the help. I had done a search on AP, where the posted story said it originated from, and also a google search and several other news sits, but not on google news. I find another source for the same event (which is fine, I can use it), but not the one posted. It's only polite to provide a link to a story that you post.