How Reliable Is Ballistic Fingerprinting?

FoxNews.com ^ | 10/18/2002 | Steven Milloy

[JackIV]

Any more great ideas from the anti-gin, anti-Constitution "Brady Bunch"???

[Puppage]

ballistic fingerprinting would have "solved this crime after the first shooting."

There has not been ONE crime solved, or a conviction, in which a firearm was used and "fingerprinting" was used. Yet, another "feel good" law that does NOTHING. We don't even need a firearm to protect ourselves....the DC Police just tell you to walk briskly, and zig zag. I am at a loss for words. AND SHEEPLE BELIEVE THIS!!

[nina0113]

Anyone taking bets on whether the NYT & Washington Post pick up this story?

[joesnuffy]

How convienent of the belt way sniper to show up just in time for the fall elections...probably the most important election in US history...at a time when war on the horizon and a man, the public judges as competent, is popular and in the white house. This in spite of everything the dems and their media whores scream to the contrary....

The killers provide the dems with an soap box..hoping to steal the election the dems and the media begin a desperate attempt to convince the people that they should disarm...

Hopefully they wont do it the way they did in the Randy Weaver household child and wife sniping , The great Branch Dividian child barbeque, or the Elian Gonzalez free trip to Disneyland with a long stopover in Havana

Anyway in the middle of a terrorists killing spree....the Dems begin to rant and rave about balistic fingerprinting...a thing that changes as much from target shooting and cleaning as it does from deliberate obsfucation..A few abrasive rounds from "fire polishing" and the barrel sig changes..from many rounds fired the extactor, ejector, and firing pin marks change...making the whole notion of "Ballistic Fingerprinting" completely useless and irresponsible spending...

However if the agenda is to register every firearm (which is against the law) then its a great way to do that...and when and IF the dems ever get the absolute power they crave..gun owners can kiss their God given right to self defense and family defense down the drown..
The dems are about emasculation ...they are the party of that...in fact it should be their new bumper sticker..imo of course

[WorkingClassFilth]

Do any rifle shooters or gunsmiths out there know what the effects of lapping barrels does to microscopic irregularities?

I had a distant relative that used to use a sequential lubricant/abrasive compound to polish the irregularities on the lands and grooves of rifle barrels. Claimed he got much better performance. I don't know about that, but average wear should change an awful lot of the striations in the 'fingerprinting' huh?

Does anyone have any specialized or trade knowledge about these practices?

[longtermmemmory]

so I conclude the following:

Gun stores will sell 50 cent files.

There is no way a year(s) old test will pass reasonable doubt in a court of law.

All balistic tests in court are generally, and mostly for guns which have been found quickly after the crime was committed. In other words, crime committed and gun disposed before firing again.

Thanks to the media, now every criminal has been busy with a file altering the balistic fingerprint of crime guns in their possesion.

[dirtboy]

Any more great ideas from the anti-gin, anti-Constitution "Brady Bunch"???

The Brady Borg does not care if the process works to combat crime. They are looking for ANY backdoor method to create a national gun registry.

In fact, to the Brady Borg, it's probably better if a program is worthless, because then they can come back next year and state that ballistic fingerprinting simply isn't enough to stop gun crime, we need to get all guns registered. And when that doesn't stop gun crime, they'll come back the next year and say we need to confiscate registered handguns. And when that doesn't stop gun crime and then some whackjob uses a hunting rifle to kill a couple of schoolkids, they'll come back the next year and say we need to take all hunting weapons and store them at gun clubs. And so it goes, ad infinitum.

That is why Brady Borg proposals never make sense. They're not supposed to...

[South Dakota]

I suggest that its not about crime solving as it is about finding out who has the guns and keeping a record of it for later confiscation

[concerned about politics]

"Firearms that generate markings on cartridge casings can change with use and can also be readily altered by the users," said the experts. "They are not permanently defined like fingerprints or DNA."

Someone pulled up an article the other day that said if you just change to another ammo supplier, all testing is irrelivant. Everything changes.

[concerned about politics]

With cartridges from different manufacturers, computer matching failed 62 percent of the time.

opps.

[tet68]

It's getting all that icky ink off my bullets that I don't like. Oh and infringing on my constitutional rights !!

[concerned about politics]

the DC Police just tell you to walk briskly, and zig zag. I am at a loss for words. AND SHEEPLE BELIEVE THIS!!

And arm yourself with a pen and paper! In other words, keep an eye out for dead people, and write down information to protect yourself.

[scooter2]

Any more great ideas from the anti-gin, anti-Constitution "Brady Bunch"???

Anti-gin? You mean they're against martinis too?

[concerned about politics]

The killers provide the dems with an soap box..hoping to steal the election the dems and the media begin a desperate attempt to convince the people that they should disarm...

There was a poll on CNN yesterday. "Do you feel safer now than you did before 9/11?"
Most voted "no." And they're dumb Democrats, too.
I think people are still frightened, and those soccer moms and honest citizens who armed themselves after 9/11 felt the need for it. I really don't think they're ready to trust the government to protect them. Look at the DC shooter, for example. I'll bet those who own self defence weapons bought fresh ammo, just in case.
They're going for finger printing because disarming wouldn't work in this country right now. I hope it backfires at the polls.

[longtermmemmory]

It assumes guilt before innocents in violation of the bill of rights. It is not even a "gun" issue. Why not just DNA and Figerprint every single person born at birth? How about travel papers? Mandadory Lojacking (ala demolition man)?

This is about killing rugged individualism. This is not about big brother, this is big mommy.

[longtermmemmory]

translation: we can't stop these people/person. We have to wait for another death and hope to have citizens help.

Translation translation: Government can't protect you.

[tacticalogic]

In fact, to the Brady Borg, it's probably better if a program is worthless, because then they can come back next year and state that ballistic fingerprinting simply isn't enough to stop gun crime, we need to get all guns registered. And when that doesn't stop gun crime, they'll come back the next year and say we need to confiscate registered handguns. And when that doesn't stop gun crime and then some whackjob uses a hunting rifle to kill a couple of schoolkids, they'll come back the next year and say we need to take all hunting weapons and store them at gun clubs. And so it goes, ad infinitum.

The ballistic registry may be the holy grail of the gun grabbers, precisely because it is flawed. I think they'll try to keep the problems downplayed until the program is in place. Once the database is established, then they'll bring up the issues with potential changes in the ballistic fingerprint due to wear, maintenance, or intentional alteration. The solution will be to have the guns re-tested at intervals to keep the database current, at the owner's expense. Their strategy is to get around the second amendment by simply making gun ownership too expensive and troublesome for the average person.

[concerned about politics]

translation: we can't stop these people/person. We have to wait for another death and hope to have citizens help.
Translation translation: Government can't protect you.

Exactly. So, behind the political spin, how many citizens would be willing to be disarmed, or have their ability to arm themselves be taken away.
Right now, I think maybe the Dems are spinning their own hanging rope. Let's hope so.

[Redbob]

"There is no way a year(s) old test will pass reasonable doubt in a court of law."

OK everybody, listen up, because I'm only going to say this once (today):

This is not about evidence, or courts of law,
nor is it about 'ballistic fingerprinting' -
it is ONLY about creating a national database of gunowners!

Having failed miserably in their previous efforts at gun registration, the Brady Bunch is trying another tack.

I just hope they convince a few of their lapdog dimocrats to use this as a campaign issue!
We need something to galvanize gunowners and get them ALL out to vote.

[concerned about politics]

We need something to galvanize gunowners and get them ALL out to vote.

The 2000 election ( for the right wing) was aided by the Democrats and their anti-arms propaganda. The gun issue may have won us the election.
Now after 9/11, how many more have joined our side on this issue? The "self-defence" issue is on our side. Terrorists could be living right next door.