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School Board Panel: Ohio Students Should Be Taught Evolution, Controversies That Surround It
Associated Press / ABC ^

Posted on 10/14/2002 4:59:49 PM PDT by RCW2001

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To: gore3000
AND YOU WERE SHOWN AGAIN THAT YOU WERE WRONG

I was not wrong. You have quoted others out of context dishonestly.
401 posted on 10/19/2002 8:58:53 PM PDT by Dimensio
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To: gore3000
PROVE ME A LIAR.

Okay. I made a comment here stating that evolution as defined by 'change in alelle frequency over time' is a fact as much as rain is 'liquid H2O precipitation from water vapour in the sky' (your claiming that 'change in alelle frequency over time' is not the fundamental definition of the word -- not the theory -- does not alter the fact that it is true). You quoted only a portion of my text here but snipped all explanation so that you could make a smug comment as though my comment were on the theory of common descent and not the fundamental definition of the word 'evolution'.
402 posted on 10/19/2002 9:03:12 PM PDT by Dimensio
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To: gore3000
Its explained very simply by the survival of the fittest. Each has developed its own methods of survival and reproduction.

And, it sounds like the Fogu fish explains man. I wasn't aware of the genetic similarities you describe but that would appear to be a fairly strong prima facie case that man descended from water dwelling creatures.

403 posted on 10/19/2002 11:56:07 PM PDT by DaGman
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To: DaGman
Its explained very simply by the survival of the fittest.

No it does not. Selection does not create anything, we need creation here to account for these species and there is no way they could have come about by gradual descent from other species. Let's hear how it happened, you can 't just wave a magic wand and say abracadabra-shazam evolve.

And, it sounds like the Fogu fish explains man. I wasn't aware of the genetic similarities you describe but that would appear to be a fairly strong prima facie case that man descended from water dwelling creatures.

The point is that a creature supposedly so far removed from us has genes which are so like ours. If evolution were true, that would be impossible. Such similarity can only be due to intelligent design.

404 posted on 10/20/2002 12:24:41 AM PDT by gore3000
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To: Dimensio
your claiming that 'change in alelle frequency over time' is not the fundamental definition of the word -- not the theory -- does not alter the fact that it is true).

Playing stupid word games. That is not the definition of the theory of evolution. Period, paragraph, end of story. Because something is true does not mean it is evolution. Get that through your head.

405 posted on 10/20/2002 12:40:50 AM PDT by gore3000
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To: Dimensio
I was not wrong. You have quoted others out of context dishonestly.

Repeating two lies endlessly. You were proved wrong and you have not shown me to be a liar about anything. Do not ascribe to others your own lack of morals.

406 posted on 10/20/2002 12:42:39 AM PDT by gore3000
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To: gore3000
That is not the definition of the theory of evolution.

No, but that is a definition of the word 'evolution', which I explained within the context of my posting. You, however, eliminated that context and pretended that I was talking about something else. That's called lying.

Pretending that 'change in alelle frequency over time' is a definition of the word 'evolution' does not make it so.
407 posted on 10/20/2002 12:54:32 AM PDT by Dimensio
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To: Dimensio; gore3000
Erk. That should be ' Pretending that 'change in alelle frequency over time' is NOT a definition of the word 'evolution' does not make it so.
408 posted on 10/20/2002 12:55:13 AM PDT by Dimensio
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To: PatrickHenry
Placemarker.
409 posted on 10/20/2002 4:21:32 AM PDT by PatrickHenry
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To: gore3000
PROVE ME A LIAR.

"A circle is not an ellipse."
"1720 is a very big number.
"Strong evidence = absolute proof."
Various quotes taken out of context...

410 posted on 10/20/2002 7:20:04 AM PDT by Junior
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To: gore3000
PROVE ME A LIAR.

"A circle is not an ellipse."
"1720 is a very big number.
"Strong evidence = absolute proof."
Various quotes taken out of context...

411 posted on 10/20/2002 7:20:27 AM PDT by Junior
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To: Dimensio
No, but that is a definition of the word 'evolution',

Sounds to me like rhetorical deceit then. Nevertheless it is not a definition of the word evolution either. Change is not evolution. Because each parent gives half their alleles to a progeny, with each birth there is a change in the mix of alleles in a population. This does not create new information, this does not change a species into another. That definition of evolution (from the fountain of evolutionist half-truths - TalkOrigins) is therefore false. It is not evolution at all. Now for the definition of the Theory of Evolution, here it is below in the very words of the great charlatan:

"It is interesting to contemplate an entangled bank, clothed with many plants of many kinds, with birds singing on the bushes, with various insects flitting about, and with worms crawling through the damp earth, and to reflect that these elaborately constructed forms, so different from each other, and dependent on each other in so complex a manner, have all been produced by laws acting around us. These laws, taken in the largest sense, being Growth with Reproduction; Inheritance which is almost implied by reproduction; Variability from the indirect and direct action of the external conditions of life, and from use and disuse;. a Ratio of Increase so high as to lead to a Struggle for Life, and as a consequence to Natural Selection, entailing Divergence of Character and the Extinction of less-improved forms. Thus, from the war of nature, from famine and death, the most exalted object which we are capable of conceiving, namely, the production of the higher animals, directly follows evolution."
From: Charles Darwin, "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life"

412 posted on 10/20/2002 7:51:37 AM PDT by gore3000
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To: Junior
Various quotes taken out of context...

Which of course, with you being a sliming liar you cannot tell which they are or discuss them honestly.

413 posted on 10/20/2002 7:54:35 AM PDT by gore3000
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To: gore3000
Your out-of-context quotes have been posted time-and-again. Posting them again would probably be as productive as the last 500 times they've been posted.
414 posted on 10/20/2002 8:11:04 AM PDT by Junior
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To: DaGman
And, it sounds like the Fogu fish explains man. I wasn't aware of the genetic similarities you describe but that would appear to be a fairly strong prima facie case that man descended from water dwelling creatures.

You've been caught up in one of Anti-Pope GoreMMM the Intolerant's little fantasies which is based on his misreading and misinterpreting of past news releases. There is no significant relationship between the fugu fish and man. However, both species have had DNA samples sequenced which gives researchers an abiity of compare the two and look for analogous genes. Since the fugu genetics are relatively compact and identifiable, this has lead to tentative identification of "similar" genes in humans.

I suggest you treat each claim from the Anti-Pope as utter horsesh!t until or unless you can verify it yourself. Fortunately, this is only rarely more difficult than doing a quick internet search on Google.com. Try it with the fugu fish and genetics and you'll soon know a great deal more about the subject than the Intolerant One.

415 posted on 10/20/2002 9:40:04 AM PDT by balrog666
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To: Junior
Your out-of-context quotes have been posted time-and-again.

With you evos, the proof is always somewhere else where no one can see it. All you slimers can do is lie about people you can never discuss the facts. Let's see you show an 'out of context quote' from me. I do not cut anything off from the quotes and I almost always post a link to the whole article. You are just a sliming liar. You cannot refute my evidence so all you can do is attack the messenger.

416 posted on 10/20/2002 10:34:38 AM PDT by gore3000
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To: gore3000
Sounds to me like rhetorical deceit then.

It might have been if I hadn't explained it within the context of my message. However, I did explain it within the context of my message. You, however, cut out that explanation and pretended that I never made it so that you could criticize me for making a point that I never made. That is called lying.

Nevertheless it is not a definition of the word evolution either.

People who know what they are talking about say differently. Don't like that it is a definition? Don't like that the basic definition of the word 'evolution' is 'change in allele frequency over time'? Feel a need to insist that the definition also include something about the change driving a change within the species even though such a qualifier is not in the definition? Too bad. Your not wanting it to be a definition because it prevents you from scoring points isn't my problem and it isn't the problem of the people who have established that definition.
417 posted on 10/20/2002 12:01:44 PM PDT by Dimensio
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To: Dimensio
People who know what they are talking about say differently. Don't like that it is a definition?

Well they don't know what they are talking about if they limit the definition of evolution to "'evolution' is 'change in allele frequency over time'". That is a weasel definition used by Darwininians whenever some of their more preposterous examples of evolution are questioned. Any non-cloned parents having a child will produce a change in allele frequency over time.

What is Evolution?

Most non-scientists seem to be quite confused about precise definitions of biological evolution. Such confusion is due in large part to the inability of scientists to communicate effectively to the general public and also to confusion among scientists themselves about how to define such an important term.

418 posted on 10/20/2002 2:41:31 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: PatrickHenry
Placemarker.
419 posted on 10/20/2002 6:55:27 PM PDT by PatrickHenry
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To: Junior
Your out-of-context quotes have been posted time-and-again.

Bait and switch, man. Don't fall for it. Those are his words. He knows it, but he sidesteps and evades responsibility for them by complaining that you don't have a link to the original post. Nevertheless, he does not deny that he posted them; changing the subject does not make documentation of his dishonesty go away.

Here is the link to start of the original wildly elliptical thread if any lurkers want to investigate the veracity of Junior's claims.

420 posted on 10/20/2002 9:53:07 PM PDT by Condorman
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