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Lieberman Calls for Sweeping, Reaganesque Tax Cuts
NewsMax ^ | 10/22/02 | Limbacher

Posted on 10/22/2002 5:44:18 AM PDT by Tumbleweed_Connection

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To: Orion
I see you finally got around to admitting, who you voted for in 2000. At least you made the logical choice then by picking GW Bush. However, in less then two years, you've concluded that the Bush Presidency has been a disappointment. And from what I can ascertain, you base this on just about every issue of relative value, outside of "national security issues". I think you may have been under the spell of irrational exuberance, along with having a woefully inadequate comprehension of American politics.

There is absolutely no way that President Bush could have turned around the extensive level of liberal social policy, that has been entrenched in the federal bureaucracy, for the last seven decades. After all, unlike Reagan, Bush wasn't given a landslide victory, by way of an electoral mandate, to push through sweeping changes. But even after two huge victories by Reagan and some serious conservative policy changes to the income tax codes, deregulation of federal standards and huge increases in national defense spending, he couldn't break the back of the tax and spend mentality that has still has a stranglehold on the citizens of this great country.

Those individuals, who choose not to vote for conservative Republican's candidates and instead, give their vote to some third party candidate, are simply wasting that precious vote in the name of protest and nothing more. It's quite clear, these people have concluded, it's better to deny conservative Republicans a victory and allow liberal Democrats even more opportunity to advance a leftwing policy, that further takes America down the wrong road. It's my opinion, that these people have reached such conclusions, based on emotional wrongheadedness and not on anything that resembles a fair minded intellectual process. This cycle has to be broken, once and for all.

Well, third parties have been notoriously unsuccessful; they usually wind up dividing the very people that should be united. And then we elect the wrong kind-the side we're out to defeat wins.
Ronald Reagan, 1975

121 posted on 10/24/2002 11:01:55 AM PDT by Reagan Man
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To: Mudboy Slim
Okay then, how 'bout "The Most Conservative POTUS since Eisenhower, excluding Reagan"...does that carry any water with you?!

Same difference, different timeline.

Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Bush episode I - The Spineless Meanace, The UNIBANGER, Bush episode II - Attack of the Immigrants.

We have had one conservative since the Pubbies lost it all the last time the economy went T-U. GWB isn't he.

122 posted on 10/24/2002 2:52:51 PM PDT by Orion
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To: rdb3
You need your face stomped. Badly.

First question: Why do I need my face stomped?

Second question: How does your post square with JimRob's position on personal attacks and advocating violence in your posts?

123 posted on 10/24/2002 2:56:02 PM PDT by Orion
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To: Orion
You need your face stomped. Badly.
124 posted on 10/24/2002 2:56:57 PM PDT by rdb3
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To: mhking
urban breeders

OK, for clarification...
Urban refers to the general urban culture that dominates the so-called "blue zones" in the USA. These are big city dwellers, and generally have a very socialist, big-gov't view of society. The urban culture is distinct and in opposition to the culture which, in theory, is a safehaven for freedom, American Heritage, and a law-abiding way of life.

Most cities are an absolute hell-hole of crime and dependancy. I didn't think this would be a stretch - perhaps I was wrong.

Breeders refers to someone who reproduces themselves with no regard for the maintenance and upkeep of their offspring. The word is intended to be a pejorative. Typically, this would refer to those women who have several children, by different inseminators, and in many cases can not differentiate among the many inseminators as to the correct parentage of their many children.

The second part of the sentance refers to "the payroll." The context correctly suggests that it is the government's payroll.

Everyone has a job. I fly airplanes around the US and, in return, receive a sum of money for that effort. If I don't fly, the money stops. The same government once paid me to fly naval aircraft around the Atlantic Ocean.

That government pays these "urban breeders" to have more children, especially without the financial benefit of a stable father. The more unstable the father figure, and the more kids the woman has, the more money she receives from Uncle Sugar. Her job is to breed in a fashion found typically in the urban areas of the USA. If she lost all her kids, or had a husband with a stable source of income, she would be terminated from the gov't payroll.

Our gov't spend big bucks on this program. It must be important.

There are also "rural breeders." The same can be said for them. "Urban breeders" encapsulates the hopeless government policy of welfare dependancy, whereas "rural breeders" is not as immediately obvious as to my intention. You may feel free to substitute "rural breeders" anytime you wish.

I hope this clears this matter for you.

125 posted on 10/24/2002 3:15:50 PM PDT by Orion
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To: rdb3
Orion's question:
Why do I need my face stomped?

rdb3's response:

You need your face stomped. Badly.

Your ability to follow a line of questioning really speaks quite well of you. No wonder you graduated cum laude.

I ask again:

Why do I need my face stomped?Was it something I said?

Could you elaborate on what it means to be a "Regenerate Christian?" Is that the Christianity where you advocate personal, felonious violence against someone with whom you have an honest disagreement? Just curious...

126 posted on 10/24/2002 3:26:21 PM PDT by Orion
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To: Orion
The only answer you deserve is that you need your face stomped.

That "urban breeders" comment of yours... Very classy.

Wanna play? Let's go.

127 posted on 10/24/2002 3:32:32 PM PDT by rdb3
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To: Orion
I hope this clears this matter for you.

It does - I find I'm in disagreement with your assessment; and that many would find almost personal affront with your descriptions. And that includes both urban and rural dwellers.

Certainly there are many urban residents who are Democrats, but to refer to them that way - with a single broad brushstroke - is just plain wrong, and there are plenty of folks who would offer examples of the fallacy of your statement.

128 posted on 10/24/2002 4:39:54 PM PDT by mhking
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To: rdb3
OK, tough guy...
Tell me, Mr. Cum Laude, what is the intellectual reason that violence is advocated in a post on FR?

Did I hit too close to home with the "urban breeder" comment? The dog who yelps is the one that got hit.

Tell me, regenerated Christian, why do I need to have my face stomped? This is my third request for an answer to a very simple question. Then again, I may not grasp your level of sophistication in matters related to simple interrogatives.

I stand by my characterization of our welfare state as the FEDGOV's urban breeder program. That is what Congress is paying people to do. People have noticed.

129 posted on 10/24/2002 6:19:49 PM PDT by Orion
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To: Tumbleweed_Connection
How can Joe Lieberman call for a "sales tax holiday" when a federal law on that would break the 9th and 10th amendments? The other stuff sounded even sillier.

Also, notice he wants to "take" the next rate cut of the "top 2%" and redirect it to "targeting business cuts"!

First, he's using the same old left wing bad math and class envy that assumes they are actually smart enough to forecast what a tax rate change does. As usual, they assume a lower rate "cost money" and he can find a figure and wants to "lose" that money elsewhere like in capital gains. The Democrats just don't get it do they?

Second, he thus makes the case that a lower tax rate on upper income earners does nothing for the economy when the majority of those incomes over $200,000 a year are S Corps small businesses that are taxed as individuals. So taking their tax rate cut away is more "corporate" welfare. And everyone knows, except Lieberman, that job growth in this country occurs more on the small business level than the big corporations!

Third, it's the typical left wing idea that they, the elite ones, can correctly pick and choose the winners and losers in the economy. If Lieberman and his ilk had been running things the last 50 years, computers would probably be non-existent because they wouldn't want to put all those slide rule manufacturers out of business!!!

Fourth, Lieberman's ideas are FAR from "Reaganesque", but it shows they are desparate!!!

It's obvious the Democrats don't even understand the free market...let's not let them mess it up!
130 posted on 10/24/2002 6:31:20 PM PDT by Fledermaus
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To: mhking
Where is the disagreement? Is not the highest concentration of welfare dependancy in the urban areas? Is this not characterized by a mind boggling illegitimacy rate?

Did I say all urbanites are in the program? Check again.

I never mentioned party affiliation of those on "the payroll." I never said that everyone was on the payroll.

Please reread the posts. You are disputing claims that I did not make.

Yes, urban breeders is supposed to be offensive. Congress has set up a hellish agency of 105,000 agents to extort money from my family. If I protest, I go to prison, where I get to live with the inseminators I previously mentioned. If I attempt to defend myself in court, I get a $25K fine. The bulk of this money goes to welfare bums, and related programs.

Now, about personal affronts...

131 posted on 10/24/2002 6:32:07 PM PDT by Orion
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To: sphinx
Please sphinx....don't even say National Sales Tax to me! ewwwwwwww

If you think the income tax code is long, cumbersome, confusing and political...just wait until politicians get ahold of the sales tax codes! If your state has a sales tax, go get it's codes and try to make sense of them.

At least with an income tax, they argue about income. If we had a national sales tax, politicians would spend the rest of their lives fighting for what should or shouldn't be included in a national retail sales tax.

First, groceries and medicine would be exempt. Then they'd start identifying all groceries to at least get some sales tax from the "rich" by taxing champagne and fancy restaurants higher than beer and McDonalds.

The feminists will demand all monthly female hygeine products be exempt. The Black Caucas would demand hair care products be exempt (they've tried this in states). Then there is the "poor"... so they'll still want to collect income information to give the "poor" a caclulated (like the Social Security farce) rebate.

Believe me, I've been through enough sales tax audits to know the government isn't even sure what's in their tax codes.

But, I would go for a consumption tax based on yearly income - savings and investments x a rate.
132 posted on 10/24/2002 6:44:14 PM PDT by Fledermaus
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To: churchillbuff
WHY ISN'T BUSH PROPOSING THIS??????? LIEBERMAN IS TALKING MORE TO MY LIKING THAN OUR COMPASSIONATE CONSERVATIVE PREISDENT>

Simple...if Bush proposed it, Joe Lieberman would be the first Democrat out of the gate to call it "tax breaks for the rich".

Bush doesn't have to propose it...let Lieberman go on record with the idea. Then when they lost the Senate, see if he supports the idea again. He won't.

This a pure political move to make the Dems look good to the independents they know they are losing in droves. It's a "me too" play. This shows their desparation, not the lack of GOP ideas!

Polls are showing that even with the "economy" getting back to the #1 concern, the voters trust the Republicans more than the Democrats to do something about it. And Daschle was first to set the agenda with "increase the minimum wage and extend unemployment benefits"! Whoopie!

133 posted on 10/24/2002 6:54:33 PM PDT by Fledermaus
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To: churchillbuff
Leave it to freepers to be reflexively Republican. You folks are criticizing Lieberman for CALLING FOR TAX CUTS - - - but Bush is SILENT ON TAX CUTS and you give him a pass. Talk about topsy turvey.

Wrong totally. We just know bovine excrement when we hear it!

I bet you belived Clinton when he pounded the podium and said, "I didn't have sex with that woman..................Miss Lewinsky."

134 posted on 10/24/2002 6:56:16 PM PDT by Fledermaus
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To: Orion
Hey Orion...of course Reagan's tax rate cuts were huge (they are not tax cuts....the treasury received more money) because he took the top marginal rate from 70% to 33%. You can't get "huge rate cuts" going from 39.6% to 35%...and the Democrats whined and cried about that!!

135 posted on 10/24/2002 7:00:32 PM PDT by Fledermaus
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To: Fledermaus
I'd go for a consumed income tax along the lines you suggest (tax base=gross income minus savings and investment). IIRC, Pete Dominici was beating this drum 15 years ago. Never got much traction though.
136 posted on 10/24/2002 7:06:19 PM PDT by sphinx
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To: Fledermaus
I believe we are in agreement. Why the top rate is as high as it is makes me think that GWB's cut was just arm waiving.
137 posted on 10/24/2002 7:07:25 PM PDT by Orion
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To: Orion
Look, it's a political thing. I Bush had proposed a bigger, faster rate cut...he never would have gotten the 16 Senate Dems vote!

In this case, I think something is better than nothing. Dole/Kemp couldn't get any traction out of the 15% across the board cut!

But I will stipulate that neither party stops the wasteful spending. There is no real reason the federal government spends $2 Trillion a year!
138 posted on 10/24/2002 7:16:12 PM PDT by Fledermaus
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